Who will Do Iran?

[Metal Jam]

I have mixed feeling on the war in Iraq and the possiblity of a furture war with Iran.

There is nothing I would like more than to have basic harmony among nations.

Although it would be blind of me to think it possible with all the hate in this world.

It feels to me that with new advances in technology that the world continues to get smaller.

We can assume the reasons for this war and we can predict the effects but we really do not know what will be the ultimate effect of staying in the Middle-East or leaving.

[lost&outofcontrol]

I'd like to bring people's attention to a great article on the "Failed States" from Noam Chomsky and in particular the Iran bit:

"The nuclear negotiations between Iran and the European Union were based on a bargain that the EU, held back by the US, has failed to honour," Harrison observes:

Iran agreed to suspend its uranium enrichment efforts temporarily pending the outcome of discussions on a permanent enrichment ban. The EU promised to put forward proposals for economic incentives and security guarantees in return for a permanent ban but subsequently refused to discuss security issues. The language of the joint declaration that launched the negotiations on November 14 2004, was unambiguous. "A mutually acceptable agreement," it said, would not only provide "objective guarantees" that Iran's nuclear programme is "exclusively for peaceful purposes" but would "equally provide firm commitments on security issues."

The phrase "security issues" is a thinly veiled reference to the threats by the US and Israel to bomb Iran, and the well-publicized preparations to carry out such an attack. The model regularly adduced is Israel’s bombing of Iraq’s Osirak nuclear reactor in 1981, which appears to have initiated Saddam’s nuclear weapons programs, another demonstration that violence tends to elicit violence in reaction.

[KrustyKidd]

The 'Brain' is falable and here, he is. Iran has far less interest in it's own energy needs than economic and cutual power within the region. One that has been left wide open since the US arrived to depose Saddam. While layered in his thinking, and, quite right on most topics, the overall premise is usualy biased. Here, the US needs Iran and, the Mullahs need the US. A bad deal for both but, one that leaves the Iraqi government in a situation of power from all sides.

As a Chomsky rreader myself, you would do well to take his short term and smaller observations and use them to enrich your own knowledge and directional interpretations of events as they happened from a unique perspective. However, as an overall filter for history and the world, he is very wrong and biased much of the time.

I find no fault in him however. One of the greatest thinkers of our times and should be listened to. He is but a source though. Not an end. Short essay on Chomsky's falibillity.

[Montgomery Burns]

They are a few years away yet of actually gathering enough material for ONE single bomb...]

Not according to Israel and if anyone would know - their very existence relies on it - they would. I think Israel's intelligence is the best in the world.

As for the ludicrous Chapter IV (non-binding) weekly resolutions against Israel, you must be one of the few left that thinks the UN is credible.

And where the hell is a map showing this mythical "Palestine" country you are talking about?

Or are you talking about this map at UN headquarters? This map doesn't even show Israel, which has been a UN member for 50+ years. All it shows is some country called "Palestine".

And you have the bloody nerve to cite the UN as a moral authority whose resolutions against Israel are just?! :angry:

You should be ashamed of yourself for supporting a death cult that indocrinates its children to kill Jews.

[Montgomery Burns]

State sponsored terrorism on the part of Israel.

QUOTE

Palestinian children shot dead in their classroom, on their way to school or at home

In the space of a few weeks two Palestinian children were killed by the Israeli army while sitting in their classrooms and two others were shot dead on their way to school in Khan Yunis refugee camp in the Gaza Strip. On the morning of 7 September 2004, 10-year-old Raghda Adnan al-Assar was struck in the head by an Israeli bullet while sitting at her desk in UNRWA’s Elementary C Girl’s School in Khan Yunis refugee camp. The firing came from an Israeli army position in the Gush Katif Settlement block, west of Khan Yunis. Raghda never regained consciousness and died on 22 September.

Amnesty International offers no evidence whatsoever in your link. Where did they get their info from? The displaced Arabs? Yeah, they have a great track record of being truthful. Do some children get shot or killed? Yes, because the displaced Arabs have a track record of hiding amongst civilians to launch their attacks. Is Israel deliberately shooting children while they are sitting in a classroom? Utter nonsense!

This is the same Amnesty International that, last year, admitted that it had no evidence that Gitmo was a gulag and a terrorist prison where systematic torture is rife. Then they later admitted it was a publicity stunt to get attention!

This is the same AI that demanded the US allow independent human rights organizations to investigate conditions at Gitmo and elsewhere. However The International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) has had regular access to the detainees at Gitmo (and other US military detention centers) since the facility was established in January 2002.

This is the same AI that called called for other nations to kidnap Bush, Rumsfeld, Alberto Gonzales, George Tenet and others, and haul them off to the International Criminal Court for prosecution on charges of crimes against humanity.

Amnesty International - led by a Muslim named Irene Khan, who used to work for the despicable UN - is an organization with a political agenda.

[Black Dog]

Or are you talking about this map at UN headquarters? This map doesn't even show Israel, which has been a UN member for 50+ years. All it shows is some country called "Palestine".

No context, no translation, nothing. You can't tell what the map is of, let alone what it is not of. In other words, more MB conspiracy mongering.

Amnesty International offers no evidence whatsoever in your link. Where did they get their info from? The displaced Arabs? Yeah, they have a great track record of being truthful. Do some children get shot or killed? Yes, because the displaced Arabs have a track record of hiding amongst civilians to launch their attacks.

So the Arabs are liars when they say that Palestinian kids are getting shot, but if Palestinian kids are getting shot its because they deserve it? You're a great one to lecture anybody about morality.

This is the same AI that called called for other nations to kidnap Bush, Rumsfeld, Alberto Gonzales, George Tenet and others, and haul them off to the International Criminal Court for prosecution on charges of crimes against humanity.

Liar. What AI said was that, if the Bush administration fails to conduct a truly independent investigation of U.S. abuses against detainees in Iraq and elsewhere, foreign governments should investigate and, if necessary, arrest any official who enters their territory and prosecute them. Nothing about kidnapping, but the applying the same standard that is applied to war-criminals everywhere.

[lost&outofcontrol]

Something the US administration doesn't want u s to know.

Iran Proposal To U.S. Offered Peace With Israel

This fact destroys the idea that Iran will stop at nothing to destroy Israel.

[scribblet]

Something the US administration doesn't want u s to know.

Iran Proposal To U.S. Offered Peace With Israel

This fact destroys the idea that Iran will stop at nothing to destroy Israel.

So why does their leader keep repeating that he wants to destroy Israel ?

[lost&outofcontrol]

Something the US administration doesn't want u s to know.

Iran Proposal To U.S. Offered Peace With Israel

This fact destroys the idea that Iran will stop at nothing to destroy Israel.

So why does their leader keep repeating that he wants to destroy Israel ?

Rhetoric, it's what people in high places do.

[KrustyKidd]

So why does their leader keep repeating that he wants to destroy Israel ?

Iran wants to become the predominent Islamic power in the Middle East and in order to do that, they have to take on Islamic and Arab positions in public. Being anti Israel is one of them. Being able to face of with the great powers is another. Both of those play well with the Middle Eastern countries and also, gets the world's attention.