Who is to blame for the demise of traditional marriage

[Renegade]

Oh and as someone more sympathetic than most towards feminism, I'd say feminism did contribute to the decline of traditional marriage. An dthat is, IMO, a Good Thing.

For once, I'm with you BD. We should all celebrate the decline of "Traditional" marriage which bound parties into rigid roles.

[Frankie]

Oh and as someone more sympathetic than most towards feminism, I'd say feminism did contribute to the decline of traditional marriage. An dthat is, IMO, a Good Thing.

For once, I'm with you BD. We should all celebrate the decline of "Traditional" marriage which bound parties into rigid roles.

"Bound parties into rigid roles" can be translated into, "bound parties into thier duties and responsibilities." Which is what your actually doing when you enter a marraige and which is something modern society can benefit by practicing more. I wouldn't call it "bound" though, because when entering into a marriage willingly you should be expecting to enter into a role. Is that a limitation of freedom? I guess everyone has a different meaning of freedom.

Freedom for me is not just "You ought to do what you want to", but "Wanting to do what you ought to".

[Renegade]

"Bound parties into rigid roles" can be translated into, "bound parties into thier duties and responsibilities." Which is what your actually doing when you enter a marraige and which is something modern society can benefit by practicing more. I wouldn't call it "bound" though, because when entering into a marriage willingly you should be expecting to enter into a role. Is that a limitation of freedom? I guess everyone has a different meaning of freedom.

Freedom for me is not just "You ought to do what you want to", but "Wanting to do what you ought to".

When I refer to "rigid roles", I mean rigid definitions of roles. In a "traditional" marriage, the husband's role was to be the breadwinner and "head of the household". The wife traditional role is as baby bearer, child sitter, and responsible for the maintainance of the house.

It is completely fine that two people agree to be bound into their duties and responsibilies for mutual benefit. You yourself have stated that you would be a stay-at-home dad. All of this is fine, but it isn't a "traditional marriage". It is a modern marriage, and the fact that we have become enligntened enough to have flexibility in the roles is a cause for celebration.

[Who's Doing What?]

Feminism took the women out of the home. So simple.

My calendar says it is 2007. Check yours.

WTF has the date got to do with anything.

If you can't see the connection between the womens movement and the collapse of "traditional Marriage" you are blind.

Go back to the suffrage movement when women fought for the right to vote. Or when they had to fight to be recognised as a "person" under the law. Then the second world war when the men were overseas and women filled the factories to do the same work men had done. (Did you know that many jobs were "de-skilled" because of this. The same job that was considered skilled labour when men were doing it was changed to unskilled labour so the companies wouldn't have to pay the women the same wages. ) These are the beginnings of the womens movement and the start of women leaving the tradional role in a traditional marrige. Not the 60's. Since then more women have entered the workforce or filed for divorce, or just not gotten married altogether. Did I spell it out clearly enough for you or do you need a map to go along with it?

So don't come at me like you have any understanding of what my view is on Feminism, or the Women's rights movement, because it is obvious you can't distinguish between simple observations and what someone thinks about a subject.

Smoking causes dimminished lung capacity. Can you tell me if I am a smoker or not from that statement?

So don't think that just because I can see the relation between feminism and Traditional marriage, you can read into my statement anything about my feelings on either subject.

[guyser]

If you can't see the connection between the womens movement and the collapse of "traditional Marriage" you are blind.

Go back to the suffrage movement when women fought for the right to vote. Or when they had to fight to be recognised as a "person" under the law. Then the second world war when the men were overseas and women filled the factories to do the same work men had done. (Did you know that many jobs were "de-skilled" because of this. The same job that was considered skilled labour when men were doing it was changed to unskilled labour so the companies wouldn't have to pay the women the same wages. ) These are the beginnings of the womens movement and the start of women leaving the tradional role in a traditional marrige. Not the 60's. Since then more women have entered the workforce or filed for divorce, or just not gotten married altogether. Did I spell it out clearly enough for you or do you need a map to go along with it?

So don't come at me like you have any understanding of what my view is on Feminism, or the Women's rights movement, because it is obvious you can't distinguish between simple observations and what someone thinks about a subject.

So don't think that just because I can see the relation between feminism and Traditional marriage, you can read into my statement anything about my feelings on either subject.

So by your post above should I assume you need to get angry before responding ?

You were asked twice .....................

"QUOTE(guyser @ Mar 7 2007, 06:40 PM)

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QUOTE(Who's Doing What? @ Mar 7 2007, 04:27 PM)

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I'm just saying that it is the main reason for the decline in traditional marriage. It is so obvious.

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All joking aside, if it is so obvious , tell me why then?

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Feminism took the women out of the home. So simple.

END QUOTE

I took it for a non-answer . Because I did not see an answer in there I jumped ahead and , wrongly I must say, assumed you were being facetious or obstinent.

I obviously stirred some bone in your body to respond in a thoughtful manner . And now that I have , and now that I have read your reponse it does make sense. In other words (ya know that "map" thing) I will agree with your assessment.

[Catchme]

There again was NO such thing as traditional marriage ever as a building block for canada, women who were the first pioneers here worked side by side with their husbands breaking the land and creating a homestead. They were not just doing household duties. Prairie women also had incomes from butter and eggs, there is a reason why women from the prairies fought long and hard for equal rights because they knew full well, they worked along side their husbands equally and were equally in measure.

BTW as I stated earlier our judicial system is derived from eRoman. Roman had 3 different types of marriages, one of them was those lving together as husband and wife. Seems like living together is a traditional marriage.

Also, to whomever said I was gay, get a grip. I am a self identified heterosexual, who has had a life long partner of going on 28 years. That he is my husband has no bearing on the matter, we are partners, in our life journey.

[Canadian Blue]

What is traditional marriage, their really isn't a concrete meaning. I'm sure at one time traditional marriage meant having 5 wives, along with dozens of concubines.

Actually, didn't some early Christian's refuse to take part in state recognized marriages.

[Catchme]

There is no definition of traditional marriage you are quite right, there has never been a constant tradition.

It would seem some are using the term "traditional marriage" as a euphemism for several things and all of them have to do with taking away women's rights.

Could one of you out there who want to take away women's rightsplease tell us, why you think women's tights should be taken away?

[sideshow]

I use a simple formula for marriage:

Treat my wife good.

Don't cheat on her.

Always put our love for eachother first.

These are easy things to do, and are fulfilling. Marriage was my lifelong vow of bonding. 16 years as a couple, almost 11 of marriage, and things are stronger than ever. Everything we have been through over the years has only made us stronger as a couple. But it takes hard work at times. Like anything else.

[gc1765]

Actually, I agree with Who's Doing What. Wives are not as financially dependent on their husbands as they were in the past, before equality in the workplace. It used to be that women stayed at home, while men worked. Now, more women are working and in the case of a divorce would have no problem making their own living.

Not that this is a bad thing....

[jbg]

I use a simple formula for marriage:

Treat my wife good.

Don't cheat on her.

Always put our love for eachother first.

These are easy things to do, and are fulfilling. Marriage was my lifelong vow of bonding. 16 years as a couple, almost 11 of marriage, and things are stronger than ever. Everything we have been through over the years has only made us stronger as a couple. But it takes hard work at times. Like anything else.

Those are reactionary, running dog, Zionist, imperialist, neo-colonialist values promoted by George W. Bush. No good Canadian would talk that way!!! </ sarcasm>

[Black Dog]

"Bound parties into rigid roles" can be translated into, "bound parties into thier duties and responsibilities."

That implies someone is setting those duties and responsibilities. So who's doing that?

Which is what your actually doing when you enter a marraige and which is something modern society can benefit by practicing more. I wouldn't call it "bound" though, because when entering into a marriage willingly you should be expecting to enter into a role.

Again: kinda depends on who's establishing the roles. If it's a mutually agreed upon decision, that's one thiong. But even then you have to look at the context. For example, someone choosing to enter a marriage based on "traditional" gender roles are merely chooosing a path set down by somebody else. I don't know if that can be said to be a free choice.

Freedom for me is not just "You ought to do what you want to", but "Wanting to do what you ought to".

Sounds like you're defering to somebody. Who?

[Frankie]

Your choice lies in the fact whether you choose that path or don't. Just because somebody or a society of humanity set down a path to follow, doesn't mean your not free by following it. I mean, if to you it seems right, then what's the problem? You gotta make your own path "just because" it makes you feel free? Even though the other path might be better for your situation. But then again, you have to do what works for you.

And I'm not sure where I got that quote, but those words are true to me.

[jbg]

And I'm not sure where I got that quote, but those words are true to me.

Which quote?

[mcqueen625]

I personally believe that they should throw the whole laws regarding marriage out, in today's society they have no practical use. I believe that in our country today traditional marriage no longer works and is pointless. Because lots of marriages turn out lousy, there is no point in having them in the first place.

Who pooped in your Corn Flakes? I have been married for 36 years and find nothing wrong with traditional marriage, but is something that requires continual discussion and compromise. Many young people today are too into themselves and it's all about what they want, so having to get along and compromise is just something many are not willing to do. Government also penalizes couples who are married by combining income. In many cases if people live together and not tell the government they are living as a couple they oftentimes qualify for such things as the GST Rebates, while those who are married are often do not qualify because of the government combining the two incomes.