Your thoughts on official unilingualism?

[TimG]

Question, does recognising the English and French tier in official bilingualism constitute racism?

A common language is a necessary element in any functioning society. Sharing a common language does not presume any ethnic or racial background. Nor does it mean people cannot speak other languages. By their very nature indigenous governments must exclude people who are not indigenous because they would cease to be indigenous governments when the non-indigenous population is larger.

[Benz]

There can be no 'indigenous peoples' tier of government because that is simply racist at best and modern day feudalism at worst. Governments of multi-racial societies have to be based on the principal that all citizens no matter what their DNA have an equal say in their governance. This requirement precludes an government run exclusively for the benefit of a minority of the population.

The way Machjo worded it is indeed a bit clumsy. I have often think about the solutions to make sure the nations of this country can both respect the will of the nations without creating racial or cultural base system. It's not obvious. The more the government is centralized, the bigger for a distinction per individual is needed. I also think it is not a good approach, even if it is tempting.

The best example is the current "indian law" which is still active. Natives have individual benefits that other canadians don't. On first sight, it looks unfair to other canadians but, it's a trap. It's a tactic, a diversion, to not allow natives to have a say as a nation. Easier to manipulate individuals than a group of people under one bloc.

There are two notions we must not mix up. Language and culture/nation. Regarding the language, the current system might not be perfect but it's not that bad. With some adjustment, it will feed the need of all canadians. The problem lies for the nations. They are all drowned into the majority. That is not acceptable.

A nation status is needed for Québec and the other natives. It's important regarding the constitution and the supreme rules that are applied to all canadians. It's not acceptable that the english majority fix the rules only because they outnumber the other nations.

All canadians, whether they are natives, Québécois or english Canadians should all follow the same rules. All individuals must be equal. However, they are from different nations, therefore, the nations should have a say to the supreme rules. A constitution should not be modified by the majority without the consent of the other nations. All nations must agree.

However, there are so many native nations and they are all so small, giving them all a sort of veto would rather condemn the constitution to be totally paralized. They should count as one voice on the constitution. The majority of the natives, plus Québec, plus the english Canada should be required to modify the constitution.

The House of Common with the representatives is ok like that. I do not care about the fact that it is dominated by english canadians. What I do care is that they can put their nose in matters that should rather go in the provincial/reserves sand box. I would just decentralise it a little. But then again, most of the rest of canada is happy with the current structure. So allowing an opt out with full compensation as discussed in 1981 and with Meech 1987-90 would just be fine.

[taxme]

When is English Canada going to wake up. The 1st trudeau (who IMO was a closet separatist like his son) ripped the soul out of English Canada while protecting Quebec. A English Canadian can't work for the federal government, if he cant do French, which is totally wrong. The French have way to much say for the size of their population.

A book written many decades ago called "Bilingual Today, French Tomorrow? pretty much explained as to how papa Trudeau and his gang of communists had plans for just what the title of that book said. In Hansard, liberal Serge Joyal had said that Trudeaus aim was to turn Canada into a french speaking nation. And today it has almost come to that reality. The french pretty much run Ottawa and by controlling Ottawa Quebec pretty much gets to control the rest of Canada. We now have a unilingual french speaking province, and the rest of the country is pretty much bilingual. The take over looks complete according to that book. Just about all of our PM's of Canada have come from Quebec, and the french still cry. Indeed, Trudeau has done just what he had planned to do and has ripped the soul out of English Canada, and the English have just sat back and allowed it to happen without a whimper. Quebec just laughs at English Canada because the Anglophones keep asking for it. As if bilingualism was not enough of an insult nonsense they now have multiculturalism being dumped on them again without a whimper. No wonder Anglophones are treated like fools.

They deserve what they are getting because they just sit back like a bunch of wimps and cowards, and continue to sit back and say nothing. Sad.

[taxme]

Tu serais beaucoup plus intelligent si tu savais parler français. Cela te ferait le plus grand bien. If the english canadian "can't do french", then he does not deserve the job. A more superior french speaking person will take its place. That is the way it is. Intelligent people get better jobs.

The french are not superior in any way. They are a bunch of con artists. They have gotten where they are today because English Canada allowed bilingualism to run amok and take over their lives and their country. The Anglophones have always been and always will be suckers and fools for all other ethnic groups because we like to appear to play fair ball. The Anglos will say ok we will give them a little. But in the end they end up losing a lot.

The rest of Canada should have stayed unilingual English, and Quebec should have been declared a bilingual province. The billions of tax dollars blown on bilingualism since papa Trudeau shoved french down the Anglophones throat has been pretty much blown on trying to save a dying useless french language. The french took advantage of the Anglophones weakness, and it worked out well for them. They now pretty much run the country.

[taxme]

Wasn't Hector Langevin, a French Canadian and the Federal Minister of Public Works under John A. MacDonald the one who established the residential school system?

Did French-language residential schools not exist in Quebec?

Let's not pretend that French was not imposed too. This is not to excuse the imposition of English, but the French weren't angels either. Let's be honest. Many French-speakers worked in the residential school system too.

You are not suppose to say things bad about Quebec like that here in politically correct Canada. It makes you look like you are anti-french. We have hate laws here in Canada, don't you know? Only the English are suppose to be criticized for their part in the creation and running of the residential schools because that is more in line with being politically correct. Some peoples kids.

[?Impact]

We now have a unilingual french speaking province, and the rest of the country is pretty much bilingual.

You can get by quite easily speaking English in Montreal, but try and get by speaking French in Saint John, Halifax, Charlottetown, Toronto, Winnipeg, Regina, Edmonton, or Victoria. I doubt you would do much better in Fredericton (even though the province is officially bilingual) either but I haven`t spent much time there so I can`t say for sure.

[TimG]

There are two notions we must not mix up. Language and culture/nation. Regarding the language, the current system might not be perfect but it's not that bad. With some adjustment, it will feed the need of all canadians. The problem lies for the nations. They are all drowned into the majority. That is not acceptable.

Quebec nationalists are a bit hypocritical in this point. At one level they expect immigrants who move to Quebec to adopt French as their primary language and otherwise comply with rules set by the majority. On the other hand, they object when the majority in Canada sets rules for things which are completely disconnected from culture or language. My position is there is a need for a common language and the efforts to protect the status of French in Quebec are reasonable even if they are taken to silly extremes at times. But outside of the need for a common language governments all citizens need a right to participate in and have an equal control over government and policy. Giving exclusive control over government to a particular ethnic group is quite abhorrent. Granting special privileges to certain citizens simply because of their ancestry is even more odious and not a lot different from feudal states where one's rights were determined by one's connection to the nobility.

IOW, it is reasonable for a major linguistic group like Quebec to want local control over things that impact their language because Quebec is otherwise a democracy where all Canadian citizens have an equal vote. It is not reasonable for 'indigenous governments' to be given control over territory with a non-native population unless they are willing to extend the equal right of participation in government and policy making to non-native Canadian citizens.

Edited September 24, 2016 by TimG

[cybercoma]

You can get by quite easily speaking English in Montreal, but try and get by speaking French in Saint John, Halifax, Charlottetown, Toronto, Winnipeg, Regina, Edmonton, or Victoria. I doubt you would do much better in Fredericton (even though the province is officially bilingual) either but I haven`t spent much time there so I can`t say for sure.

I can tell you for sure that it helps to speak English in Fredericton. Moncton, more specifically Dieppe, is the only major city in NB where you can get by speaking only French.

[taxme]

English all the way.

I will have a drink to that common sense and logic idea. One country, one language. Two languages, two divisions, two problems. More languages, more divisions, bigger problems.

[Benz]

I can tell you for sure that it helps to speak English in Fredericton. Moncton, more specifically Dieppe, is the only major city in NB where you can get by speaking only French.

33% of the people in NB are french. Do you think they all live in Dieppe?

[taxme]

hmmm, I may surpise you but this time, I agree for a portion of what you are saying. I also believe that multiculturalism is slowly destroying your culture and I understand your concern. I am in favor of pluriculturalism (also called interculturalism) and I am very against multiculturalism. I see a major différence in those two approaches.

I think you are confused regarding the bilinguism. It has nothing to do with the multiculturalism. They are two different topics. Bilinguism is essential to keep both nations (English canada and Québec) along in the same country/federation. My language is french, if Canada is my country, I expect the federal to serve me in my language wherever I live in this country. Otherwise, Canada is no longer my country. Plain and simple. Therefore, if you think bilinguism should be shut down, you should also invite Québec to leave with no harm feeling. It was fun, we tried, let's move on to something else. But it has nothing to do with multiculturalism.

You come from Montréal and you are not aware why those laws exist? You may not know Montréal as much as you think then. Why don't ask the English canadian jew Mitch Garber regarding the language rules? Those rules are not offensives, they are protectives. I think BC and Ontario should have the same rules as well. Even if the English language is not as threatened as the French language is now, it might be a matter of time before it gets there. You are right to blame the multiculturalism for that.

You are talking about NB. NB has one third of its population speaking french. If there is one province that has to be bilingual, that's the one. Yet, you think they are doing a mistake. What is going in your mind? How do see things? Who are the Acadians for you? Second class citizens? How come you are afraid that the canadians become like acadians, and at the same time, you have no regards for them. Why are you avoid the cultural genocide done against the french in PEI, NS and Manitoba? You are complaining about a bilingual Ontario, but Ontario has the second highest number of french outside Québec. Not in percentage, in number. Unilingual french Québec? Are you aware that all English people in Québec are capable to receive English services from the provincial government? The anglo-Quebecers do not have to use the supreme court to subscribe their kids to school.

What are the french for you? Are they just your possession? The birtish won the war few centuries ago, therefore, you can dispose them as you wish? Do the anglos and the francos are sharing this country or it belongs only to the anglos? The anglos are the majority, therefore, the french must shut up and follow their will? How does that work for you? It's funny because at the very same time, you are starting to fear the grip of your culture on this country sliping away with the arrival of those new canadians. The multiculturalism allows them to be anything but canadians. Do you remember why P.E. Trudeau wanted the multiculturalism? The real reason? Do you know why he totally avoided the recommandation of a biculturalism from the Laurentdeau-Dunton commission? Have you ever heard of it? There are missing holes in your understanding of the situation regarding the two solitudes French/English.

Can you imagine an English speaking province declaring itself unilingual English? The federal government and the lame duck Anglo media would go ballistic. They would all call this an act of discrimination and bias and racism if they did such a thing. The Anglophones are their own worse enemy.

I know that in Quebec they have a law that says that no one can put up a business sign in English only. In effect the Anglophones are being denied their rights as to how they want to conduct their business. If any other province did the same thing and denied a french person from being able to put up a french sign only they would be attacked tout suite by the federal government and the liberal useless media which would begin would by shouting that this is an act of hatred being shown to the french and all the other different ethnic people in Canada. It would be called racism.

The Anglophones can't win in Canada anymore to protect their language and culture because to be honest here this is not their country anymore. It belongs to the french and to the rest of the other cultures out there. English for most people now is just needed and used in order to have to deal with the government, and some English businesses. Otherwise, in most cases, the governments are pretty much now serving other races and their cultures in their own languages. Canada has pretty much become a multicultural country that now pretty much says to all new immigrants that there is no real need to have to assimilate, and English is not important anymore. At least that is the way I read things now.

[Benz]

I will have a drink to that common sense and logic idea. One country, one language. Two languages, two divisions, two problems. More languages, more divisions, bigger problems.

ok then. So let's get rid of english. Because I will not let that happen while I am alive. What are you going to do? Are you going to do a R.H. Bain of yourself?

The french are not superior in any way. They are a bunch of con artists. They have gotten where they are today because English Canada allowed bilingualism to run amok and take over their lives and their country. The Anglophones have always been and always will be suckers and fools for all other ethnic groups because we like to appear to play fair ball. The Anglos will say ok we will give them a little. But in the end they end up losing a lot.

You are too hard on your predecessors. They did ban french in many provinces and they manage to genocide that culture. However, it is true that they failed in Québec. You seems to forget that they tried very hard in the past. Thet did try to erase the french culture for several years. They tried but they failed. At the rebellions of 1837, the french were forbidden to have a french journal. The only one french journal was named Le Canadien. But eh, despite all the oppression, the french managed to survive. It's because they survive that now Canada has to offer minimum of respect to what is left of the french outside Québec. Very interesting how those very tiny communities survival are making you feel like a major fail of Canada's imperialism.

The rest of Canada should have stayed unilingual English

Stayed? Stayed? The english canada is more english than it ever was. When Manitoba was founded, the french were already there. At the creation of Canada, the french were 35% of the population. The english had to ban french from public schools to destroy that culture. You have a huge problem with the reality and your own history my friend.

and Quebec should have been declared a bilingual province

You are such an hypocrit. That pityful mindset is a heritage of the former british empire colonizing worlds and destroying cultures. Get over it. You are thinking like a loser. It's time to move on and accept that you cannot destroy everyone. Québec is already more bilingual than any other province. We have more bilingual people than the self-claimed bilingual NB. If you think that having bilingual street names in Ontario is enough to say that it's a bilingual province, then you are living in an alternate reality. It does not work that way.

The billions of tax dollars blown on bilingualism since papa Trudeau shoved french down the Anglophones throat has been pretty much blown on trying to save a dying useless french language. The french took advantage of the Anglophones weakness, and it worked out well for them. They now pretty much run the country

That is because in your mindset, a good canadian, is an english canadian. You believe that french are not canadians. They do not deserves the same respect. You do not want to share the country with them. You want a total domination. Therefore, allowing french to be served in their language is a failure for you. That is exactly what you choose to be. The loser that can't stand the fact that you are too weak to fight the french and get rid of them. That's also why you hate your fellows that now accept that they must respect the presence of the french like brothers of the same family. You never accepted the french in the family. The job is not done yet and you need to get rid of the french once and for all. So you can finally get rid of the language you consider dying and useless.

Yes, the french are not superior than other language. It's you, that is inferior to all existing humans on earth. An inferiority that you choose to be. Afflicted by your own decision to be that loser.

Let me know whenever you decide to be more open-minded redirect your critizism into a constructive opinion.

[Benz]

Can you imagine an English speaking province declaring itself unilingual English? The federal government and the lame duck Anglo media would go ballistic. They would all call this an act of discrimination and bias and racism if they did such a thing. The Anglophones are their own worse enemy.

I know that in Quebec they have a law that says that no one can put up a business sign in English only. In effect the Anglophones are being denied their rights as to how they want to conduct their business. If any other province did the same thing and denied a french person from being able to put up a french sign only they would be attacked tout suite by the federal government and the liberal useless media which would begin would by shouting that this is an act of hatred being shown to the french and all the other different ethnic people in Canada. It would be called racism.

The Anglophones can't win in Canada anymore to protect their language and culture because to be honest here this is not their country anymore. It belongs to the french and to the rest of the other cultures out there. English for most people now is just needed and used in order to have to deal with the government, and some English businesses. Otherwise, in most cases, the governments are pretty much now serving other races and their cultures in their own languages. Canada has pretty much become a multicultural country that now pretty much says to all new immigrants that there is no real need to have to assimilate, and English is not important anymore. At least that is the way I read things now.

You are not wrong with your observations, but you are bias in your conclusions.

I have no problem of what-so-ever if Ontario declares itself an english provinces and force english language to be shown up alot any other used languages, just like we do here in Québec. I would not called that racist. I would just think it is normal and legitimated. French is not a threat to your culture, but the number of arriving immigrants that do not even try to assimilate to any of the english or french culture, can become a threat. I agree with you on that. But you are so used to hate french that you just see us as ennemies and you are the only one to blame for. It is a choice you make.

In Québec the english can use their language, can be served in their language in the provincial institutions and can live a normal life in english without a problem. Yet, you get mad because they cannot do business without french. Like if doing business without the french language in the only french province is something abnormal. You do not claim the english in Québec to do business in their language, they already do. You claim the right to avoid french language in the only one french province of north america. That f---ing plain stupid. We help the stupid people to avoid stupidity. We protect them from themselve. The majority of english speaking people do understand why the rules are there and they respect those. Except some whinning ones.

You want BC to have a rule that force everyone to have english signs along any other foreign languages? No problem. I will be glad to help you with that. But you fear me, because you have been raised and conditionned to hate me. Just because I am french.

[Benz]

Quebec nationalists are a bit hypocritical in this point. At one level they expect immigrants who move to Quebec to adopt French as their primary language and otherwise comply with rules set by the majority.

No. We do not expect them to have french as main language. We expect them to use french for common use with other people. We do not mind if the immigrants speak spannish, finnish, turkish, tamil, tagalog or anything else. We do not mind if the language at home is not french. What we do mind is, the french must be the common language of use with the others. If you think that is hypocrisy, then the whole word, including yourself, is.

On the other hand, they object when the majority in Canada sets rules for things which are completely disconnected from culture or language.

You are mixing up the language and the cultural values. The french in France speak french like us with a different accent. Are we the same people? No. We are two different nations. We have our own identity. We are also different from the english canadians on some values. Not alot of differences, I am sure we can get along very well but, we must respect our differences and either bring those laws on a more local application or negociate them until we agree. That is exactely the problem right now. The english Canada does not mind if we do not agree and they proceed anyway.

My position is there is a need for a common language and the efforts to protect the status of French in Quebec are reasonable even if they are taken to silly extremes at times. But outside of the need for a common language governments all citizens need a right to participate in and have an equal control over government and policy. Giving exclusive control over government to a particular ethnic group is quite abhorrent. Granting special privileges to certain citizens simply because of their ancestry is even more odious and not a lot different from feudal states where one's rights were determined by one's connection to the nobility.

I agree with you. Québec is not asking for their citizens to follow different rules. Québec is asking to be considered as a nation and have a say on those rules so we can fix them together. Once we agree on the rules, everyone must follow those rules, no matter what culture we come from. This is how it works in a normal union.

IOW, it is reasonable for a major linguistic group like Quebec to want local control over things that impact their language because Quebec is otherwise a democracy where all Canadian citizens have an equal vote. It is not reasonable for 'indigenous governments' to be given control over territory with a non-native population unless they are willing to extend the equal right of participation in government and policy making to non-native Canadian citizens.

Well, the native sovereignty issue is not an easy one to solve. Some are in a much better position than others to manage their sovereignty on a reasonable territory. Your point is valid and I must admit I do not have the perfect solution in hands. It is easy to recognize the Cree or Innuit or Innu with a specific territory. It's not in the case of the Mohawks, Huron, Mi'kmaq and many others. Some of them are surrounded by non-natives and it is almost impossible to extend the territory. More discussions are needed to come to a solution that could be acceptable for everyone.

[?Impact]

Québec is already more bilingual than any other province. We have more bilingual people than the self-claimed bilingual NB. If you think that having bilingual street names in Ontario is enough to say that it's a bilingual province, then you are living in an alternate reality. It does not work that way.

To be fair, go outside of the Greater Montreal Area and there is very little English. Yes, in certain professional segments like technology it is well understood but not amongst the larger population. Still overall I agree that Quebec is more French/English bilingual (both total number, and also percent of population) than any other province.

Ontario does have a sizeable French speaking population in the north, I would not like the see Ontario declared an English province.

There are some border towns and even rural areas along the Ottawa river in both provinces where there is a mixed population. I think the French in Hawkesbury are mostly bi-lingual, as with the English in Hull. I know there is some English rural population in the Pontiac region, not sure their level of bilingualism.

33% of the people in NB are french. Do you think they all live in Dieppe?

I think the point cybercoma was trying to make is major cities. Most of the French in NB seem to be in rural northern areas. I guess Edmundston qualifies as a city, but it would be hard to call it major.

The majority of english speaking people do understand why the rules are there and they respect those. Except some whinning ones.

I agree many of the rules for business make sense, but some are stupid. The old apostrophe hunt and some of the current attempt to changes names are brainless, a business name is multi-national and part of their identity. If the business is local (e.g. Swartz's) then it made sense, but national (e.g. Eaton's) and International didn't (still trying to think of an international example from that era). The font size rule is idiotic, it just makes many signs hard to read (e.g. in fast food restaurants); yes French should be prominent (ie. on top) but if the business wants to serve English clientele then don't make it difficult. Implementation is often the bigger problem, every so often you hear about dumb hunts by the language cops.

[Machjo]

An interesting historical fact is that Germans sent their children to school in German in Berlin Ontario until WWI. I believe Ukrainians did the same in the prairies.

The reason it stopped was not due to the free market but government suppression just as had happened to French.

The reality is that English and French are more dominant in Canada than they ever were before.

Wawa was the dominant trade language between English, French, indigenous, Spanish, and Chinese throughout the Western side of the Rockies until the turn of the last century. In fact, some English, Chinese, and other traders still did business in Wawa in parts of Seattle until the 1930's!

One book, titled Making Wawa, is a fascinating linguistic history of Cascadia both on the Canadian and US side of the border.

The only reason everyone is in panic mode today is because we're adjusting to the reconciliation era. After having abrogated the Chinese Exclusion Act, re-allowed French education in English Canada, ended the residential school system, established Nunavut, and now even allow schools and teachers colleges in Nunabut to teach in Inuktitut, and have re-opened our borders somewhat more like they had been prior to confederation, everyone is in panic mode. We're not used to such openness. Ironically enough, our ancestors at the turn of the last century would think even today's Toronto is very English linguistically. They might be shocked at the modern diversity of colours, but Canada is more Anglo-French today than ever in the past. It used to be far more multinational

The greater openness we see today is in a sense a return to our past openness.

[Machjo]

As for bilingualism in Quebec, I used to live in central Quebec. I think there is a myth on that front. Very few truly know English well. Many among speak very broken English but always with a risk of misunderstanding and overestimate how well they really know it. Remember that StatsCan is a self-assessment, not an objective assessment based on a language test.

Yes, I'd say more French know English than vice versa, but let's not exaggerate it. Most Quebecers would never be able to function on this site for example. The language barrier is still very much there. Consider that we even our fedeal cabinet ministers need an interpreter to communicate between each other.

[TimG]

If you think that is hypocrisy, then the whole word, including yourself, is.

At some point all societies must allow the majority to dictate the rules to the minority. The hypocrisy comes from Quebec nationalists complaining about the English majority setting rules that affect Quebec while these nationalists expect minorities within Quebec to accept rules set by the majority. There is nothing inherently wrong with a federation where rules that are best set at a national level are set at a national level. The debate should only be about what powers are best handled by what level of government.

You are mixing up the language and the cultural values. The french in France speak french like us with a different accent. Are we the same people?

400 years ago they were the same but they diverged because of different experiences. Cultures change and evolve and it makes no sense for a government to try to "preserve" a particular culture since that is a moving target. What does make sense is government that promotes social cohesion through a common language (without preventing other languages from being used as well).

Some of them are surrounded by non-natives and it is almost impossible to extend the territory. More discussions are needed to come to a solution that could be acceptable for everyone.

The starting point is we have to dispense with the fictions that these native groups are/should be treated as nation-states. The are cultural groups. Nothing more.

[Machjo]

The Constitution of Canada recognizes the First Nations as Treaty Nations.

[cybercoma]

33% of the people in NB are french. Do you think they all live in Dieppe?

Fredericton, Moncton, and Saint John are the major cities. Fredericton and Saint John are English and Moncton is largely bilingual with most of the French population in Dieppe. The French communities are smaller

communities in the north and east, like Shediac and Edmundston. I'm pretty sure I know the linguistic demographics of my own province. Blue/Green is francophone, red is anglophone.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Nouveau-Brunswick_langues.PNG

Edited September 24, 2016 by cybercoma

[TimG]

The Constitution of Canada recognizes the First Nations as Treaty Nations.

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/nation

nation [ney-shuh n]

noun

4. an aggregation of persons of the same ethnic family, often speaking the same language or cognate languages.

The constitution does not stipulate what meaning of the "Nations" is in that context.

The equal nation-to-nation nonsense is a political fiction.

Canada is the sovereign state. Natives are subordinate cultural "nations" with special status.

Edited September 24, 2016 by TimG

[cybercoma]

At some point all societies must allow the majority to dictate the rules to the minority

Constitutional democracy, you may have heard of it?

[Machjo]

The Canadian constitution is flawed in so many ways. But given the attitudes of some, a flawed constitution is better than no constitution I suppose. With no constitution, some English Canadians would most certainly try to trample all over its minorities and French Quebecers too.

[Benz]

Fredericton, Moncton, and Saint John are the major cities. Fredericton and Saint John are English and Moncton is largely bilingual with most of the French population in Dieppe. The French communities are smaller

communities in the north and east, like Shediac and Edmundston. I'm pretty sure I know the linguistic demographics of my own province. Blue/Green is francophone, red is anglophone.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Nouveau-Brunswick_langues.PNG

ok.

[Benz]

To be fair, go outside of the Greater Montreal Area and there is very little English. Yes, in certain professional segments like technology it is well understood but not amongst the larger population. Still overall I agree that Quebec is more French/English bilingual (both total number, and also percent of population) than any other province.

Of course. Québec is not bilingual. It has a great number of bilingual people but, the majority does not have a sufficient language skill to be considered bilingual.

Ontario does have a sizeable French speaking population in the north, I would not like the see Ontario declared an English province.

It depends what you understand by official english status. Québec is a french status and still, the english people here still have the rights to be served in english by the provincial and have the rights to go to school in their language. I expect the same regards to the french in Ontario. No matter what official status Ontario would be.

I think the point cybercoma was trying to make is major cities. Most of the French in NB seem to be in rural northern areas. I guess Edmundston qualifies as a city, but it would be hard to call it major.

Yeah. I thought that maybe he meant that there are no french outside of Dieppe. I was assuming wrong. Sorry for cybercoma.

I agree many of the rules for business make sense, but some are stupid. The old apostrophe hunt and some of the current attempt to changes names are brainless, a business name is multi-national and part of their identity. If the business is local (e.g. Swartz's) then it made sense, but national (e.g. Eaton's) and International didn't (still trying to think of an international example from that era). The font size rule is idiotic, it just makes many signs hard to read (e.g. in fast food restaurants); yes French should be prominent (ie. on top) but if the business wants to serve English clientele then don't make it difficult. Implementation is often the bigger problem, every so often you hear about dumb hunts by the language cops.

Well, I agree with you regarding the branding. I understand the point some are making regarding this issue. There are alot of english names which make us feel not home or invaded by americans. We prefer when companies are making the effort to have a local compatible name. Like Stapple with a french name Bureau En Gros. Personnally, I think it is not important. It's not a fight I agree to spend time and energy on it. As much as I strongly defend the actual rules, I do not want to apply the same kind of rule with the brand names. I understand the point of those who want to convert those names but, I do not agree with them. I doubt that will happen.

Regarding the font size, it depends. So many people are stubborn regarding the respect of the french fact, the font size sends a message that, here, it's a french society. I agree with that rule for now but, maybe some day the context will change, the french will be less threatened and there would be no point to maintain that rule. I expect to change my mind eventually and just have equal size would be fine. Don't say it is idiotic without even arguing on the reasons why we have that rule. Are you french? Are you living here? Do you even deal with the issue of respecting the frenc fact? I believe that some day with will get rid of it but, for now, it still is necessary. So many immigrants come here thinking that Canada is an english only country. We have to make it clear and obvious that this is a french society.

That said, some of my fellows are exagerating when they claim that the same rule must be applied with the federal institutions. They would like the federal to apply bill 101 within their walls. Again, I understand their point but, I do not agree. I think it is normal that the federal does not give any predominence in their services. I do not mind if they have signs with equal size of the letters and I think it is normal because it is the federal. It may looks idiotic from your point of view but, it's not. I understand them. But I think they are wrong. Not necessarly idiotics. I am a convinced sovereignist and I think the federal must stay bilingual with no predominence of french in Quebec. I do not like when some of my fellows are wasting their time with that. They will not make it possible.

Regarding the dumb hunts, you can bet that when it happens, few angryphones will complain for a long time and they will continue to complain even after the issue is solved. Everytime they are exagerating, they step back or the government, even when it is a PQ one, force them to step back. All the issues, name it. The Pasta Gate? They stepped back and let it go. I remember when this small online company making business with only US clients, got the visit of the language police. When they realise that company had no clients in Quebec and was doing business only in USA. They let it go and the company could continue to do business without using french language. I bet you never heard ending, right? Of course you won't. Your medias will only focus on the zealous one. At the very same time, the french in English Canada are fighting up to the supreme court to have schools in their language. That does not occupy much place in your medias. I guess this is not idiotic, right?