CPP/OAP vs US Social Security

[August1991]

Canadians receive CPP and OAP (with claw back) in Canadian dollars

Americans receive Social Security in US dollars.

All things considered, I reckon that the American pension system is more generous.

=====

We can discuss health care: but here too, I reckon the US medicare is better than our provincial health systems.

 

 

[CdnFox]

1 minute ago, August1991 said:

Canadians receive CPP and OAP (with claw back) in Canadian dollars

Americans receive Social Security in US dollars.

All things considered, I reckon that the American pension system is more generous.

=====

We can discuss health care: but here too, I reckon the US medicare is better than our provincial health systems.

 

 

the average is about the same, the us has a higher ceiling and lower floor i believe. Pretty comparable. Depends on the person really. 

Did you actually look anything up this time for a change or are you just going off something that popped into your head? 

[August1991]

The Americans have a pay-as-you-go pension scheme.

Quebec and Norway have a fund.

[CdnFox]

Just now, August1991 said:

The Americans have a pay-as-you-go pension scheme.

Quebec and Norway have a fund.

So you haven't looked any of this up and you're just blathering like an !diot.

Got  it. Don't know why I bothered replying thinking you might have an intelligent argument to make.

[August1991]

1 minute ago, CdnFox said:

the average is about the same...

 

Disagree. The US Social Security is much higher than our CPP/OAP.

[August1991]

4 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

So you haven't looked any of this up and you're just blathering like an !diot.

...

I have a broader point. Trump wants to create a "sovereign" fund.

[CdnFox]

7 minutes ago, August1991 said:

Disagree. The US Social Security is much higher than our CPP/OAP.

So quotes and numbers. You can't just say 'disagree", that's what a fool would do.  Make your point   Post the after tax numbers for both with a common recipient. 

Try to at least make it LOOK like you have some reason to believe what you say. 

 

 

[August1991]

4 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

So quotes and numbers. You can't just say 'disagree", that's what a fool would do.  Make your point   Post the after tax numbers for both with a common recipient. 

Try to at least make it LOOK like you have some reason to believe what you say. 

 

 

Some older Canadians may be receiving $1200/month in CPP/RRQ and another $600 in OAP (after clawback) = $1800.

I know many Americans receiving US $2500 per month in social security.

The American pension system is more generous than our Canadian system.

=====

CdnFox,

You miss the broader point. Our system is funded. The American system is not.

And this raises a much broader point: funded.

 

[August1991]

Quebec/Norway have sovereign funds. They sell bonds at low interest rates and use the money to invest/buy other financial paper at higher rates.

This is known as leverage.

[CdnFox]

9 hours ago, August1991 said:

Some older Canadians may be receiving $1200/month in CPP/RRQ and another $600 in OAP (after clawback) = $1800.

I know many Americans receiving US $2500 per month in social security.

The American pension system is more generous than our Canadian system.

 

well according to the cpp page the payout is more like 1,364.60. 

A few searches suggest the average payment for the states is about 1750, but that's us of course. 

So you've got just about 2000 dollars vs 1750 and even after conversion that's still only about a 200-300 dollar difference (depending how the dollar's doing).  I haven't compared tax rates for the elderly in both places and as you noted we haven't even gotten into medical coverage (which - sorry for seniors is MUCH better in canada tho i would imagine the tax is higher). 

So you're making these statements but i'm not sure they're really true.  US might be SLIGHTLY better on average? Maybe?

==

Quote

 

===

CdnFox,

You miss the broader point. Our system is funded. The American system is not.

And this raises a much broader point: funded.

 

You're not actually making a point. You're just saying a word. If you have a point about it being funded then make a point. Right now you just sound like an !diot Ass wipe who can't make his thoughts clear. What is your point about one being funded and what not being funded? What are you trying to say? (use your words)

[August1991]

On 9/18/2024 at 11:45 AM, CdnFox said:

well according to the cpp page the payout is more like 1,364.60. 

A few searches suggest the average payment for the states is about 1750, but that's us of course.

 

The Canadian - Norwegian- scheme is payed for. Using American paper.

The American system is pay-as-you-go but also based on American paper.

====

Most Americans receive more than we Canadians. Abroad, Norwegians are rich.

Edited September 28, 2024 by August1991

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, August1991 said:

The Canadian - Norwegian- scheme is payed for. Using American paper.

The American system is pay-as-you-go but also based on American paper.

====

Most Americans receive more than we Canadians. Abroad, Norwegians are rich.

And?

[August1991]

Norwegians are rich on paper.

[CdnFox]

1 hour ago, August1991 said:

Norwegians are rich on paper.

why are you like this?  Honestly this site has more than it's fair share of nutbars who can't communicate in ANY language it seems. 

[August1991]

On 9/18/2024 at 11:45 AM, CdnFox said:

well according to the cpp page the payout is more like 1,364.60. 

A few searches suggest the average payment for the states is about 1750, but that's us of course. 

...

You made my point.

Through RRQ/CPP, Cdns receive about Cdn 1370.

Americans receive about US 1750.

====

But we in Canada have OAP. And GAINs.

[August1991]

In Canada, depending on province, we have health care.

Americans have Medicare for people over 65.

======

There are two, uh, broader points:

1) Do young people in Quebec want to pay old people?

2) The US system is not funded.

 

[August1991]

Paul Krugman described the US federal government as a tank with a pension.

Edited October 3, 2024 by August1991

[Guest]

On 9/28/2024 at 1:15 AM, CdnFox said:

Honestly this site has more than it's fair share of nutbars who can't communicate in ANY language it seems. 

You can't even communicate, intelligently.

[CdnFox]

8 hours ago, August1991 said:

You made my point.

Through RRQ/CPP, Cdns receive about Cdn 1370.

Americans receive about US 1750.

====

But we in Canada have OAP. And GAINs.

CPP oas is 1950. 

Americans is 1750.

Even after conversion it's still pretty darn similar. 

So.... still not seeing your point  

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

You can't even communicate, intelligently.

Awww muffin   still butthurt are you? 

kid, you're a small broken little man who lost an argument on the internet and is so fragile he deleted 7 pages worth of posts one by one and then started chasing the guy who beat him all around the forum crying and begging for attention and apperently has asked than his account be deleted rather than just stopping using it in th ultimate act of 'I'll take my ball and go home crying'  

There's literally nothing you can possibly say to ME that's going to make me feel bad about any element of MY life or intellect after THAT demonstration  

[Guest]

On 10/3/2024 at 1:02 PM, CdnFox said:

still butthurt

You keep replying like anyone cares. Speaking of.. 🤡

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

You keep replying like anyone cares. Speaking of.. 🤡

ROFLMAO!!!! Sure kid, you follow me to every thread ONLY to attack me, deleted an entire thread because you looked dumb, and are supposedly having your account deleted because you just can't address your butt hurt and EVEN sent me little 'good morning messages each morning the moment you woke up (which was a little stalker-creepy).  

But you don't care at all what i think  

LOLOL Kid, your posts say pretty clearly that for whatever reason right now ALL you care about is what I think  

[Guest]

49 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

ROFLMAO!!!! Sure kid, you follow me to every thread ONLY to attack me, deleted an entire thread because you looked dumb, and are supposedly having your account deleted because you just can't address your butt hurt and EVEN sent me little 'good morning messages each morning the moment you woke up (which was a little stalker-creepy).  

But you don't care at all what i think  

LOLOL Kid, your posts say pretty clearly that for whatever reason right now ALL you care about is what I think  

Exhibit A 🤣

[CdnFox]

3 hours ago, Perspektiv said:

Exhibit A 🤣

Awwww look at you 'not caring"     If you "not care" much harder you won't be able to sleep tonight   

[BeaverFever]

Canadian CPP and OAS combined currently provide a maximum benefit of approx $26,388 CAD and average of $17,412 CAD, whereas Us Social Security provides a max of $43,524 USD and average of $21,600 USD. So one doesn’t need to do any currency conversion to see that the American system provides a higher benefit although the averages are closer. There are also significant differences in how they operate with Canada having very low “net debt” while US has very high net debt as a result. Also the OAS portion is equitable because everyone gets the same entitlement regardless of income or work history. 
 

CPP is funded by employee and employer contributions which are invested in global markets making the CPP Investment Board one of the world’s largest amd most sophisticated investors and major player on Wall Street and global markets.  

For those earning at or below the specified annual maximum pensionable earnings ($68,500 in 2024) CPP was historically designed to replace up to 25% of a person’s average pre-retirement income (average of best 38 years commencing at age 18)  Most people’s average is below the maximum (for example one would have had to earn the equivalent of $68,500 every single year between age 27 and 65 without interruption)  and earnings above the maximum are excluded from consideration so even if you have very high earnings later on you can’t make up for low earning years  and improve your earnings  A few years ago Trudeau significantly improved CPP by increasing the replacement rate from 25% to 33% and phasing in an increase of maximum pensionable earnings  

OAS on the other hand is not funded and is simply paid for from the annual budget.    Entitlement is based on years of residence in Canada rather than earnings or contributions with a minimum of 40 years of residence required for the full benefit  There are also additional supplements to OAS for low income seniors and surviving spouses of pensioners  

US social security is based on contributions from employees and employers with a benefit formula based on average earnings, similar in concept to CPP. However unlike CPP social security obligations are largely unfunded with pensions in a given year paid for by contributions in the same year. It is also highly politicized, like everything else in the US. The plans’s minimal assets are held in a Trust fund which only invests in specially issued US federal bonds. Therefore unlike CPP, Social Security is not a player in global markets.   CPP used to operate in a similar manner until major reforms in the 1990s  

 

Edited October 14, 2024 by BeaverFever