Afghanistan: pull out

[provoca tour]

http://www.republic-news.org/archive/145-r...tvin_canada.htm

Is anyone holding Hillier to account, has he been made to answer for the slaughter he is taking his troops through?

[Wilber]

The bloodiest campaign in Canadian military history? These idiots should learn a little of their own country's history. Maybe you should to.

[provoca tour]

The bloodiest campaign in Canadian military history? These idiots should learn a little of their own country's history. Maybe you should to.

Did you read the article? The rate of death of soldiers by size of deployment per month is at the historical peak. That's what makes it a military disaster (and not yet, perhaps, a national disaster, since the number of dead by size of population is very low).

[TravellingTimeMachineSalesman]

I only hope that Canadians don't elect Jack Laytons "No Democratic Principles" or some "Treudeaucrat" from the Liberal Party to carry through this insane idea!

[Wilber]

The bloodiest campaign in Canadian military history? These idiots should learn a little of their own country's history. Maybe you should to.

Did you read the article? The rate of death of soldiers by size of deployment per month is at the historical peak. That's what makes it a military disaster (and not yet, perhaps, a national disaster, since the number of dead by size of population is very low).

They are comparing a few months in Afghanistan (one month in particular) to wars that lasted years. Casualty rates rise and fall depending on what is going on. The Canadian component of Bomber Command had close to 60% killed in WWII. Only the Kamikaze's and U Boats had a higher casualty rate. The Canadian rate in WW1 which these guys don't mention, was closer to 10% killed for that war. The 1.3% in Afghanistan lately is certainly higher than one would want to see over the long term but these guys are definitely selective when it comes to choosing their numbers.

The Conservatives are making the softwood lumber agreement a confidence vote. Didn't the Bloc just say they would support it?

[M.Dancer]

http://www.republic-news.org/archive/145-r...tvin_canada.htm

Is anyone holding Hillier to account, has he been made to answer for the slaughter he is taking his troops through?

What slaughter is that?

Afghanistan: The bloodiest military campaign in Canadian history

I love it when someone with half a brain in fringe media makes historical comparisons......

Lets replay that headline again..because agood lie should be repeated

Afghanistan: The bloodiest military campaign in Canadian history

Now the facts:

Opertation Jubilee: August 19, 1942

5000 canadians participating

907 killed

1,946 captured

Bah.....fringe papers with illiterate writers......

[M.Dancer]

The bloodiest campaign in Canadian military history? These idiots should learn a little of their own country's history. Maybe you should to.

Did you read the article? The rate of death of soldiers by size of deployment per month is at the historical peak. That's what makes it a military disaster (and not yet, perhaps, a national disaster, since the number of dead by size of population is very low).

I read it. Historical illiteracy is at a historical peak.....what hogwash...what absolute crap. My High School Histroy teacher would have failed my for that load of bull.

[M.Dancer]

Any campaign that suffers less than The 1.3% being offered wouod be called either bloodless.....any campaign where the punishment being inflicted on the enemy by Canadians and only enduring 1.3% themselves would be called a complete and total victory.

[kimmy]

"The Republic of East Vancouver"?

hmmm.

18 dead in 6 months... perhaps Vancouver's junkie and hooker populations should enlist and deploy in Afghanistan, because comparing the casualty rates, they'd be safer in Afghanistan than they are at home.

-k

[Who's Doing What?]

The bloodiest campaign in Canadian military history? ?????

Vimy Ridge?

Juno Beach?

I'm sorry did I dream those up?

Get a freakin' clue for **** sakes.

[cybercoma]

"The Republic of East Vancouver"?

hmmm.

18 dead in 6 months... perhaps Vancouver's junkie and hooker populations should enlist and deploy in Afghanistan, because comparing the casualty rates, they'd be safer in Afghanistan than they are at home.

-k

Easily one of the greatest posts I've seen on this forum. Kudos!

[TravellingTimeMachineSalesman]

This the single biggest reason that the famed "Canadian Airborne Regiment" should never have been disbanded! This political blunder by PM Jean Chretien and Defence Minister David Collenette was destined to come back and haunt us! In Afghanistan this crack para-commando unit would have been ideal to hunt down and destroy the roving bands of Taliban guerrillas we are now facing.

[Army Guy]

See what happens when you mix mushrooms and math at the same time.

should be a friggin commerical here is your brain on mushrooms, BC mushrooms to boot...

I guess they were passing these out at the NDP convention.

[M.Dancer]

This the single biggest reason that the famed "Canadian Airborne Regiment" should never have been disbanded! This political blunder by PM Jean Chretien and Defence Minister David Collenette was destined to come back and haunt us! In Afghanistan this crack para-commando unit would have been ideal to hunt down and destroy the roving bands of Taliban guerrillas we are now facing.

That would be true if it weren't that 2 commando was a unit on the verge of collaspse. The discipline problems were festering and any operation they were in would have been preordained to fail.

That being said, the reg't probably shouldn't have been disbanded, even if airborne is somewhat anachronistic......the training they received is no being given to the other 3 reg'ts ofr the line as well as JTF.....nothing has been wasted.

[M.Dancer]

See what happens when you mix mushrooms and math at the same time.

should be a friggin commerical here is your brain on mushrooms, BC mushrooms to boot...

I guess they were passing these out at the NDP convention.

I have had my share of BC mushrooms......they are very good if you like that sort of thing......this on the otherhand is just plain and simple ignorance.

[Wilber]

This the single biggest reason that the famed "Canadian Airborne Regiment" should never have been disbanded! This political blunder by PM Jean Chretien and Defence Minister David Collenette was destined to come back and haunt us! In Afghanistan this crack para-commando unit would have been ideal to hunt down and destroy the roving bands of Taliban guerrillas we are now facing.

That would be true if it weren't that 2 commando was a unit on the verge of collaspse. The discipline problems were festering and any operation they were in would have been preordained to fail.

That being said, the reg't probably shouldn't have been disbanded, even if airborne is somewhat anachronistic......the training they received is no being given to the other 3 reg'ts ofr the line as well as JTF.....nothing has been wasted.

About six years ago I was working with an American reservist who spent some time in Somalia. They had a pretty high opinion of the airborne although he didn't know anything about their internal problems. When I told him the regiment had been disbanded his reaction was "NO WAY". He couldn't believe it.

Let's face it military units who's primary function was killing people were not in fashion back then either with the government or the people. It was a great political decision at the time. It was politically correct and instead of actually having to fix a problem it allowed the government to cut back even more on the military. Unfortunately we are probably paying for that decision now.

[M.Dancer]

About six years ago I was working with an American reservist who spent some time in Somalia. They had a pretty high opinion of the airborne although he didn't know anything about their internal problems. When I told him the regiment had been disbanded his reaction was "NO WAY". He couldn't believe it.

Let's face it military units who's primary function was killing people were not in fashion back then either with the government or the people. It was a great political decision at the time. It was politically correct and instead of actually having to fix a problem it allowed the government to cut back even more on the military. Unfortunately we are probably paying for that decision now.

Now while we know why the Airborne were dismantled, the stated reason was different. I don't think we particulary needed an airborne reg't and still don't. To my knowledge though, para wings are still being given and w still have the capability.

The reg't should have morphed into something else** and it's honour, tradition and pedigree preserved.

**The way hussars have become armoured and light infantry have become mechanized.....

[Wilber]

Tradition and honour have never been big political priorities.

[killjoy]

If one feels the casualties suffered by Canadians is bad now and we should pull out, let me please illustrate exactly what would happen.

Pakistani Taliban with perhaps help from the INI would reclaim power. Their drive to turn Afghanistan into essentially a training/recruiting ground for terrorist organizations planned from influences in Pakistan would resume. The Taliban effort to install an Afghan version of the Hudood ordinance would continue, something the people there never wanted, the imprisonment of ‘their own people’ would continue and their war against the West would wage on, and we would be part of it.

So we can suffer what we suffer now, or we can come back in ten years and everyone, (NATO, civilians Canadian or Afghan, Pakistani's - everyone), can suffer 10x as much, and maybe then people will finally understand that we are at war whether we want it or not.

Having said that I'm very pleased that Poland has stepped up to the plate to send 900 additional troops.

( When will those "awful warmongers" the Polish, ever learn? )

[killjoy]

I don't think we particulary needed an airborne reg't and still don't. To my knowledge though, para wings are still being given and w still have the capability.

You're right about the para wings, sorta. Essentially all 'first line' Canadian units have become 'airborne'.

.

[Argus]

The bloodiest campaign in Canadian military history? These idiots should learn a little of their own country's history. Maybe you should to.

Did you read the article? The rate of death of soldiers by size of deployment per month is at the historical peak. That's what makes it a military disaster (and not yet, perhaps, a national disaster, since the number of dead by size of population is very low).

You cannot do these kinds of statistical comparisons with such a small group. When you're only dealing with a couple of thousand people, comparing it to mass warfare in Korea or WW2 is just silly. The size is so small that four guys in a jeep being killed in an accident suddenly sends your "percentages" skyrocketing.

The US percentage is based on the fact that the US has a far higher population of servicemen in the area, but a very high percentage of them are support and logistical troops: everything from aircraft mechanics to doctors to communications techs, lawyers, MPs and administrators. By comparison, Canada has a far lower percentage of support and logisitcal people and a far higher percentage of combat troops. So of course we're going to have a high casualty per body number compared to the US.

The report was also wrong about our absolute casualty numbers being second to the US, they're third, after the UK.