Compare and contrast, Australia and Canada

[I am Groot]

Australia's national debt is 30% of GDP vs Canada at 110%

Australia has a functioning healthcare system. Canada does not.

Australia's unemploymenr rate is 4%. Canada's is alleged to be 6.5%

Australia's GDP per capita is US$69k. Canada's GDP per capita is US$58k

One wonders what could account for all this.

This week, an LNG tanker called the Maran Gas Hector pulled into an LNG import terminal in Saint John, N.B., after charting a 25,000 km course direct from Gladstone, Australia. The Maran Gas Hector was bringing gas into a region littered with failed or stalled proposals to send Canadian natural gas in the other direction. As far back as 2015, the Canada Energy Regulator was listing four proposed LNG export terminals on Canada’s Atlantic coast. None of these projects bore fruit, including one that would have been directly adjacent to the Saint John facility where the Maran Gas Hector ultimately docked to unload its cargo.

The Maran Gas Hector is also selling gas to customers with vast reserves of natural gas located just beneath their feet. New Brunswick, in particular, is known to sit atop an estimated 77.9 trillion cubic feet of natural gas, according to Natural Resources Canada. That’s enough to fill the Maran Gas Hector at least 20,000 times.  

But the main reason these reserves have never been tapped is because in 2014 New Brunswick imposed an indefinite moratorium on hydraulic fracturing (fracking), the precise system that would be needed to extract the gas reserves.  And New Brunswick’s gas reserves are just a small share of the Canadian total, which are about 1.4 quadrillion cubic feet. According to one analysis by the U.S. Department of Energy, that’s enough for Canada to meet all the world’s natural gas needs for 200 years.

Ah, okay, I understand. It's more of that ludicrous net-zero nonsense that has captured the Left. They'd rather we be poor than develop icky fossil fuel. Even though there is zero chance this will have ANY impact on global warming.

https://archive.is/2i85Z

Edited February 27 by I am Groot

[Moonbox]

It's a pretty stupid paradigm, with New Brunswick getting roughly 30% of their provincial revenue from federal transfers.  In short, they're getting subsidized by gas-producing provinces in part because they refuse to develop their own resources.  

This is why the Alberta independence movement exists.  

[eyeball]

Maybe NB should try to crack the Daylight Savings Time nut. They could apply how that works out to getting other things done...or not.

[I am Groot]

1 hour ago, Moonbox said:

It's a pretty stupid paradigm, with New Brunswick getting roughly 30% of their provincial revenue from federal transfers.  In short, they're getting subsidized by gas-producing provinces in part because they refuse to develop their own resources.  

This is why the Alberta independence movement exists.  

Quebec is the same. And I'm sure this is a part of it.

But damn, did the line where it said Canada has enough natural gas reserve to power the planet for 200 years surprise anyone else? And yet we have NO LNG terminals! It's insane! Australis is getting $90 billion a year added to their GDP. We could have even more, and perhaps help countries using coal to move to natural gas. Australia has 10 LNG export terminals and we just finally opened one after costly, lengthy, and exhausting battles. 

And so we sit with our deteriorating economy, our rapidly growing debt, and governments in Ottawa, New Brunswick, and Quebec that seem unconcerned about either. It's insanity.

All transfer payments should be stopped to Quebec and New Brunswick. If they don't want to develop their own natural gas, they should not benefit from others who did.

 

 

[suds]

Australia has 10 LNG export terminals while Canada has 1.  If we're going to achieve anything close to net-zero by 2050, and double our current electrical power generation at the same time.... we're going to need a lot of new infrastructure. The extra revenues that governments receive from the exporting of LNG can be used in helping to build and fund that new infrastructure. This should be a no-brainer. New Brunswick also imports a lot of gas from the U.S. which is likely fracked, but it can't frack the gas it's sitting right on top of. Totally insane. 

[Moonbox]

24 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

All transfer payments should be stopped to Quebec and New Brunswick. If they don't want to develop their own natural gas, they should not benefit from others who did.

I don't know if all transfer payments need to be stopped...but I do think the formula is fundamentally broken and counter-productive.  It's one thing for the federal government to try to even a few things out to ensure things like basic health care are provided, but when 20-30% of your provincial revenue is coming from other provinces then all you're doing is throwing good money after bad, and reinforcing shitty economic policies and non-viable communities.  

It has to make sense to anyone with a brain that paying billions annually out to backwards provinces that insist on opposing not only their own economic progress, but also those of paying provinces, is an easy recipe for building resentment. 

[eyeball]

There's another side to this that New Brunswickers and Canadians might want to consider.

For eastern Australia, AEMO forecasts gas shortages from 2028, increasing sharply in the early 2030s as production from Victoria’s gas fields declines.

These issues can be surprising for a country that is one of the world’s largest LNG exporters. A lot of the gas market issues can be associated with the dominance of LNG exports over domestic gas use: Australia exports about 80% of the gas it produces. This has led to a linkage between domestic and international prices. In addition, there is a lack of competition in the eastern market, where a small group of LNG exporters effectively control 90% of 2P [proven and probable] gas reserves.

 https://esdnews.com.au/australias-gas-market-isnt-working/

 

We've seen this export above all else problem in BC where mills are shut down because they can't find the timber they need.

Vancouver Island’s vastly diminished old-growth forests continue to be logged even as logging of the island’s smaller second-growth trees accelerates. Yet all of that logging is not translating into increased jobs for community members, but rather more raw logs being loaded into the holds of ships anchored in Port Alberni Inlet within eyesight of the town’s mills.

https://www.policyalternatives.ca/wp-content/uploads/attachments/Raw Log Exports.pdf

Canada's resource industries have a long long history of catching it, cutting it, mining it, pumping it and shipping it.

Domestic needs always take a back seat.

[I am Groot]

13 minutes ago, Moonbox said:

I don't know if all transfer payments need to be stopped...but I do think the formula is fundamentally broken and counter-productive.  It's one thing for the federal government to try to even a few things out to ensure things like basic health care are provided, but when 20-30% of your provincial revenue is coming from other provinces then all you're doing is throwing good money after bad, and reinforcing shitty economic policies and non-viable communities.  

It has to make sense to anyone with a brain that paying billions annually out to backwards provinces that insist on opposing not only their own economic progress, but also those of paying provinces, is an easy recipe for building resentment. 

There's another part that goes with this, at least for Quebec. They get a lot of money out of their hydroelectricity system. But to keep transfer payments high, they under-charge their people, who get the benefit of extra cheap power, the lowest in Canada, PLUS higher transfer payments from Western Canadian oil and gas that they disdain.

Wait, isn't it Quebec who are the most zealous in fighting CO2? Why should they want to keep power rates down? Doesn't that discourage people from conservation measures?

[I am Groot]

6 minutes ago, eyeball said:

https://www.policyalternatives.ca/wp-content/uploads/attachments/Raw Log Exports.pdf

Canada's resource industries have a long long history of catching it, cutting it, mining it, pumping it and shipping it.

Domestic needs always take a back seat.

This is just bad government. We have dumb leaders at all levels. And when we run what is almost an imperial type of government, where the PM or premier is a king who can do anything they want, that's trouble. We have dumb leaders at the municipal, provincial, and federal levels. I wonder whether we should look into that, and why dumb people keep getting elected. 

[Moonbox]

That's just one of the reasons that Quebec in particular is so frustrating.  They have seemingly everything going for them - educated workforce, a wealth of natural resources, robust agriculture, ocean access for their ports, cheap energy...and they still lag behind.  The large federal transfers enable and perpetuate their ineffeciency and waste.  

[eyeball]

39 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

This is just bad government. We have dumb leaders at all levels. And when we run what is almost an imperial type of government, where the PM or premier is a king who can do anything they want, that's trouble. We have dumb leaders at the municipal, provincial, and federal levels. I wonder whether we should look into that, and why dumb people keep getting elected. 

That's easy, its because dumb voters keep tolerating politicians and lobbyists getting cozy with one another behind closed doors.

[I am Groot]

5 minutes ago, eyeball said:

That's easy, its because dumb voters keep tolerating politicians and lobbyists getting cozy with one another behind closed doors.

So how do we get voters to be less tolerant of lying, incompetent politicians?

Trudeau was caught lying - bald-faced lies to the cameras on multiple occasions - and he still got re-elected. Carney got caught doing the same before he even ran for PM and people voted enthusiastically for him.

I think it needs to start in schools. We need to start teaching kids critical thinking as a reflex action, to always question, to research, to demand honesty, and to be extremely intolerant of lies. We need more of our media, too. We need it to lay out straight, complete facts on important matters without narrative.

[eyeball]

46 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

So how do we get voters to be less tolerant of lying, incompetent politicians?

Get rid of them.

Draft Parliamentarians like jurists and afford political parties no more gravitas or importance than the Kiwanis Club in the scheme of things.

If enough Canadians join your club you might even see a few get drafted.

[LinkSoul60]

1 hour ago, I am Groot said:

I think it needs to start in schools. We need to start teaching kids critical thinking as a reflex action, to always question, to research, to demand honesty, and to be extremely intolerant of lies. We need more of our media, too. We need it to lay out straight, complete facts on important matters without narrative.

Teaching children critical thinking has been part of the education system, and in most households forever.  One of the most important questions a child can ask is 'why' which helps develop their minds when receiving that answer. That said as we age we inherently develop our own biases based on our own life experiences.  A so-called lie by you or I may not be seen that way by either of us which quashes the critical thinking thing as you or I would view it if we don't agree. Forums such as this is a good example of those biases whereas a child would probably look at most posts and shake their little heads.

[I am Groot]

42 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

Teaching children critical thinking has been part of the education system, and in most households forever.

Not these days. There are too many absurd narratives embraced by the young that don't stand up to even mildly thoughtful analyses. The Palestinians being one beloved by university students. Climate change being another. Men deciding they can be women is a third.

 

42 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

One of the most important questions a child can ask is 'why' which helps develop their minds when receiving that answer.

I've read innumerable reports from studies that say students are afraid to speak their mind, afraid to question certain narratives, and that showing doubt or disagreement gets you cancelled by friends and classmates.

42 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

 A so-called lie by you or I may not be seen that way by either of us which quashes the critical thinking thing as you or I would view it if we don't agree

I doubt that. We can have different judgments on things, and can approach them from different viewpoints with preconceived goals that are or aren't met. But facts should be just that, incontrovertible. If a politician lies on camera, and the evidence is revealed, there is no doubt. If the math doesn't add up, then it's not a matter of judgment.

I don't have any ideological view of climate change. I accept it's happening. I accept the probability that it's related to CO2 is high. But when I look at the treaties we've signed and what we've undertaken to do, and what the results will be, all I see is a massive cost with no improvement at the end of it. The numbers just aren't there. Bjorn Lomborg, among others, has demonstrated that quite clearly.

So sitting on two hundred years' worth of naturall gas while our economy goes deeper into the hole makes absolutely no sense.

 

[eyeball]

46 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

So sitting on two hundred years' worth of naturall gas while our economy goes deeper into the hole makes absolutely no sense.

Developing it to prevent that makes even less sense. Not when something like a nuclear SMR can be constructed within a couple of years.

It's ridiculous that we're even considering getting all gung-ho about fossil fuels at this point. We're too late for the petrodollar rush. The future is in the other direction.

We should be mass producing SMRs and securing contracts to export and install them and of course sell the fuel they need.

[LinkSoul60]

14 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

Not these days. There are too many absurd narratives embraced by the young that don't stand up to even mildly thoughtful analyses. The Palestinians being one beloved by university students. Climate change being another. Men deciding they can be women is a third.

Sure it is and not just exclusive to children. Young or old doesn't matter....critical thinking is or at least should be part of any decision you're going to make or opinion you're going to espouse.  Of course younger generations have different narratives because they're living in a different regeneration and world than we did at that age.  I don't know/care enough of the Palestine protests by university students so won't comment there, but climate change is unequivocal (you disagree with my opinion), and who cares or why should you care if a man wants to be a woman or a woman wants to be a man. It's their life (you also disagree with my opinion).  I've thought critically of both these subjects as I'm sure you have but we have opinions that differ, same as the younger generations so-called absurd narratives.

29 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

I've read innumerable reports from studies that say students are afraid to speak their mind, afraid to question certain narratives, and that showing doubt or disagreement gets you cancelled by friends and classmates.

Haven't read a lot of reports or studies but I can see that.  Again, it's a different world they live in with social media opening a universe of good and bad. Peer pressure or fitting in with the crowd isn't anything new for kids these days though.  It's been that way forever.

34 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

I doubt that. We can have different judgments on things, and can approach them from different viewpoints with preconceived goals that are or aren't met. But facts should be just that, incontrovertible. If a politician lies on camera, and the evidence is revealed, there is no doubt. If the math doesn't add up, then it's not a matter of judgment.

Totally agree. Facts and data should drive all opinions and/or decisions.  As it relates to politicians though and in these divisive times it doesn't appear to matter one way or another if politicians lie as long as the jersey they're wearing is the same colour as mine.

We're in an interesting spot with the what I believe to be very valid environmental concerns and the absolute need to have a sustainable economy.  Unless we completely reinvent ourself which would take decades our logical and most obvious opportunities are with our natural resources while also building out cleaner forms of energy. The older I get though the more I want to see us do it in a responsible way and with that added tax/cost to corporate and citizen taxpayers. Easier for me to say though than a younger person/family trying to make ends meet.

I hear you...  Years late but we have one LNG project in operation with 7 more in various stages so we're heading down the right road.  

 

 

[I am Groot]

19 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

but climate change is unequivocal (you disagree with my opinion),

I don't disagree that it's happening. I disagree with the political agreement on what to do about it, which is clearly not working and will not and can not work.

19 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

and who cares or why should you care if a man wants to be a woman or a woman wants to be a man.

Well, if the man is a rapist and decides he's a woman now and goes to women's prison and winds up in a cell with another woman, I bet that other woman would care.

19 minutes ago, LinkSoul60 said:

Totally agree. Facts and data should drive all opinions and/or decisions.  As it relates to politicians though and in these divisive times it doesn't appear to matter one way or another if politicians lie as long as the jersey they're wearing is the same colour as mine.

I don't understand this. I welcomed the election of Doug Ford as an improvement over the Ontario Liberals. But it didn't take all that long before his utter lack of interest in making any changes became evident. He screwed up repeatedly and is as useless a 'leader' as I've ever seen. I don't vote for him again. Harper. Meh. He was a good manager, but lacked vision and the courage to make any substantive changes. Poilievre, well, who knows? I like some of what he says and the party policy. But while he's not as timid as Harper was, he's not exactly a bold visionary either.

Carny? He's done nothing but performative posturing. Nothing he's done to date seems like it's going to improve the economy or society.

 

49 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Developing it to prevent that makes even less sense. Not when something like a nuclear SMR can be constructed within a couple of years.

Did you miss the part about Australia, with much less natural gas, earning about $90 billion a year from selling it?

49 minutes ago, eyeball said:

It's ridiculous that we're even considering getting all gung-ho about fossil fuels at this point. We're too late for the petrodollar rush. The future is in the other direction.

Much of the world is still using coal and wood. You think they're going to start constructing SMRs in your lifetime or mine?

 

[I am Groot]

In case I haven't mentioned it before, this is how I think an immigration system should be run.

Start advertising as we used to a hundred years ago. Advertise in Europe, especially the UK and Ireland. Advertise to young, educated Europeans who have skills and no jobs. The youth unemployment rate in some countries over there is pretty high*. Target medical professionals, especially.

Why? Because the government's own studies show immigrants from Europe, especially northern Europe, are the most economically successful in Canada. They're also the ones most likely to integrate and the least likely to cause social upheaval and terrorism. Least likely to be religious zealots with hostile social views. Huge numbers of Europeans already speak English, too. 

Keep the numbers low for now. 100k. Let them send in their paperwork, as now, but then make the most qualified see an immigration officer, do a values test, and then an online interview with a professional in their stated line of work. 

No citizenship for ten years. Then another interview to discuss what effort they've made to integrate. 

No more Indians for now. No more Muslims, forever. No Chinese without careful security screening. Japanese welcome. Same for South Koreans.

* Yeah, I know our youth unemployment is high. That can be addressed by largely eliminating foreign workers and not allowing foreign students to work while here. Not to mention by slashing immigration by about 70%.

[LinkSoul60]

3 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

I disagree with the political agreement on what to do about it, which is clearly not working and will not and can not work.

We just said LNG is years late, but starting to happen now so it's a start there and TMX keeps growing so it's happening. I'm not a proponent for a Northern pipeline if the people that live there don't want it but the balls in Smith's and then Carney's court there to see if that project gets off the ground so things have obviously changed since Trudeau. 

11 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

Well, if the man is a rapist and decides he's a woman now and goes to women's prison and winds up in a cell with another woman, I bet that other woman would care.

Depending on how she's in there.  Maybe, maybe not...  It's not my thing and I'm happy to see my children didn't go down that road but the older I got the less I cared what others did.  

14 minutes ago, I am Groot said:

I don't understand this. I welcomed the election of Doug Ford as an improvement over the Ontario Liberals. But it didn't take all that long before his utter lack of interest in making any changes became evident. He screwed up repeatedly and is as useless a 'leader' as I've ever seen. I don't vote for him again. Harper. Meh. He was a good manager, but lacked vision and the courage to make any substantive changes. Poilievre, well, who knows? I like some of what he says and the party policy. But while he's not as timid as Harper was, he's not exactly a bold visionary either.

Carny? He's done nothing but performative posturing. Nothing he's done to date seems like it's going to improve the economy or society.

That's what politicians do...try to please the majority and appease the minority. Carney's got himself more than a handful from the Trudeau mess and Trump trying to break some of our industrial sectors but I'll wait before I say nothings going to improve.  The obvious is that it has to happen but we have to find people to dance with to do it which is why the guys on a plane every second day.  We need investment coming back into this country and we couldn't find a more qualified guy who knows which direction to go in the investment community than Carney.  If not, we'll vote someone else in next election.