Tom Mulcair leadership review

[Hydraboss]

That kind of talk is beneath you.

Because you feel it insults your Leader? Tough.

[Hydraboss]

I also have to wonder how this "steer left" campaign will affect my beloved Alberta NDP. With Selinger about to be shown the door that leaves Notley as the only surviving NDP government and you have to guess that all the other Provincial parties out here will beat her to death politically with the Manifesto (regardless of whether or not she endorses it). If the NDP pick an even harder left leader (which they likely will) that's going to make things considerably tougher for any Provincial NDP party to be elected in the west and, at best, will cause even deeper rifts between eastern and western Canada.

Overall, a pretty good night.

[Argus]

So, if the NDP is going back to the far left, it leaves the center and left center to the Liberals - but - it also opens up the center right for the Conservatives if they also choose to move back to their Progressive Conservative roots.

The Progressive Conservatives were a centre left party. The Conservatives have, since their inception, been a centre right party and still are.

[PIK]

I have more respect for Notley now then I ever did. She is one of the few NDP'ers that gets it about oil.

[BC_chick]

No, I'd rather see a fight on open ground. Once the NDP become nothing more than a footnote in history, the Cons and Libs can finally fight it out over who are lying (??) and who are conservative. Shouldn't take Justin*Trudeau long to sink his own ship now that there's no choice other than the CPC.

Or... the NDP gains another Jack Layton who has a broader base.

Or... they don't, and Trudeau keeps winning because your party stands for principles that don't resonate with the majority of Canadians.

Whatever the long-term result may be, I think you're dusting off the crystal-ball a little prematurely.

[Hydraboss]

Layton had a broader base than Mulcair certainly, but not nearly enough to form government (never even came close in the years he led the party). If the NDP find someone more appealing than Tom, it will still only resonate with NDP-type people, not fiscally conservative ones (who make up the majority in Canada). The Manifesto will most likely turn off those that were Lib/NDP swing voters. Pretty much the party is damned if they do and damned if they don't.

As for the Conservatives "having principles that don't resonate with the majority of Canadians", name the last PM that had a popular vote majority (1984? and then sometime before I was born). Harper didn't get one and Trudeau most certainly doesn't have one.

[dre]

No, I'd rather see a fight on open ground. Once the NDP become nothing more than a footnote in history, the Cons and Libs can finally fight it out over who are lying (??) and who are conservative. Shouldn't take Justin*Trudeau long to sink his own ship now that there's no choice other than the CPC.

I'm not so sure. It will take another "sponsorship" for Canadians to vote for the Reform party again.

[jacee]

No, I'd rather see a fight on open ground. Once the NDP become nothing more than a footnote in history, the Cons and Libs can finally fight it out over who are lying (??) and who are conservative. Shouldn't take Justin*Trudeau long to sink his own ship now that there's no choice other than the CPC.

You'd really prefer a one party autocracy wouldn't you?

Or even a one person dictocracy, right?

It would remove the uncertainty, get rid of all the discussion and differing opinions ... make things clear and simple for you ... right?

.

[cybercoma]

Dictocracy?

[Hydraboss]

Dictocracy?

See: Singapore

[Hydraboss]

You'd really prefer a one party autocracy wouldn't you?

No, I'd like a two (relevant) party system as in the US - which is pretty much where we're going to be once the NDP "acclaim" the Manifesto. With only the Libs and Cons remaining, neither one can really screw up majorly without being held to account at election time. This was much more complicated when the NDP remained somewhat of a political force but I think that's disappearing rapidly. I've never made a secret that I don't like the Liberal agenda (and that I have a seething hatred for any politician name Trudeau) but having a balancing act on the other side of the aisle is always necessary. I'd be just as happy if the NDP and Libs joined and became one party, but I highly doubt the result would just be simple addition of the votes each individual one gets in elections. Some of the NDP "believers" would likely wander off and support even more fringe parties, and a portion of the Lib supporters would probably migrate to the Cons.

[Guest]

I also have to wonder how this "steer left" campaign will affect my beloved Alberta NDP. With Selinger about to be shown the door that leaves Notley as the only surviving NDP government and you have to guess that all the other Provincial parties out here will beat her to death politically with the Manifesto (regardless of whether or not she endorses it). If the NDP pick an even harder left leader (which they likely will) that's going to make things considerably tougher for any Provincial NDP party to be elected in the west and, at best, will cause even deeper rifts between eastern and western Canada.

Overall, a pretty good night.

Yep, apparently Rachel is pretty pissed off. She's afraid the federal NDP silliness will rub off on her.

I don't think it will matter. She will have to separate her party from the Klein/Lewis show totally to have any chance at a repeat.

[BC_chick]

Yep, apparently Rachel is pretty pissed off. She's afraid the federal NDP silliness will rub off on her.

I don't think it will matter. She will have to separate her party from the Klein/Lewis show totally to have any chance at a repeat.

Good, let her get the boot if she insists on keeping Alberta hooked on oil. If she were as smart as her federal counterparts, she'd start working on a better future for Alberta.

Staying dependent on fossil-fuels is a one-way ticket to equalization payments. Lucky for Alberta, Harper didn't scrap those.

[Guest]

Good, let her get the boot if she insists on keeping Alberta hooked on oil. If she were as smart as her federal counterparts, she'd start working on a better future for Alberta.

Staying dependent on fossil-fuels is a one-way ticket to equalization payments. Lucky for Alberta, Harper didn't scrap those.

If she does get the boot, who do you think is going to take over? Greenpeace?

[BC_chick]

If she does get the boot, who do you think is going to take over? Greenpeace?

No, the Conservatives will be back. Who cares though, if the NDP can't get Alberta to wake up and smell the coffee, it won't make a difference who is in charge.

The bottom line is Alberta needs to wake up and think beyond oil and if Notley wants to be no different than the previous government when it comes to the living in denial, then so be it.

Alberta's head is deep in the sand and that's the real problem.

[Hydraboss]

If she were as smart as her federal counterparts, she'd start working on a better future for Alberta.

The same counterparts that have never been elected to government?

...who do you think is going to take over?

Exactly. Alberta wasn't ready for the Wildrose (yet) so they booted the PCs by electing the only other party available (the Provincial Liberals have zero; read: 0 hope of ever getting elected in Alberta). Once the Notley gang gets punted out of office, there really is only the WR and the PC parties left to elect. NDPers that believe in the whole "anti oil and gas" movement seem to forget that that industry is what fuels the equalization program (AB, SK and BC).

[Guest]

No, the Conservatives will be back. Who cares though, if the NDP can't get Alberta to wake up and smell the coffee, it won't make a difference who is in charge.

The bottom line is Alberta needs to wake up and think beyond oil and if Notley wants to be no different than the previous government when it comes to the living in denial, then so be it.

Alberta's head is deep in the sand and that's the real problem.

It's the only way to find more oil.

[BC_chick]

It's the only way to find more oil.

How's that working out for you? Are they still offering maid services and free TV's to get people to move to Calgary?

[Hydraboss]

if Notley wants to be no different than the previous government when it comes to the living in denial, then so be it.

Notley has no choice but to be pro oil and gas - she's finally starting to understand how all those social programs she wants to "enhance" (like raises for government workers) get paid for. As an example, I've been watching to see how many times she uses the phrase "tar sands"..........

Can't seem to find one since the election. Hmmmm....

Federally, the NDP doesn't have that reality shoved in their collective faces every day. I think Mulcair was smart enough of a man to know where the funding comes from but couldn't sell it to his party this weekend. Whoever is responsible for leading the party going forward will either have to accept the financial reality of oil and gas or refuse to and lead them all on a happy trek into the hinterland.

[Guest]

How's that working out for you? Are they still offering maid services and free TV's to get people to move to Calgary?

Beats me. I wouldn't move to Calgary just for that. I get that at the Holiday Inn.

[Guest]

Notley has no choice but to be pro oil and gas - she's finally starting to understand how all those social programs she wants to "enhance" (like raises for government workers) get paid for. As an example, I've been watching to see how many times she uses the phrase "tar sands"..........

Can't seem to find one since the election. Hmmmm....

Federally, the NDP doesn't have that reality shoved in their collective faces every day. I think Mulcair was smart enough of a man to know where the funding comes from but couldn't sell it to his party this weekend. Whoever is responsible for leading the party going forward will either have to accept the financial reality of oil and gas or refuse to and lead them all on a happy trek into the hinterland.

Once Naomi Klein and Avi Lewis get their plans for cheap and plentiful household Cold Fusion Reactors approved, I think we might see the Federal NDP taken a bit more seriously.

[BC_chick]

Notley has no choice but to be pro oil and gas - she's finally starting to understand how all those social programs she wants to "enhance" (like raises for government workers) get paid for. As an example, I've been watching to see how many times she uses the phrase "tar sands"..........

Can't seem to find one since the election. Hmmmm....

Federally, the NDP doesn't have that reality shoved in their collective faces every day. I think Mulcair was smart enough of a man to know where the funding comes from but couldn't sell it to his party this weekend. Whoever is responsible for leading the party going forward will either have to accept the financial reality of oil and gas or refuse to and lead them all on a happy trek into the hinterland.

Oil is industry in on its deathbed, what financial reality are you talking about? Do you honestly believe there will be a future there?

Notley would be smart to accept this fact now and work on diversifying the economy of the province.

[Guest]

Oil is industry in on its deathbed, what financial reality are you talking about? Do you honestly believe there will be a future there?

Notley would be smart to accept this fact now and work on diversifying the economy of the province.

It depends on what time frame you are basing your word "future".

I would reckon you will still be using fossil fuels in some form or other in 25 years. And that's someone who hates them. Imagine the market from those who don't.

[Hydraboss]

Oil is industry in on its deathbed, ...Do you honestly believe there will be a future there?

Do you know how many times I've been through this kind of downturn to one degree or another? Deathbed? Hardly. Market correction - just like last time, and the time before, and the time before that.......

There IS a future there but the question is can the Federal NDP see it? If the new leader, with the new Manifesto in hand, decides that oil and gas is to be ignored then I would really like to see their budget accounting. It should be fairly straightforward - just take total government revenues and deduct all the royalties and taxes from the industry across Canada and the spinoff industries. That should make for a much more manageable revenue number to work with.

[BC_chick]

Once Naomi Klein and Avi Lewis get their plans for cheap and plentiful household Cold Fusion Reactors approved, I think we might see the Federal NDP taken a bit more seriously.

I tend to agree, but I think the LPC, being the party of opportunism, will jump on board if this is the will of the people. You never know.

It depends on what time frame you are basing your word "future".

I would reckon you will still be using fossil fuels in some form or other in 25 years. And that's someone who hates them. Imagine the market from those who don't.

The timelines may be a little too optimistic, but I think the idea is of the Leap Manifesto is on the right track.