Tie Domi and Belinda Stronach.

[August1991]

Most people say that Stronach crossing over to the Liberals and Emerson to the Conservatives was wrong, yet nothing has been done to prevent it happening again in the future. If Harper and the Conservatives were serious about cleaning up parliament, this would have been huge step in the right direction.

We have debated this elsewhere but if MPs are to have any independent authority and not merely be trained seals, then they must have the right to change party allegiance.

If crossing the floor were forbidden (say, by obliging a byelection), this would simply give more power to the party whips and the party leader. Do you really want such a centralization of power?

The real solution here is for voters to choose their MPs more carefully. If party loyalty is important, then vote for a candidate who is obviously loyal to the party. Bob Rae, Winston Churchill, Belinda Stronach, Jack Horner, John Connally, Pierre Trudeau, David Emerson and even Stephen Harper all changed parties at one point or another in their careers. Nevertheless, I feel safe in predicting that Stephen Harper will not join the NDP and Jack Layton will not join the Conservatives. So, what's the lesson? Get to know your candidate and vote accordingly.

[Wilber]

I don't think crossing the floor should be banned. There will be times when an MP cannot reconcile their own beliefs with their party's position on certain issues to a degree which will allow them to stay in that party. On the other hand they should expect to take a lot of heat for it.

[gc1765]

Most people say that Stronach crossing over to the Liberals and Emerson to the Conservatives was wrong, yet nothing has been done to prevent it happening again in the future. If Harper and the Conservatives were serious about cleaning up parliament, this would have been huge step in the right direction.

We have debated this elsewhere but if MPs are to have any independent authority and not merely be trained seals, then they must have the right to change party allegiance.

If crossing the floor were forbidden (say, by obliging a byelection), this would simply give more power to the party whips and the party leader. Do you really want such a centralization of power?

The real solution here is for voters to choose their MPs more carefully. If party loyalty is important, then vote for a candidate who is obviously loyal to the party. Bob Rae, Winston Churchill, Belinda Stronach, Jack Horner, John Connally, Pierre Trudeau, David Emerson and even Stephen Harper all changed parties at one point or another in their careers. Nevertheless, I feel safe in predicting that Stephen Harper will not join the NDP and Jack Layton will not join the Conservatives. So, what's the lesson? Get to know your candidate and vote accordingly.

I don't think crossing the floor should be banned. There will be times when an MP cannot reconcile their own beliefs with their party's position on certain issues to a degree which will allow them to stay in that party. On the other hand they should expect to take a lot of heat for it.

I agree that MPs should be allowed to cross the floor, but I think the best solution would be to not allow them to take a cabinet position (or even parliamentary secretary) until they run in a general election or a by-election. That would ensure that MPs are crosssing "for the right reason" rather than for personal gain. Emerson would not have crossed if this was the case. Would stronach have crossed? If she did not accept a cabinet position I don't think she would have gotten as much heat. I would have no problem with her switching if a cabinet post was not in the deal.

[gerryhatrick]

To be completely fair, the topic title is not accurate in that it's only an allegation that he offered his wife money to stay quiet.

It's only in her divorce papers. She's also gotten a restraining order against him. Is he a terrible, mean person, or is she a wingnut? We don't know.

The words "she claims" should be part of the title.

[Riverwind]

I agree that MPs should be allowed to cross the floor, but I think the best solution would be to not allow them to take a cabinet position (or even parliamentary secretary) until they run in a general election or a by-election.

Any MP can be in the cabinet no matter what their party affiliation. They do not need to 'cross the floor' to get a cabinet position if they make a deal with the PM. In practice, any MP that did that would be booted out of their party so MPs that cross the floor to always quit their party. If we put rules in place taht prevented MPs from doing certain things after quiting then you would see that MPs would use that loop hole to do what they want. The ballot box is the only place where floor crossers should be punished if that is what people want to do.

[gc1765]

I agree that MPs should be allowed to cross the floor, but I think the best solution would be to not allow them to take a cabinet position (or even parliamentary secretary) until they run in a general election or a by-election.

Any MP can be in the cabinet no matter what their party affiliation. They do not need to 'cross the floor' to get a cabinet position if they make a deal with the PM. In practice, any MP that did that would be booted out of their party so MPs that cross the floor to always quit their party. If we put rules in place taht prevented MPs from doing certain things after quiting then you would see that MPs would use that loop hole to do what they want. The ballot box is the only place where floor crossers should be punished if that is what people want to do.

I see your point, but there must be some solution. How about if an opposition MP wants to accept a cabinet position, he or she must get permission from their party. Then, they won't get kicked out. If at a later date the party decided they wanted to remove that person, they could either resign the cabinet position or run in a by-election. Ok, so it's not a great solution but it's something. Anyone else have ideas? (sorry if this is off-topic)

[August1991]

Any MP can be in the cabinet no matter what their party affiliation. They do not need to 'cross the floor' to get a cabinet position if they make a deal with the PM.

There used to be a rule that to enter cabinet, an MP had to face a byelection unless the MP had just been elected in a general election.

Riverwind, I would like to preserve the independence of an MP but I don't want a dictatorial PM to have the power to expand a cabinet by naming opposition MPs to new portfolios with a limo, residence, status and easy foreign travel.

Canadians send MPs to Ottawa. Maybe we should think about who we send.

[Hicksey]

I have no respect for a person that cheats on their spouse. It only proves that their word means nothing. If you want out, end it with integrity -- and then move on.

Stronach pulled the same thing politically.

And do you believe that David Emerson also did the same thing politically?

Harper could have really started the ball rolling if he introduced legislation banning MPs crossing the floor (as the NDP proposed and even mentioned during the Leadership debates during the last election,) and betraying the constitutents that voted them in. If these MPs wanted in with another party, then they would have to resign and run again in a byelection or general election (if it was close enough.)

Most people say that Stronach crossing over to the Liberals and Emerson to the Conservatives was wrong, yet nothing has been done to prevent it happening again in the future. If Harper and the Conservatives were serious about cleaning up parliament, this would have been huge step in the right direction.

I went on record calling Emerson every bit the whore as I did Stronach less than an hour after he crossed the floor. I haven't changed my mind.

[Hicksey]

I have no respect for a person that cheats on their spouse.

I have no respect for a person that makes sweeping generalizations about people while sticking their nose into business that isn't their own.

What's your problem? We are having a discussion about Tie and Belinda's escapade which according to his ex-wife and a witness includes infidelity.

I posted my opinion on infidelity and you accuse me of making a sweeping generalization?

I am at a loss to understand how my opinion on cheating is a sweeping generalization. Where I come from if you no longer want to be with your spouse you get divorced and go looking for a new one. Cheating is for losers IMO. If you can't keep your word to your own spouse how trustworthy can you be?

Tie and Belinda are just the example at hand. I'd make the same statement about two nobodys who cheated.

[BubberMiley]

Tie and Belinda are just the example at hand. I'd make the same statement about two nobodys who cheated.

I'm sure you would. Probably to anyone who would listen, and even to those who couldn't care less.

Where I come from, you don't spend time talking about and judging other people based on their personal, private business.

[Hicksey]

Tie and Belinda are just the example at hand. I'd make the same statement about two nobodys who cheated.

I'm sure you would. Probably to anyone who would listen, and even to those who couldn't care less.

Where I come from, you don't spend time talking about and judging other people based on their personal, private business.

As far as I am concerned, whether a person has cheated on a spouse or not goes to determining their character and how trustworthy they are. If I know that a person has cheated on a spouse, I would never bother dating them as I could never fully trust them. The question would always be there in the back of my mind. I refuse to live like that.

I don't demand the knowledge of someone, but if it comes to light that someone does cheat, it does affect my opinion of that person. How many of your friends are known liars and cheats that continually break your trust? Do you keep those people close to you? What qualities do you value in a friend/partner?

IMO, how trustworthy a person demonstrates himself to be is a direct reflection upon his character.

[mcqueen625]

I can't believe a woman who is supposedly quite sharp and who potentially has a political future would allow herself to be put in a position where her good name and reputation will be dragged through the mud in order to bed a sports bimbo.......

Will the sex tape be just around the corner?

Since when did Bimbo Belinda gain any credibility in Canada? She is nothing but a spoiled brat who's father failed to buy her the leadership of the Conservative Party of Canada so she prostituted herself to Paul Martin for a Cabinet position. This braod is all about gaining power, and she is not above doing anything to accomplish her goals. Unfortunately this time she lowered herself even more by crawling into bed with a married man, and helping to finish off a long marriage.

She has absolutely no morals or values and I fail to see what quality the voters in her riding saw in her as a Member of Parliament, unless of course Ontario thought as they usually do that the Lying, corrupt Liberals would again form the government and this bimbo would get an even more important Cabinet post. Well the lying Liberals did not form the government and now Belinda has absolutely no influence whatsoever for her constituents.

[jbg]

I can't believe a woman who is supposedly quite sharp and who potentially has a political future would allow herself to be put in a position where her good name and reputation will be dragged through the mud in order to bed a sports bimbo.......

Her good name? She lost that when she was pimped by Martin in May 2005.