poochy Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 As I have already said, nobody bitches about registering their vehicle. So whats the problem with doing the same with a gun. Most of us didnt bitch about registering a firearm either, we just did it, of course it never actually did anything and that should matter, and it does matter more than your, 'let me move the goal posts just a bit more' arguments, but hey, it's you! that's what you do. Quote
poochy Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 No, its much more nuanced than that. If I need a gun for legal reasons, just like I need a car for legal reasons, I dont have a big hangup with letting the gov know. If I want to peacefully protest a logging company clear cutting vancouver island, I could be thrown in jail as a terrorist under 51. Thats a whole lot of nuance dot you think. Hey, did you know that you don't have to register a car to own one. Quote
poochy Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 (edited) There are all kinds of sources that show equal stats. Sorry if they debunk your position, but the numbers dont lie. so his numbers lie, and yours are the truth, well of course they do! Does anyone else get a mental image of child running around with their fingers in their ears yelling lalalalalala eveytime someone refutes their nonsense? Edited March 29, 2015 by poochy Quote
poochy Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 It could make me a terrorist if I go out in protest of a pipeline through my backyard. You should actually read the bill before commenting on it. It turns out that the more people do study it, the more they dont want it. How can you have any credibility on any issue if you actually believe that? Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 How can you have any credibility on any issue if you actually believe that? Apparently even Harper believes it. Thats why he has allowed that to be amended out. Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 (edited) Hey, did you know that you don't have to register a car to own one. Nor have a valid licence to keep one in the garage.......likewise, if I left the car unlocked, with the keys on the coffee table, I would not face criminal charges.....or how many drivers are greeted by a ERT if their license expires and they still have a car in the garage? Edited March 29, 2015 by Derek 2.0 Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 so his numbers lie, and yours are the truth, well of course they are! Does anyone else get a mental image of child running around with their fingers in their ears yelling lalalalalala eveytime someone refutes their nonsense? I would imagine you have a lot of childish mental images. Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 Most of us didnt bitch about registering a firearm either, we just did it, of course it never actually did anything and that should matter, and it does matter more than your, 'let me move the goal posts just a bit more' arguments, but hey, it's you! that's what you do. They toughened the laws in Aus. and it really did do something. It lowered the gun crime rate stats, nothing to do with your so called goalposts. Quote
Big Guy Posted March 29, 2015 Author Report Posted March 29, 2015 Would it make for a safer community if the police had access to a data base which showed which people owned which guns - small, medium and large? Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Derek 2.0 Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 They toughened the laws in Aus. and it really did do something. It lowered the gun crime rate stats, nothing to do with your so called goalposts. No it didn't In the seven years from 2005 to 2012, gun murders across Australia almost doubled. The incidence of guns used in kidnappings trebled. The total number of crimes in which a firearm was used rose from 823 in 2005, to 1217 in 2012, an increase of 47 per cent. Likewise, gun deaths have decreased in the United States despite the AWB expiring, gun sales and issuing of CCW permits increasing Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 Would it make for a safer community if the police had access to a data base which showed which people owned which guns - small, medium and large? Thats one main reason various police forces voiced support for the registry. For instance it would be nice for them to know when responding to a domestic situation, if the household shows the possible presence of firearms. Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 Would it make for a safer community if the police had access to a data base which showed which people owned which guns - small, medium and large? You mean, like a registry.......it would only make a community safer if you were able to convince those most likely to use guns in the commission of a crime to contribute such data to the police......in essence, criminals telling police what types of and where they keep their illegal firearms. Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 Thats one main reason various police forces voiced support for the registry. For instance it would be nice for them to know when responding to a domestic situation, if the household shows the possible presence of firearms. But the registry didn't do that......as criminals don't register their guns. Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 No it didn't Likewise, gun deaths have decreased in the United States despite the AWB expiring, gun sales and issuing of CCW permits increasing http://hereandnow.wbur.org/2014/07/10/australia-gun-laws http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Australia#The_Port_Arthur_massacre_and_its_consequences Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 http://hereandnow.wbur.org/2014/07/10/australia-gun-laws http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Australia#The_Port_Arthur_massacre_and_its_consequences Your link doesn't support your claim, nor refute my source with actual numbers obtained from the Australian Government..... Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 Your link doesn't support your claim, nor refute my source with actual numbers obtained from the Australian Government..... I am aware no amount of evidence will change your belief, but here is some reading. But if you get tired of that go to the second link and maybe you can get a few laughs and some understanding from an Aussie comic. http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/cp/australia http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/03/25/1373205/-Australian-comedian-tries-to-make-sense-of-American-gun-laws-nailed-it?detail=email# Quote
Argus Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 Nor have a valid licence to keep one in the garage.......likewise, if I left the car unlocked, with the keys on the coffee table, I would not face criminal charges.....or how many drivers are greeted by a ERT if their license expires and they still have a car in the garage? Yeah, that was one of the most egregious misuses of the registration process. It even turned a liberal Toronto Star reporter into a conservative when the cops came pounding on his door fto seize his old rifle because he'd forgotten to renew his license. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 (edited) Thats one main reason various police forces voiced support for the registry. For instance it would be nice for them to know when responding to a domestic situation, if the household shows the possible presence of firearms. Except the data base was corrupted with bugs and the data was wildly inaccurate. Further, the police have to always assume there could be a gun present given the numbers of unregistered or stolen guns out there. I would support efforts to get rid of the latter, even expensive efforts, but this registry didn't do that. Edited March 29, 2015 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Smallc Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 Except the data base was corrupted with bugs and the data was wildly inaccurate. Further, the police have to always assume there could be a gun present given the numbers of unregistered or stolen guns out there. Yeah, any cop that doesn't assume a weapon is present at every residence and traffic stop is an idiot with limited time left. Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 I am aware no amount of evidence will change your belief, but here is some reading. But if you get tired of that go to the second link and maybe you can get a few laughs and some understanding from an Aussie comic. http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/cp/australia http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/03/25/1373205/-Australian-comedian-tries-to-make-sense-of-American-gun-laws-nailed-it?detail=email# Again your links don't support your claim.......nor explain how countries with less "gun control", like the United States, Canada and New Zealand have also seen significant declines in gun violence over the same period of time. Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 Again your links don't support your claim.......nor explain how countries with less "gun control", like the United States, Canada and New Zealand have also seen significant declines in gun violence over the same period of time. The data does support the claim, and after all its not my claim, but maybe go and enjoy the humor part. Quote
Smallc Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 The data does support the claim, and after all its not my claim, but maybe go and enjoy the humor part. No, it doesn't. The reduction is violence is true throughout the western world. Sorry, but your logic impervious arguments don't fly. Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 No, it doesn't. The reduction is violence is true throughout the western world. Sorry, but your logic impervious arguments don't fly. So Aussi buying back somewhere around a million guns followed by a significant drop in gun violence is just coincidental. Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 Yeah, that was one of the most egregious misuses of the registration process. It even turned a liberal Toronto Star reporter into a conservative when the cops came pounding on his door fto seize his old rifle because he'd forgotten to renew his license. Exactly, as I've said in every topic here on the subject since I began posting on this site, I've no issue with licenses or safe storage laws, but the Firearms Act itself was written by idiots, with knowledge fostered by movies, tv shows and gun magazines.......as made evident by the classification of various firearms based only on appearance, the name of the firearm, and in one case, due to one gun being used by Arnie in the Terminator...... If the AR-15 came with a wood stock, some versions, would likely never have been classified as restricted....... Quote
Smallc Posted March 29, 2015 Report Posted March 29, 2015 (edited) So Aussi buying back somewhere around a million guns followed by a significant drop in gun violence is just coincidental. Apparently, since the significant drop is also true in similar countries with similar demographics and no similar program. Edited March 29, 2015 by Smallc Quote
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