Smallc Posted December 13, 2014 Report Posted December 13, 2014 Nowadays you don't have to be there, lots of people have those damn Iphones so you can just sit back and watch a guy get tazered to death in the airport, or a kid get shot alone in a streetcar surrounded by cops, That sort of thing. That doesn't give you the appropriate context. Quote
On Guard for Thee Posted December 13, 2014 Report Posted December 13, 2014 That doesn't give you the appropriate context. I don't think you actually had to be on site to see that shooting a kid who was alone in a streetcar which was surrounded by cops was way over the top. At least our system had the sense to charge the cop with murder. Quote
eyeball Posted December 13, 2014 Report Posted December 13, 2014 OTOH there are probably more than a few people who think charging the cop is the real crime here. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
cybercoma Posted December 13, 2014 Report Posted December 13, 2014 The New York situation is much more grey than the situation in Ferguson. I don't like what happened there, though I don't think it came from any intentional malice. Who said anything about intentional malice? I would think by now you would actually look up the things you claim don't exist, so you could actually understand what it is you're dismissing. Quote
cybercoma Posted December 13, 2014 Report Posted December 13, 2014 Unlike choke holds, Tazers really do kill people. Really? You can't choke someone to death? It's impossible? Quote
Smallc Posted December 13, 2014 Report Posted December 13, 2014 Really? You can't choke someone to death? It's impossible? That's not even close to what he said. Quote
Smallc Posted December 13, 2014 Report Posted December 13, 2014 Who said anything about intentional malice? I would think by now you would actually look up the things you claim don't exist, so you could actually understand what it is you're dismissing. No one meant for anyone to die. Quote
jbg Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 Those are crimes. You can't just not cooperate with the police, no matter who you are. The case in New York did escalate to where it shouldn't have, but that isn't only because of the police. The case in Ferguson has been pretty much debunked at every level. A friend of mine, who is white and Jewish, had some problems with the police. In 1982 he was driving on the Hutchinson River Parkway and saw the aftermath of an auto accident on the shoulder. Now you must know that parkways in the New York City area have very strict rules on stopping and of use of the shoulders and right-of-way. He stepped out and started snapping pictures. The police told me to stop and move on. He refused, and spent the night in the Harrison, New York lockup. I got a call the next morning. Since I was not yet a lawyer, I gave him the number of a local attorney. The moral of the story is that if the police tell you to jump, the only response is "how high." Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
WestCoastRunner Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 A friend of mine, who is white and Jewish, had some problems with the police. In 1982 he was driving on the Hutchinson River Parkway and saw the aftermath of an auto accident on the shoulder. Now you must know that parkways in the New York City area have very strict rules on stopping and of use of the shoulders and right-of-way. He stepped out and started snapping pictures. The police told me to stop and move on. He refused, and spent the night in the Harrison, New York lockup. I got a call the next morning. Since I was not yet a lawyer, I gave him the number of a local attorney. The moral of the story is that if the police tell you to jump, the only response is "how high." After he refused, it was a good thing he wasn't taken down on the pavement with a chokehold, numerous police ganging up on his body and pressing his head into the pavement. This suffocation could have killed him. Lucky white guy! Quote I love to see a young girl go out and grab the world by the lapels. Life's a bitch. You've got to go out and kick ass. - Maya Angelou
WestCoastRunner Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 After he refused, it was a good thing he wasn't taken down on the pavement with a chokehold, numerous police ganging up on his body and pressing his head into the pavement. This suffocation could have killed him. Lucky white guy! Moral of the story: good thing he was a white guy. Quote I love to see a young girl go out and grab the world by the lapels. Life's a bitch. You've got to go out and kick ass. - Maya Angelou
jbg Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 After he refused, it was a good thing he wasn't taken down on the pavement with a chokehold, numerous police ganging up on his body and pressing his head into the pavement. This suffocation could have killed him. Lucky white guy! He definitely didn't speak in a loud or belligerant voice. That being said what happened to Garner was dead-ass wrong. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
jbg Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 After he refused, it was a good thing he wasn't taken down on the pavement with a chokehold, numerous police ganging up on his body and pressing his head into the pavement. This suffocation could have killed him. Lucky white guy! Moral of the story: good thing he was a white guy. Needed to post it twice for emphasis? Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
WestCoastRunner Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 Needed to post it twice for emphasis? Not really, a mistake on my part. Quote I love to see a young girl go out and grab the world by the lapels. Life's a bitch. You've got to go out and kick ass. - Maya Angelou
WestCoastRunner Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 He definitely didn't speak in a loud or belligerant voice. That being said what happened to Garner was dead-ass wrong. He didn't speak in a loud or belligerant voice probably because it has only happened to him once. Garner was probably harrassed umpteen times and got tired of it and decided to speak up for himself. Again, he was 'allegedly' selling loosies. No evidence has been forthcoming of loosies found on him. Even if there were, again, it was excessive force causing his death. Not 'contributing' but 'causing' his death. Quote I love to see a young girl go out and grab the world by the lapels. Life's a bitch. You've got to go out and kick ass. - Maya Angelou
cybercoma Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 That's not even close to what he said. Really? He didn't say choke holds don't kill people? Do you have a different version of english than everyone else? Quote
cybercoma Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 No one meant for anyone to die. When someone gets drunk and climbs behind the wheel of a car, they don't mean to kill anyone either. But it happens. And it's avoidable. Quote
Smallc Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 When someone gets drunk and climbs behind the wheel of a car, they don't mean to kill anyone either. But it happens. And it's avoidable. That's a different case than this. There is a decision to do something that is clearly wrong. This is a situation involving two parties that escalated. Quote
cybercoma Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 That's a different case than this. There is a decision to do something that is clearly wrong. This is a situation involving two parties that escalated. The cop made the decision to use a choke hold that was prohibited by the police department for 20 years. That's a decision to do something that is clearly wrong. It was prohibited because it could result in exactly what it resulted in. That's the same reason it's illegal to drink and drive because it could result in killing people. They're the same scenarios whether you can fit those pieces together in your mind or not. Quote
WestCoastRunner Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 That's a different case than this. There is a decision to do something that is clearly wrong. This is a situation involving two parties that escalated. The decision was clearly wrong, given the health condition of the man. Again, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that if 4 or 5 guys tackle this guy to the ground with a chokehold, slamming his face into the ground, jumping on him and literally suffocating him, it is clearly the wrong decision. They simply did not respect the value of this man's life. Quote I love to see a young girl go out and grab the world by the lapels. Life's a bitch. You've got to go out and kick ass. - Maya Angelou
Smallc Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 Really? He didn't say choke holds don't kill people? Do you have a different version of english than everyone else? Proper choke holds for kill people. Quote
Smallc Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 The decision was clearly wrong, given the health condition of the man. Again, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that if 4 or 5 guys tackle this guy to the ground with a chokehold, slamming his face into the ground, jumping on him and literally suffocating him, it is clearly the wrong decision. They simply did not respect the value of this man's life. Have you ever been in a situation that required quick reactions? It isn't as simple as you're making it out to be. What he did was not clearly wrong. Quote
Smallc Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 The cop made the decision to use a choke hold that was prohibited by the police department for 20 years. That's a decision to do something that is clearly wrong. It was prohibited because it could result in exactly what it resulted in. That's the same reason it's illegal to drink and drive because it could result in killing people. They're the same scenarios whether you can fit those pieces together in your mind or not. It isn't clear that what he did causes the death directly, or that an actual chokehold was what they meant to do. Quote
WestCoastRunner Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 Have you ever been in a situation that required quick reactions? It isn't as simple as you're making it out to be. What he did was not clearly wrong. They didn't need quick reactions. That is the point. He wasn't harming anyone. He was no threat to anyone except the ego of the cops on the beat. Quote I love to see a young girl go out and grab the world by the lapels. Life's a bitch. You've got to go out and kick ass. - Maya Angelou
jbg Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 The decision was clearly wrong, given the health condition of the man. Again, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that if 4 or 5 guys tackle this guy to the ground with a chokehold, slamming his face into the ground, jumping on him and literally suffocating him, it is clearly the wrong decision. They simply did not respect the value of this man's life. There was no reason to do a takedown for someone who was committing, maybe, a minor tax or economic crime. Eric Garner was 43 years old and a danger to no one. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
WestCoastRunner Posted December 14, 2014 Report Posted December 14, 2014 (edited) There was no reason to do a takedown for someone who was committing, maybe, a minor tax or economic crime. Eric Garner was 43 years old and a danger to no one. Gosh, 43 years old. What a shame. I didn't realize how young he was. Edited December 14, 2014 by WestCoastRunner Quote I love to see a young girl go out and grab the world by the lapels. Life's a bitch. You've got to go out and kick ass. - Maya Angelou
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