Which Liberal candidate can defeat Harper?

[Topaz]

After reading the opinions on this forums I can agree with what everyone had to say. Myself, right now I'm thinking maybe Rae and I think he could give Harper a challenging time in "question period"! He has the education, life experience, political experience and is a good speaker. I think if you mix the NDP/LIB together, Rae would be the results. He couldn't be any worse of a leader than some of the leaders in the past or present!

[August1991]

Rae's Ontario failures will be remembered, but he is a very good speaker, and could have a chance if he gives the impression that he is more sincerely 'Canadian' than Harper is.

This has been noted elsewhere. The argument seems to be that Rae is unelectable because people in Ontario (Ontarians?) will not vote Rae.

I think Rae is a bit like Harper. Some people will simply never vote for him. High negatives. In the US, high negatives might matter. Elsewhere in the democratic world, it doesn't. Many in England would never vote for Blair and many in France would never vote for Chirac. So what? Blair and Chirac got the most among potential votes.

Harper should aim for his potential pool. Rae too.

I'm not saying Rae can defeat Harper. But I think Rae can capture his potential voters well, and his potential is not all English Canadians but it's a large number. In Quebec, Rae would be a credible bloke.

[Ricki Bobbi]

I'm not saying Rae can defeat Harper. But I think Rae can capture his potential voters well, and his potential is not all English Canadians but it's a large number. In Quebec, Rae would be a credible bloke.

Rae would do the best of all the Liberal candidates.

That's why I agree with Paul Wells' conspiracy theory about the leaked CPC memo saying they most feared facing Iggy. I think it's a setup too.

With Iggy at the helm a majority is very likely for the Conservatives. Rae at the helm and we are looking at a third straight minority government, probably Conservative...

[gerryhatrick]

I'm not saying Rae can defeat Harper. But I think Rae can capture his potential voters well, and his potential is not all English Canadians but it's a large number. In Quebec, Rae would be a credible bloke.

Rae would do the best of all the Liberal candidates.

That's why I agree with Paul Wells' conspiracy theory about the leaked CPC memo saying they most feared facing Iggy. I think it's a setup too.

With Iggy at the helm a majority is very likely for the Conservatives. Rae at the helm and we are looking at a third straight minority government, probably Conservative...

I am going to piss myself laughing when Rae forms a minority gov't with NDP balance of power.

[August1991]

I am going to piss myself laughing when Rae forms a minority gov't with NDP balance of power.

Not bad, Gerry!

[gc1765]

I am going to piss myself laughing when Rae forms a minority gov't with NDP balance of power.

That's a good point. A minority liberal government with NDP having the balance of power is certainly plausible. Rae is probably much more likely to get the support of the NDP than someone like ignatieff (and much more likely than the NDP supporting a conservative minority). OTOH, how much would Rae 'cave in' to the demands of the NDP? Even better for the liberals would be if Rae could draw some votes away from the NDP and win some ridings where the liberals & conservatives are close. Given our first past the post system, this would be even more effective for the liberals than simply having the support of NDP MPs. And then they would not be 'held hostage' by the NDP for support.

[Argus]

I am going to piss myself laughing when Rae forms a minority gov't with NDP balance of power.

That's a good point. A minority liberal government with NDP having the balance of power is certainly plausible. Rae is probably much more likely to get the support of the NDP than someone like ignatieff (and much more likely than the NDP supporting a conservative minority). OTOH, how much would Rae 'cave in' to the demands of the NDP?

I'm guessing Rae shares almost all the goals and beliefs of the NDP anyway. As such, I'm presuming a Liberal/NDP "coallition" would really be an NDP government by another name (well, it would have to be as the country would never directly elect them). Which, given Rae's history, would last one term and then destroy the possibility of either party ever ruling again.

[Ricki Bobbi]

I'm guessing Rae shares almost all the goals and beliefs of the NDP anyway. As such, I'm presuming a Liberal/NDP "coallition" would really be an NDP government by another name (well, it would have to be as the country would never directly elect them). Which, given Rae's history, would last one term and then destroy the possibility of either party ever ruling again.

Rae *could* do a hell of a lot of damage in one term with a majority coalition.

Don't see that happening though.

I don't see how the Conservatives and the Bloc would lose enough seats for it to happen.

[jbg]

Agreed. I have to think they'd rather face Iggy... I think there is more recent stuff to pick at, I think once Rae has won the leadership (there's my predicition) and he gets more press time people will see that he isn't the same person he was 10 years ago in Ontario and he'll become a much greater force.

I guess the US equivalent would be the handlers' promotion of the "New Nixon" in 1968; one not paranoid or bent on attacking people. I guess, circa 1972-74 he didn't turn out to be quite so "new".

[Ricki Bobbi]

I guess the US equivalent would be the handlers' promotion of the "New Nixon" in 1968; one not paranoid or bent on attacking people. I guess, circa 1972-74 he didn't turn out to be quite so "new".

That's how they would try and sell Rae.

Even Liberal delegates can tell that one won't pass the laugh test. I'll bet anything Rae doesn't even make it to the final ballot.

[August1991]

The Liberal Party has always campaigned left but governed right. Some say that the NDP are Liberals in a hurry.

Rae is a perfect leader for them. He'll present himself as having his heart in the right place but the pragmatic Liberal team behind him to keep heads well-focussed.

For gawdsakes, Pierre Trudeau hung out with Fidel Castro (and was en passant an NDP member before joining the Liberals). Or consider the opposite. Paul Martin tried to be Right but play Left. It was a disaster.

Something else. Rae has a palpable passion about the country and about life that Harper lacks. Like Clinton, Rae's a policy wonk with showman instincts. Harper's the son of an accountant.

With all that said, I don't think the Liberals will pick Rae in Montreal.

[Ricki Bobbi]

Something else. Rae has a palpable passion about the country and about life that Harper lacks. Like Clinton, Rae's a policy wonk with showman instincts. Harper's the son of an accountant.

Palpable passion about the country?

wtf? The only people who would think that are gonna vote Liberal no matter what and fooling themselves that swing voters see Rae that way?

Who really cares what job a politicians father had? Is there that little for you to attack Harper on that you have to go after his father? For earning an honest living?