"As Canadians we have to take responsibility for our history"

[myata]

Right off the media waves. Sounds great, solemn and so responsible. Sure, coming ... wait, just give a minute to think it over.

For two centuries now or very close the bureaucracy ostensibly divided in parties but essentially for all it matters, one and same has ruled the country (and its budget) as its own. It made decisions suggested by unknown figures justified and defended by unknown arguments in near total obscurity with no accountability. It actively resisted calls and attempts for transparency and accountability. As just seen, between the era of residential schools and now, over a century on, very little if anything has changed in this pattern of behavior.

But now, comes the reckoning time, it became "We", generously. You guys and gals have to take that responsibility. We have little to do with it, it's you who elected us after all (forget the choice problem for now). Come on, let's assume it, solemnly.

On the other thought though... sorry, but no. Nope. I will not accept responsibility for anything where I have not been given a honest opportunity to participate. "No taxation without representation" they said. And this is no representation. And a formal checkmark once so many years does not change anything, it's not a paper thing but an essence thing. No responsibility without accountability. No responsibility without transparency and honest participation. You created this problem, as so many other problems single-handedly, in the closed circle, behind closed door far away from the light of the day, and scrutiny of the citizens. You paid yourselves outrages entitlements and privileges for that. And that means that you own it, before and more than anyone else.

So don't try making it stick: it's pathetic and ridiculous and doesn't make any sense.

[Argus]

I feel that to progressives, there's never a point where they'll accept we're not a horrible, racist, homophobic, misogynistic, Islamophobic country. No matter what we do. They refuse to even consider comparisons between us and other countries, either. It's like we just won the Olympic gold in the long jump and the progressives descend on us screaming about how we didn't jump far enough and are a horrible, awful person because of it and should bow our head in shame. That we jumped farther than anyone else isn't even a consideration.

Who is better than Canada? Who are we we supposed to emulate? Who has treated conquered natives better than us? For that matter, who treated conquered natives better than us in history?

[Shady]

I refuse to take responsibility for anything somebody else is responsible for, that occurred before I was even alive.

[Guest]

36 minutes ago, Shady said:

I refuse to take responsibility for anything somebody else is responsible for, that occurred before I was even alive.

Right.   Acknowlegement of past wrongs, in a historical context, but not responsibility. 

I guess those burning churches don't agree with us.

[myata]

41 minutes ago, Argus said:

Who is better than Canada? Who are we we supposed to emulate? Who has treated conquered natives better than us? For that matter, who treated conquered natives better than us in history?

Not to mention that its another great agenda to do the entitlement dance around the public budget. Commissions, inquiries, TV, grants, consultant reports for who knows how many decades. Sorry have to be realistic here. When I see the first PM, MP and GG doing their great thing for free may change the opinion as it stands though every Joe from the street would sing O Canada and clap hands for $185,000 annually plus allowances.

Edited July 1, 2021 by myata

[Argus]

22 hours ago, bcsapper said:

Right.   Acknowlegement of past wrongs, in a historical context, but not responsibility. 

I guess those burning churches don't agree with us.

Those burning churches are only exercising their legal right to commit whatever level of violence and vandalism they choose as long as it's done in the name of native rights or native protesting or whatever.

The soft liberal bigotry of low expectations says we can't hold non-whites to the same standard of behaviour we do white people. I guess they're just not capable of self control or civilized behaviour.

Edited July 2, 2021 by Argus

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Argus said:

Those burning churches are only exercising their legal right to commit whatever level of violence and vandalism they choose as long as it's done in the name of native rights or native protesting or whatever.

The soft liberal bigotry of low expectations says we can't hold non-whites to the same standard of behaviour we do white people. I guess they're just not capable of self control or civilized behaviour.

The outrage is notable by its absence.

[Benz]

The responsibility depends on the angle you take it. From the point of view (action -> consequence -> punishment), a child shouldn't be responsible of the actions of its father.

However, when one of your own is in trouble caused by anyone else, whether it is related to you or not, and can't make it without your help, it is your responsibility to help. That is the principle of living in the society, rather than a far west style where it is everyone for itself.

If the Red River flood Winnipeg area causing huge damages, we are going to help because they are our fellows, not because we have anything to do with the flooding.

If the natives are struggling with the consequences of the actions of our grandfathers, we need to help because they are our fellows, not because it was caused by our grandfathers.

That notion is important to understand for both sides, the one who ask and the one who help.

Edited July 2, 2021 by Benz

[Zeitgeist]

44 minutes ago, Argus said:

Those burning churches are only exercising their legal right to commit whatever level of violence and vandalism they choose as long as it's done in the name of native rights or native protesting or whatever.

The soft liberal bigotry of low expectations says we can't hold non-whites to the same standard of behaviour we do white people. I guess they're just not capable of self control or civilized behaviour.

Your second paragraph is important actually, because when the oppressed become the oppressors the cycle of oppression continues.  We saw this in Zimbabwe and Iraq.  Ethnic or race-based politics is bad news.  Equal treatment for all under the law is critical.  Preferential treatment plants seeds of discord.  

[myata]

2 hours ago, Benz said:

That notion is important to understand for both sides, the one who ask and the one who help.

Indeed there are many angles to this question is far from obvious, and flat. The OP meant cheerful responsibility du jour imposed by the entitled bureaucracies that created these problems on the citizens as usual and always without responsible analysis; discussion; explanation and justifications; did you mention, accountability? always one-way we tell you march and clap your hands, cheerfully comrades.

Edited July 2, 2021 by myata

[myata]

Imagine 50 years from now something is discovered "we should all take responsibility for travel from Wuhan". Of course, but how else? Someone got $20 K monthly (plus allowances) for travel from Wuhan but for you folks, the responsibility. To each their own, all together now!