Alberta Get Out While You Can

[rbacon]

Lately the question of Alberta going for full Independence from Canada is a hot topic in Alberta. What is your opinion? What is your solution to an unworkable centralist undemocratic nightmare called Canada? Let’s get while the gettin’s good

By Leon Harold Craig

This year, Alberta is celebrating a century of existence as part of the Canadian federation of provinces. What better time, then, to take stock of Alberta’s place in this arrangement, of how well it’s been served in the past and what are its prospects for the future? read more

[Riverwind]

All that is true, but what makes Canada’s political sickness practically incurable is that a substantial majority of the citizens east of Thunder Bay are essentially debased.

Like many hard truths people would prefer not to face, this bears repeating: a majority of eastern Canadians are not worthy of their civic heritage, as is shown by their passive acceptance of the revelations of the Gomery commission and their casual indifference to the Liberals’ squalid shenanigans in Parliament.

These comments simply illustrate the ignorance and arrogance of the writer. The fact that he cannot understand the complexities of public opinion in central Canada (and BC for that matter) suggests that he not a particularily deep thinker and his thoughts should be taken in that context.

[crazymf]

Sounds great!! Tell us another fairy tail.

I believe that if Alberta truly has the will and power to separate, we could use the same resources to re-establish the Canadian political landscape.

I would suggest starting with territorial representation in the federal elections rather than by riding. I would like to have my say in who is in government in Ottawa rather than the election be over before I vote.

If we can't start having productive agreeable change, then I'd vote for separation.

[rbacon]

Call a spade a spade. The Liberals are one of the most corrupt and crooked governments in the so called free world history. They are up there on a par with Mexico. Eastern Canadians like the Liberals because they make the money flow into their wallets. The TROC are on the take. They will never bite the hand that feeds them.

[I Miss Trudeau]

Lately the question of Alberta going for full Independence from Canada is a hot topic in Alberta.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't know which Alberta you're talking about, but it is certainly not the one I live in.

[Riverwind]

Call a spade a spade. The Liberals are one of the most corrupt and crooked governments in the so called free world history. They are up there on a par with Mexico. Eastern Canadians like the Liberals because they make the money flow into their wallets. The TROC are on the take. They will never bite the hand that feeds them.

A few Liberal party members in Quebec accused of financial misdoings and that some how translates into the 'Liberals are one of the most corrupt and crooked governments in the so called free world history'. Such rediculous hyperbole just undermines your own position. People in eastern AND western canada are willing to vote Liberal because they have looked at the facts put in front of Gomery and have decided that it is an isolated problem and not representative of all Liberals.

[rbacon]

I am not sure if you have been outside of Edmonton lately or if you read any papers etc. But only 2 Provinces in Canada have Official Independence Parties Alberta and Quebec. www.separationpartyofalberta.com

[Riverwind]

I am not sure if you have been outside of Edmonton lately or if you read any papers etc. But only 2 Provinces in Canada have Official Independence Parties Alberta and Quebec. www.separationpartyofalberta.com

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually Canada has a bumper crop of secession movements in every part of the county.

http://www.answers.com/topic/secessionist-...ments-of-canada

Maybe I will start one - Vive Le Vancouver Independent! It is so much easier to blame other people for problems instead of actually trying to co-operate with people you disagree with in order to find a solution.

[Guest eureka]

Is the good professor back in the asylum yet? Do you think he mught be let out for long enough to come to this site and have his mind straightened out just a little bit?

I haven't read all of his article. Why would any sane person. I do find some of his assertions amusing, though. Are all those "debased" Easterners who comprise much if not most of Alberta's population cleansed by the pure Prairie air? Or are they Albertans in waiting?

[rbacon]

Alberta has tried to fit in for 100 years, that time has passed. TROC is a commie backwater and Alberta has a way of outsmarting and moving on. Albertan's like Democracy not like TROC who like being told what do do and when. BAAABAAABAAA. We will always march to our own drum.

[Riverwind]

Alberta has tried to fit in for 100 years, that time has passed. TROC is a commie backwater and Alberta has a way of outsmarting and moving on. Albertan's like Democracy not like TROC who like being told what do do and when. BAAABAAABAAA. We will always march to our own drum.

When was the last time Albertans voted for someone other than a Conservative? If you want to attach the 'unthinking sheep' label to anyone then it would have to be the Alberta voter. But let me guess: it is ok to be sheep as long as they follow the shepard that you agree with.

[Hawk]

When was the last time Albertans voted for someone other than a Conservative? If you want to attach the 'unthinking sheep' label to anyone then it would have to be the Alberta voter. But let me guess: it is ok to be sheep as long as they follow the shepard that you agree with.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Have you looked at the other options Sparhawk? Didn't think so, if you really want to know why we vote Cons every election look at the Liberals and NDP, do we REALLY want such pathetic excuses for existances run our province?

Of course not, we actually have principles out West and don't like crooks =)

PS Where I live and where my relatives live (Lethbridge and Calgary area) there is ALOT of seperatist power, all my friends are seperatist (I really do mean all, including a Liberal friend of mine haha) and we are talking about holding some meetings for the Lethbridge area seperatists (since currently they are mainly in Calgary and I am a College student, and broke)

IMT, I think you need to get out of your computer room a bit more and notice the Alberta around you. You live in the wrong part of the country dude

[Black Dog]

Alberta has tried to fit in for 100 years, that time has passed. TROC is a commie backwater and Alberta has a way of outsmarting and moving on. Albertan's like Democracy not like TROC who like being told what do do and when. BAAABAAABAAA. We will always march to our own drum.

Yeah: the one-party state loves democracy.

Have you looked at the other options Sparhawk? Didn't think so, if you really want to know why we vote Cons every election look at the Liberals and NDP, do we REALLY want such pathetic excuses for existances run our province?

Actually, based on the November 2004 election results, only 21 per cent of Albertans voted for the Conservatives. More people stayed home than voted.

Funny too, that you can claim the Libs and NDs are "athetic excuses" with no business running our province, while conceding that role to an alcoholic, high-school drop put.

Of course not, we actually have principles out West and don't like crooks =)

So why have they voted for crooks for 30+ years?

PS Where I live and where my relatives live (Lethbridge and Calgary area) there is ALOT of seperatist power, all my friends are seperatist (I really do mean all, including a Liberal friend of mine haha) and we are talking about holding some meetings for the Lethbridge area seperatists (since currently they are mainly in Calgary and I am a College student, and broke)

Better book your venue for that fast. Phone booths are a dying breed.

IMT, I think you need to get out of your computer room a bit more and notice the Alberta around you. You live in the wrong part of the country dude

I'd like to know how much support for seperatism is centred in rural regions (the regions shrinking the fastest in terms of population and economic clout).

By the way, who is the loon that wrote the article above? I would hope that someone weilding the title Professor would be smart enough to know the difference between a scholarly appraisal and a foaming-at-the-mouth polemic (of which his article is a textbook example).

What the professor (as an aside, it is amusing to see a member of the elite who has spent his life securely within the ivory tower of academia rail against "Toronto’s pontificating class and the mandarins of Ottawa") does is indulge in the favorite pasttime of seperatists and Alberta hagiographers: the creation of the Alberta monoculture. All Albertans, acording to the good prof, are gun-ho, God-fearin', gun-shootin', quad-drivin', gay-bashin', USA-lovin' red necks and proud of it. Of course, this assessment is nothing but self-serving bunk.

You know its sad, because there are no doubt many legitimate critiscisms of the ferealist system and many ways the sytem can be fixed to correct the power imbalances in this country (like ditching FPTP). It's too bad so many of these critcism are drowned out by the childish whining of so many in the seperatist movement.

[takeanumber]

Alberta seperatism is fueled by greed and the desire to establish a Christian Theocracy.

Case in point:

Alberta seperatists always complain how the East votes for parties of their choice.

Albertans complain that they don't get enough representation, when in reality, they get nearly as much as they deserve. Alberta: 2 million. GTA: 5 million.

Do the math.

If anything, the GTA gets screwed alot more than Alberta. Moreover, Saskatchewan and Manitoba are over represented.

Alberta Conservatives, being Conservatives, demand more than their fair share of anything, and demand that somebody else pay for it. (You'll note a similar attitude by Quebec, Ontario, and Atlantic Conservatives too). In this case, they demand more seats than they deserve. At whose expense? Why Ontario's of course!

Well sir -- Not everybody in Alberta wants to seperate. I estimate that roughly 40% of Albertans are actually good people, with roughly 60% being patriotic Canadians.

The majority doesn't want to leave, and as such, won't allow such a move.

It's a real nice democracy we got going here in Alberta. I have an idea. How about Ontario votes Conservative IF Alberta votes Liberal provincially.

Sound good?

Won't happen.

In fact, Albertans can be accused of being just as ignorant of their provincial government as Ontarians can be of their Federal government. But don't say that to an Albertan Redneck...they're still in denial over Klein.

[rbacon]

Actually do the math yourself. PEI has 135,000 voters and 4 MP's Alberta has 3,000,000 people and 28 MP's by Canuckistan math that means we should have about 85 MP's. To have the same level of equality. That means it takes 4 votes from Alberta to cancel one vote from back east. That is not equality. And Quebec keeps 75 Mp's even if their population drops to 500 people? What kind of a nuthouse is Canada anyway. 2 plus 2=5

[FTA Lawyer]

I just about fell off my chair when I got to the end of that article to see "Professor" in the title of the author...then I saw "Emeritus" and I realized it must be one of those lost your marbles "retirements"...No No children, Professor Craig just accidentally free-based some crack, he'll be just fine once he retires and gets the stress out of his life...

But seriously though...the sense of proprietary entitlement over "our resources" that is often vehemently displayed by Albertans is hard to fully understand. I was born in Alberta, so I guess I get my 1/3,000,000th of the total assets of the Province whenever I decide to cash in?

If I move to B.C. because I get a job out there do I summarily lose my God-given birthright? Because that doesn't seem fair. And when some Newfie shows up in Fort Mac to work the rigs, is he instantly entitled to his 1/3,000,001th of the pie since he has an Alberta address and casts a ballot here for the Federal Election?

And speaking of Fort Mac, if we're laying claim to resources, shouldn't the City of Fort McMurray separate on its own and tell the rest of the free-loaders in Alberta to go make it on their own? I was born in a small town, so I guess I get shafted and don't get a full 1/3,000,000th after all!

And what would most Albertan's say if you asked them what they would think of the idea of doubling our population...they'd go friggin nuts! Pretty much once (or more) a day I or someone around me bitches about how many people are in Calgary these days and how its just getting too big, too much traffic etc.

Don't get me wrong, I have never cast a ballot that wasn't for a small "c" conservative party, and there are a pile of reforms I think are long overdue for Canadian democracy and I can't say I've never wondered what it would be like to be the Republic of Alberta (like you might wonder what you'd do if you won the 6/49) and I absolutely deplore corruption in government (no matter what camp it comes from) I just can't figure how a presumably highly educated person can write such infantile, made for a tailgate party rhetoric and wonder why everyone isn't jumping on the bandwagon.

FTA Lawyer

[Redneck Yokel]

nvm

[Hawk]

Actually, based on the November 2004 election results, only 21 per cent of Albertans voted for the Conservatives. More people stayed home than voted.

Funny too, that you can claim the Libs and NDs are "athetic excuses" with no business running our province, while conceding that role to an alcoholic, high-school drop put.

Whats really sad is you just proved my point

So why have they voted for crooks for 30+ years?

They haven't

Better book your venue for that fast. Phone booths are a dying breed.

You done? Alright lets get back to the discussion then.

I'd like to know how much support for seperatism is centred in rural regions (the regions shrinking the fastest in terms of population and economic clout).

What does rural or urban have to do with anything other than media saturation (aka propoganda)? Oh, and in answer to your question, no more than is centered in the city.

By the way, who is the loon that wrote the article above? I would hope that someone weilding the title Professor would be smart enough to know the difference between a scholarly appraisal and a foaming-at-the-mouth polemic (of which his article is a textbook example).

What the professor (as an aside, it is amusing to see a member of the elite who has spent his life securely within the ivory tower of academia rail against "Toronto’s pontificating class and the mandarins of Ottawa") does is indulge in the favorite pasttime of seperatists and Alberta hagiographers: the creation of the Alberta monoculture. All Albertans, acording to the good prof, are gun-ho, God-fearin', gun-shootin', quad-drivin', gay-bashin', USA-lovin' red necks and proud of it. Of course, this assessment is nothing but self-serving bunk.

LoL, why is a right-wing professor a nutcase but any left-wing professor a genius? OH MY, could it be the ones who cry 'partisan' oh-so-often are themselves guilty of thier own accusations??? NO of course not, you are far to good for that

Oh, and about 'all Albertans' and the stereotype. Big deal, I mean heck you call us that half the time and your one of us (supposedly) =p

You know its sad, because there are no doubt many legitimate critiscisms of the ferealist system and many ways the sytem can be fixed to correct the power imbalances in this country (like ditching FPTP). It's too bad so many of these critcism are drowned out by the childish whining of so many in the seperatist movement.

Your right, there is a way to fix the Federal system. Throw it out the window and leave it in the past where it belongs. For a 'progressive' party the Libs sure don't like changing anything that threatens their stranglehold on the nation =)

Oh well, rest assured BD, if Seperatism finally flares you can stay in your little room rocking back and forth chanting 'It can't be' for as long as you want but that doesn't change what me and my friends KNOW. We, as Albertans, are pissed at the government and anyone who supports them. Go into a bar and shout 'I love the Liberals, Homosexuals, and Kyoto', I dare you.

Alberta seperatism is fueled by greed and the desire to establish a Christian Theocracy.

Case in point:

Alberta seperatists always complain how the East votes for parties of their choice.

Albertans complain that they don't get enough representation, when in reality, they get nearly as much as they deserve. Alberta: 2 million. GTA: 5 million.

Do the math.

If anything, the GTA gets screwed alot more than Alberta. Moreover, Saskatchewan and Manitoba are over represented.

Alberta Conservatives, being Conservatives, demand more than their fair share of anything, and demand that somebody else pay for it. (You'll note a similar attitude by Quebec, Ontario, and Atlantic Conservatives too). In this case, they demand more seats than they deserve. At whose expense? Why Ontario's of course!

Well sir -- Not everybody in Alberta wants to seperate. I estimate that roughly 40% of Albertans are actually good people, with roughly 60% being patriotic Canadians.

The majority doesn't want to leave, and as such, won't allow such a move.

Your right, we do get what we deserve. The problem is we are giving out more than you deserve, and if we don't have a voice then stop taking our money.

As for Albertans being patriotic, your right. Heck Alberta is the most patriotic province, why do you think we hate the Liberals and NDP so much? Because they aren't Canadian, they are part of the EU (at heart). Alberta is the last bastion of the real Canada, and therefore the last Canadians.

[Black Dog]

Whats really sad is you just proved my point

Not really. That would require you had a point to prove.

They haven't

Sure they have. patronage, corruption, and shady deals are an integral part of Alberta's political culture.

What does rural or urban have to do with anything other than media saturation (aka propoganda)? Oh, and in answer to your question, no more than is centered in the city.

Alberta's political environment is horribly skewed towards rural Alberta. rural Alberta has traditionally been the centre of anti-government (federal and provincial) and right-wing sentiment.

LoL, why is a right-wing professor a nutcase but any left-wing professor a genius? OH MY, could it be the ones who cry 'partisan' oh-so-often are themselves guilty of thier own accusations??? NO of course not, you are far to good for that

Because as I said: the article is a polemic, riddled with stereotypes and caricatures and based on a reality that exists only between the ears of people like the professor.

h, and about 'all Albertans' and the stereotype. Big deal, I mean heck you call us that half the time and your one of us (supposedly) =p

No. I call redencks rednecks. As an Albertan, I know there's a lot more diversity of thought and opinion in this province than the media and assorted crackpots would have us beleive.

Oh well, rest assured BD, if Seperatism finally flares you can stay in your little room rocking back and forth chanting 'It can't be' for as long as you want but that doesn't change what me and my friends KNOW

Tell you what: when a seperation party cracks 1 per cent support, you let me know.

We, as Albertans, are pissed at the government and anyone who supports them. Go into a bar and shout 'I love the Liberals, Homosexuals, and Kyoto', I dare you.

First, I am not a Liberal supporter. Second: most of the bars I go to here in Edmonton (the one's that don't have sawdust on the floor) those sentioments would be greeted with cheers and high fives. WHich only goes to show how wrong your sterotyping of Albertans is.

The reason why seperation will never get a foothold in Alberta is because it's based on bitterness, anger and resentment. There's nothing positive about it.

Unlike Quebec, Alberta doesn't have a unique culture, or a true national identity to draw on. Just spluttering rage.

As for Albertans being patriotic, your right. Heck Alberta is the most patriotic province, why do you think we hate the Liberals and NDP so much? Because they aren't Canadian, they are part of the EU (at heart). Alberta is the last bastion of the real Canada, and therefore the last Canadians.

The Canada you long for never existed.

[takeanumber]

Your right, we do get what we deserve. The problem is we are giving out more than you deserve, and if we don't have a voice then stop taking our money.

As for Albertans being patriotic, your right. Heck Alberta is the most patriotic province, why do you think we hate the Liberals and NDP so much? Because they aren't Canadian, they are part of the EU (at heart). Alberta is the last bastion of the real Canada, and therefore the last Canadians.

Myth 1: Alberta gives more than it gets.

Fact 1: Alberta net outflows: 4000 dollars per capita.

Fact 2: You'd never see any of that money if it stayed in the province.

Fact 3: Alberta contributes the fewest soldiers to Canada's armed forces per capita.

Fact 4: Alberta receives 55% of its spending through the CSHT and tax points.

Myth 2: Alberta is the most patriotic country.

see: Fact 3.

Fact 5: Famous quote of Klein: "Let the Eastern Bastards freeze in the Dark!"

Fact 6: The Calgary School of Thought, which many/most Albertans subscribe to, holds that some men are 'natural slaves'.

Hardly patriotic. Hardly Canadian.

Most Albertans have demonstrated time and again, that in spite of all the aid lent to them (hay during the drought, equalization during hard times, additional labour during boom times), they appreciate it up until the next oil boom...then suddenly they're just the cock of walk arn't they?

When they're down and out, they're all 'gimme gimme gimme'.

When oil is booming, they're all "no soup for you!"

It's a disgusting, un-Canadian attitude.

[Hawk]

Myth 1:  Alberta gives more than it gets.

Fact 1:  Alberta net outflows:  4000 dollars per capita.

Fact 2:  You'd never see any of that money if it stayed in the province.

Maybe not in my own pocket, but without federal taxes (over 200 dollars every 2 weeks for me alone, and I am a bloody student) I would be alot happier. Not to mention without that outflow the government could use it for our own rural police force etc

Fact 3:  Alberta contributes the fewest soldiers to Canada's armed forces per capita.

Then why are the soldiers being sent to these hotzones coming mainly from Alberta?

On a sidenote, with the current state of our armed forces I can't blame anyone that doesn't want to join it. I mean heck, more of our soldiers are killed by our own machine malfunctions than killed in active duty =p

Fact 4:  Alberta receives 55% of its spending through the CSHT and tax points.

Really? Source please?

Oh, and the CSHT was created to help out economies not dependant on equalization. Yet ironically Alberta still recieves far far less in CSHT transfers than we pay out in equalization.

I found it funny when reading up on CSHT at this site

(http://www.fin.gc.ca/FEDPROV/frmwrk_e.html)

The part that talks about how Alberta wasn't always free of equalization payments, no we actually got around 92 million over a period of 8 years or so. Funny how I hear people say 'The East helped Alberta before Alberta was rich', 92 million is help? I mean, seriously, you give us 92 million, smash us with NEP and blame us for the complete crash we experienced (courtesy of PET), then leave us to starve and mock us as we pile our money into developing our oil industry. Oh, and lets not forget, you steal 167 billion more from Alberta since 1961 in extra taxes.

Average contribution to equalization for Alberta (per capita) - 4000

Totals to about: 12 billion yearly

Average contribution to equalization for Ontario (per capita) - 2400

Totals to about: 23 billion yearly

Yeah sure looks fair to me =p Oh, that 92 million will certainly be remembered and cherished forever, it will cause us to forgive all and forget all. Thanks but no thanks.

Myth 2:  Alberta is the most patriotic country.

see:  Fact 3.

Fact 5:  Famous quote of Klein:  "Let the Eastern Bastards freeze in the Dark!"

Fact 6:  The Calgary School of Thought, which many/most Albertans subscribe to, holds that some men are 'natural slaves'.

Hardly patriotic.  Hardly Canadian.

Most Albertans have demonstrated time and again, that in spite of all the aid lent to them (hay during the drought, equalization during hard times, additional labour during boom times), they appreciate it up until the next oil boom...then suddenly they're just the cock of walk arn't they? 

When they're down and out, they're all 'gimme gimme gimme'. 

When oil is booming, they're all "no soup for you!"

It's a disgusting, un-Canadian attitude.

Almost like "Screw the West, we'll take the rest" - Liberal Campaign worker (1980)

OH and PLEASE refer to my previous point about the 'help' you have lent Also, thanks for the aid when we got flooded... oh wait, there was none Thats ok, we took care of it, as usual... you see, Alberta doesn't depend on the nanny-state, we like taking care of ourselves

[Hawk]

Not really. That would require you had a point to prove.

I did, but wait it was probably over your head.

You posted this:

Funny too, that you can claim the Libs and NDs are "athetic excuses" with no business running our province, while conceding that role to an alcoholic, high-school drop put.

To which I claimed you proved my point, which was by implication that an alcoholic, high-school drop out does a better job than the Libs and NDP =)

Thanks

Sure they have. patronage, corruption, and shady deals are an integral part of Alberta's political culture.

Sources? The burden of proof is on the prosecution

Alberta's political environment is horribly skewed towards rural Alberta. rural Alberta has traditionally been the centre of anti-government (federal and provincial) and right-wing sentiment.

Of course, but then again most of Alberta is rural so its not horribly skewed. Not to mention Calgary (one of Canada's fastest growing cities) is a Conservative bastion, so your 'rural' theory kind of died.

Because as I said: the article is a polemic, riddled with stereotypes and caricatures and based on a reality that exists only between the ears of people like the professor.

LoL so its exactly like a left-wing professor's article

No. I call redencks rednecks. As an Albertan, I know there's a lot more diversity of thought and opinion in this province than the media and assorted crackpots would have us beleive.

Good, now do more than talk the talk.

Tell you what: when a seperation party cracks 1 per cent support, you let me know.

Been there done that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alberta_separatism

First, I am not a Liberal supporter. Second: most of the bars I go to here in Edmonton (the one's that don't have sawdust on the floor) those sentioments would be greeted with cheers and high fives. WHich only goes to show how wrong your sterotyping of Albertans is.

The reason why seperation will never get a foothold in Alberta is because it's based on bitterness, anger and resentment. There's nothing positive about it.

Unlike Quebec, Alberta doesn't have a unique culture, or a true national identity to draw on. Just spluttering rage.

Rage has its place, heck democracy wouldn't exist without rage. The problem is the government keeps rubbing salt in our wounds, so expect us to get pissed. We would be irrational zombies if we took this crap without at least complaining.

Oh and about your bars, you should stay away from those gay joints they are bad for your health... literally

My dare still stands, go into a bar and do that on video, and it has to be a full bar =)

PS I am an Albertan, I don't stereotype. Oh, and we have more national identity than Canada. Canada doesn't even have a culture, and its flag is barely 40 years old.. get a culture of your own before you criticize mine

The Canada you long for never existed.

Yeah it did, before Pearson came in it did. Since then our country has been dominated by Liberals that have drastically changed us into the nanny-state we are today. Do you think the Libs fixed seperatism? They didn't. Do you think the Libs fixed the divide between ethnic groups? They didn't. Do you think our society gets along more than it did 40 years ago? It doesn't, look at our crime rate increase, look at racial crimes increase, hate crimes, etc etc. The Liberal dynasty has destroyed this country, and by the time you realize this I hope to be contentedly drinking beer with my redneck friends in the Republic of Alberta while the rest of you and your enlightened Liberal/NDP buddies wallow in complete poverty =) Oh, and don't try to border jump when it happens... we'll be waiting

[Guest eureka]

I have tried to explain this to you previously, Hawk. Are your studies so intense that you can absorb no facts from life beyond your classrooms and bars?

Alberta received "equalization" from 1957 to 1964. It received it in those years only because that it is when their first came into being an equalization program dafined and tied to a formula.

Prior to that, Alberta received benefits from the federal government just like every other "have-not" province. In fact, from the day that the province of Alberta was formed, it received money from the federal government: initially on a per capita basis.

Only since oil reached a certain level of production has Alberta not been supported by the federal (read Eastern Canada) government.

Do you deserve what you get from oil as you claim? The answer is no. The oil wealth is entirely serendipitous and you and no other Albertan deserves credit. You are simply very fortunate and should thank your licky stars that the federal government gave you control over natural resources when Albertan was formed from a desperately poor area of the territories.

NO province has the "ownership" of off-shore resources. So again, thank your lucky stars,if money is the only thing in your life, that you are landlocked.

[takeanumber]

hen why are the soldiers being sent to these hotzones coming mainly from Alberta?

CFB Edmonton is overwhelmingly Eastern in origin.

Newfies make up the largest component of PPCLI, followed by Ontario, Quebec. Albertans make up the tiniest minority of PPCLI, less than 5%.

Nice try though.

Albertans complain bitterly about representation, but can't even run a proper democracy in their own province. The electoral map is totally gettymandered (with some ridings being overrepresented by as much as 45%; and there isn't even an competitive electoral system, in spite of a provincial Liberal party that is farther right than most province's right wing party.

[Hawk]

I have tried to explain this to you previously, Hawk. Are your studies so intense that you can absorb no facts from life beyond your classrooms and bars?

Alberta received "equalization" from 1957 to 1964. It received it in those years only because that it is when their first came into being an equalization program dafined and tied to a formula.

Prior to that, Alberta received benefits from the federal government just like every other "have-not" province. In fact, from the day that the province of Alberta was formed, it received money from the federal government: initially on a per capita basis.

Ok I showed you facts and figures, you showed me rhetoric and opinion (give me sources or numbers). But I am not all that surprised, you are one poster that I have yet to understand why you believe what you believe =p Emotion < reason.

Only since oil reached a certain level of production has Alberta not been supported by the federal (read Eastern Canada) government.

FACT: Alberta has recieved not a cent of equalization since the 1960s, instead we have given out hundreds of billions more than we recieved for ANY reason (be it CSHT or other aid)

Do you deserve what you get from oil as you claim? The answer is no. The oil wealth is entirely serendipitous and you and no other Albertan deserves credit. You are simply very fortunate and should thank your licky stars that the federal government gave you control over natural resources when Albertan was formed from a desperately poor area of the territories.

Thank our lucky stars?

The original provinces always had natural resource rights from the getgo, but I guess that doesnt mean anything... because hey, its not like all the provinces have EVER been equal in the confederation. Heck, when Albertans were dying of starvation we barely got a nod from the East. So yeah we were formed from a desperately poor area of the territories, but unlike the rest of Canada (that was basically giving us the finger) when we came out of that dark time we invested in our resources.

Are you arguing that our oil is the only reason Alberta is doing good? Thats b*llshit, Sask. has oil, BC has oil, Manitoba has oil, the Territories have TONS of resources (diamonds, oil etc). Yet they aren't as well off as Alberta, so its NOT just the presence of the resources it is the fact that Alberta sacrificed at one time to gain later.

We can thank our ancestors for their sacrifices and hard work, because we are enjoying it today. The reason I am a Seperatist is because I believe in carrying on the tradition of my ancestors, and protecting Alberta's future generations from the Canadian public who, while simultaneously stealing out of our pockets, have no problem with making it known they hate our 'have' province.

NO province has the "ownership" of off-shore resources. So again, thank your lucky stars,if money is the only thing in your life, that you are landlocked.

What would that have to do with anything? We would get our land resources one way or the other =p