Liberal deficit set at 18.4 billion

[Smallc]

We're beyond that, Harper is not in charge anymore. Keep telling yourself this if it makes you feel better, but it won't help our current situation.

Neither will blaming the Liberals for a situation they didn't create.

Why would you keep telling yourself that it's okay because.... Harper??

It's okay because it's reality - we have to live in it. I voted for the Liberals to build infrastructure (for nationalistic reasons) and to spend on seniors and families with children (for selfish reasons). I expect them to deliver on that promise, and to not worry about short term fiscal problems that could be solved with tax increases.

[Smallc]

They will look like a hero by not keeping their spending promises?

It's clear now that no one was going to keep their spending promises, no matter what colour shirt they happened to wear.

PSAC is already gearing for a fight over sick leave and death benefits......the Liberals can't blame Harper for broken promises and choices they make forever

Nor do I expect them to. Seeing as they haven't even released a budget yet, I'll give them a minute.

[Spiderfish]

Neither will blaming the Liberals for a situation they didn't create.

Gee, I'll have to remember this concept the next time my boss comes to me with a problem.

[Smallc]

Gee, I'll have to remember this concept the next time my boss comes to me with a problem.

The problem of our economy will not be solved with budget cuts. Harper recognized that in 2008.

Edited February 22, 2016 by Smallc

[msj]

What is the GDP of Canada?

What is the total tax revenue brought in by the feds?

How much is the deficit compared to those numbers?

Why are so many panicking over this?

Other than for political hay, I mean.

The sky isn't falling and if there is ever a time to run deficits it is when the fiscal situation calls for it which appears to be the case here.

[Argus]

Well, at least we know that Harper was lying when he said he'd run a surplus next year.

Oh? You have a copy of the budget he intended to bring out?

[Argus]

Canada is in a worse position than in 2009, and we have the previous government and the world economy to thank for that. You go ahead and blame the Liberals - it's not their fault.

That's nonsense. What are you basing that on?

[Argus]

See this is the thing for me.

Trudeau promised $10B deficits with about $15B in additional spending. With the baseline being $20B worse than that, he either has to break one promise or the other.

Harper promised balanced budgets with about $2B in additional spending. With the baseline being $20B worse than that, he either had to break one promise of the other.

Now, why would I blame the Liberals for something that was beyond their control?

Of course, this all requires we believe the "liberal baseline" numbers.

[Smallc]

Oh? You have a copy of the budget he intended to bring out?

Are you saying he was going to but $15B in spending? What was he going to do, close National Defence?

Last year's budget predicted a $5B surplus next year. Unless you think he was lying throughout his campaign, he has promised about $2 - 3B in additional spending next year. That means he would have, per his last budget, ran a surplus of $2B. Now, we know the baseline was about $20B worse than the last budget predicted. That means, the Harper government would have run a $18B deficit without changing their plans.

[Smallc]

Of course, this all requires we believe the "liberal baseline" numbers.

As you were told by someone else; if you're not going to use the numbers published, we can just make things up.

[Argus]

As you were told by someone else; if you're not going to use the numbers published, we can just make things up.

But then I'd be a Liberal.

[Smallc]

That's nonsense. What are you basing that on?

In 2009, Canada has a short, sharp recession. Canada (and the world) are in for a period of shallow recessions and slow growth in between. The world isn't headed over a cliff or anything, but there's a reason that the IMF is calling for fiscal stimulus. It isn't because things are looking good.

[On Guard for Thee]

But then I'd be a Liberal.

You mean kinda like how the conservatives keep saying they left a, he hem, "surplus" behind?

[overthere]

This is the Harper deficit with only Liberal changes so far (refugees and tax changes) included. That means that Harper would have run a deficit of more than $15B using his own plan. The Liberal deficit in the budget will be $25 - $30B.

The Liberal number in the budget will be plucked kicking and screaming from the colons of Trudeaus communications team with input from Gerry Butts.(what a great and apt name)

The actual deficit will be at least $40B. The PMO will be warming us up for that number the day after the so called budget is released.

Later, the budget will balance itself.

[overthere]

But then I'd be a Liberal.

BINGO.

[Smallc]

The Liberal number in the budget will be plucked kicking and screaming from the colons of Trudeaus communications team with input from Gerry Butts.(what a great and apt name)

The actual deficit will be at least $40B.

That is also a possibility, as circumstances are similar to when Harper ran what would, today, be a $60B deficit.

[overthere]

Are you saying he was going to but $15B in spending? What was he going to do, close National Defence?

Last year's budget predicted a $5B surplus next year. Unless you think he was lying throughout his campaign, he has promised about $2 - 3B in additional spending next year. That means he would have, per his last budget, ran a surplus of $2B. Now, we know the baseline was about $20B worse than the last budget predicted. That means, the Harper government would have run a $18B deficit without changing their plans.

Impossible. Aboriginal Affairs will alone will need $3 billion extra now, right now, or he will be physically lynched.

[Smallc]

Impossible. Aboriginal Affairs will alone will need $3 billion extra now, right now, or he will be physically lynched.

There hasn't been enough discussion for that kind of money to be in the budget right now. They've promised, for this year, education and child welfare funding. There will also be infrastructure money, I'm sure. You're pulling things out of your Butts.

[overthere]

Bellegrande has already stated they expect billions now. Right now, and no waffling BS. And no way that Junior will be permitted not to toss some big coin at his promise to implement at all the recommendations from Harpers Truth and Reconcililation report.

Education alone is $2 billion. Thats an extra $2 billion ongoing at very minimum, not a one timer.

And there will have to be something very juicy for Coderre/Montreal/Bombardier/ad agencies too, though like I said there will have to be a huge difference between whatever lie they tell about the forecast deficit in the budget and the real numbers in 2016.

Trudeau has dug himself a big hole with his promises, and he is still shoveling today. Glad to see he has some help here.

[CITIZEN_2015]

Conservative hypocrites have some nerve to criticize this budget deficit. And Ambrose was part of the Harper government in 2009 when Canada was in economic downturn (not because of low commodity prices) and they (Ambrose included) took a 14 billion dollar surplus they inherited from liberals and turned it into a 55 billion dollar deficit in 2009 by infrastructure spending and it took them some 6-7 years to get close to balanced budget.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/multimedia/canada-s-deficits-and-surpluses-1963-to-2015-1.3042571

Edited February 23, 2016 by CITIZEN_2015

[Smallc]

Bellegrande has already stated they expect billions now. Right now, and no waffling BS. And no way that Junior

No denigration in the use of Junior. None at all.

You don't like Trudeau.

We get it.

This forum is a train wreck lately.

[Chuckie Tony]

Debt is part of a healthy system to pay the services we want.

[TimG]

Debt is part of a healthy system to pay the services we want.

Tell that to Greece or Argentina. Canada is not like the US or the EU. If it piles up too much debt it has to issue bonds in USD or other foreign currencies. This makes the debt extremely painful and something that would eviscerate society. Canada was issuing USD bonds in the 90s. We must not go back to those days.

[Spiderfish]

This forum is a train wreck lately.

Kind of reflects the overall respect (or lack thereof) for fiscal accountability. When you treat people and their trust with disregard, this is what can be expected.

[Smallc]

Kind of reflects the overall respect (or lack thereof) for fiscal accountability.

The deficit we're talking about largely belongs to the last government.

When you treat people and their trust with disregard, this is what can be expected.

People are largely happy with the Liberal government. This forum is definitely not representative of Canadians. Canadians aren't concerned with deficits in difficult times.