First Liberal bill defeated

[kimmy]

CBC: details

I'm puzzled. Is splitting International Trade and Foreign Affairs into separate ministries something that the opposition parties feel their constituents are deeply concerned about? I'm kind of guessing no; I kind of doubt anybody outside the civil service would notice much change either way.

The article says Conservatives voted against the bill in protest of the Liberals taking too long to table the results of a foreign policy review. Be that as it may, this isn't exactly what everybody promised on election night. All the parties talked about a spirit of cooperation to make the parliament work for Canadians. Doesn't exactly sound like that happened in this instance. This sounds like a complete breakdown of cooperation.

-kimmy

[I Miss Trudeau]

This is pretty much why the liberals will remain in power. The opposition parties (right and left) are incapable of doing anything but disagreeing and hindering, even when it makes them look ridiculous. Someone should explain to them that being part of the opposition doesn't mean you have to oppose everything.

[August1991]

Conservative, New Democrat and Bloc MPs joined forces to defeat Bill C-31 by a vote of 150 to 125.

The Liberals have about 130 seats. Who joined them?

I think this is just "muscle flexing". Now, whether it's to be a boxing match or a Mr. Universe contest, we don't know.

Trudeau and Stanfield respected each other. I suspect Martin and Harper loathe each other. Who knows though.

[knn]

kimmy Posted: Feb 16 2005, 01:52 AM 

I'm puzzled. Is splitting International Trade and Foreign Affairs into separate ministries something that the opposition parties feel their constituents are deeply concerned about?

I can guarantee that nobody gives a rat's behind about this issue. It will fade faster than yesterday's newspaper.

The opposition parties like to think that every small gripe they have in sync with their "consitituents". Sadly they waste so much time and energy on dragging things out on petty concerns that their consitutents become frustrated when they don't get on with more important matters, such as health care, the economy. etc.

[Fortunata]

Well the real test will be the budget. Let's see how much Martin gives away to get the opposition's agreement on that. In reality, I don't think he would have to bend a bit because the CPC don't want an election right now. They haven't even had their policy convention yet, go through two elections without official policy, just Harper spouting off the cuff? Voter's won't like that me thinks.

[Guest eureka]

I am equally puzzled, Kimmy. It seems to me that those two departments go hand in glove and demand one direction. Trade is a component of foreign relations.

I also think this is no trivial issue and could lead to mixed signals of our intentions abroad as well as an unhealthy strain between the ministries as their interests diverge.

[Grantler]

...maybe not dick waving...but sabre rattling might be a better term...

Either way, yes, its a way of showing Martin how it now stands in government. To think that this will happen all the time is rediculous.

Remember, every election puts the jobs of the members on the line...they do not want that.

Would you want to risk being unemployed?

[kimmy]

I am equally puzzled, Kimmy. It seems to me that those two departments go hand in glove and demand one direction. Trade is a component of foreign relations.

I also think this is no trivial issue and could lead to mixed signals of our intentions abroad as well as an unhealthy strain between the ministries as their interests diverge.

I don't mean to downplay the significance of those two departments, Eureka. It might be an important issue, but I doubt it is a "hot button" issue for Canadians of any political stripe. It appears to be primarily an administrative issue. Which, most likely, is why the Conservatives picked this particular vote to defeat-- there's likely much less chance of it coming back to haunt them in the form of campaign rhetoric. "The Conservatives defeated a bill that would have split Trade and Foreign Affairs into two different departments!!" is not likely to score points on the campaign trail; "The Conservatives defeated a bill that would have provided more benefits to seniors!" or "The Conservatives defeated a bill that would have provided tougher regulation of kiddie porn!" could have been tremendously effective campaign material. In hindsight it only makes sense that the opposition parties would pick a vote of little interest to most Canadians.

This article provides more background on the issue. While it initially appeared as nothing more than sabre rattling, there does appear to have been some discussion between Foreign Affairs critic Day, Trade critic Stronach, and Harper on how to proceed on the vote.

http://politicswatch.com/house2-feb16-2005.htm

The Conservatives claim that the Liberals have provided no rationale for separating the departments, and suggest that people in the departments are opposed to it. The Liberals say this has been in the works for a year, will continue, and that legislation will eventually be passed to reflect the administrative changes already being made; they dismiss the Conservatives defeat of their bill as playing games of power-politics.

-kimmy

[Grantler]

Really, how else can it be taken?

The real test of any government is a money bill so get a hold of yourselves for this one.

[Newfie Canadian]

That's a nice link kimmy, thanks.

We all knew the Liberals weren't going to get every bill passed. I wouldn't start raising eyebrows until there's talk of scuttling the budget.

Just 6 more days til it comes out.