Uk Police allow Muslim gang to continue raping up to 50 white girls

[Guest American Woman]

I think we should note that the "police being petrified of being called racists" bit--which has been repeated in each article, and several times on this thread--is the opinion of a single person, an ex-labour MP.

Seems slightly disproportionate, doesn't it?

From the Guardian:

Greater Manchester police is conducting an inquiry, supervised by the Independent Police Complaints Commission, over the original botched investigation four years ago after the CPS decided not to prosecute two men, including the 59-year-old.

And:

The Rochdale MP, Simon Danczuk, criticised the police for their inaction four years ago. He said: "What has become clear is that if the police had acted seriously on these concerns in 2008, many of the victims of this appalling case would not have to go through such horrific trauma." He said it was unacceptable that the young women were let down by people they should have been able to trust.

So why didn't the police act? Has anyone found the answer?

[Guest American Woman]

In reading further, it does seem as if the "PC" factor might be holding people back from dealing with some of these cases, including the case in question the Guardian:

Tim Loughton, the children's minister, told MPs today ethnicity was a factor in child abuse cases. The Press Association has filed a story. Here's an excerpt.

Ethnicity is a factor in cases of child sexual abuse across the country, and police and social workers should not allow "political correctness" to hold them back from catching and prosecuting the perpetrators, children's minister Tim Loughton said today.

[...]

He cited high-profile cases in Derby and Rochdale, where gangs of men from Pakistani backgrounds were jailed for grooming and abusing young girls. Abuse of this kind has been happening "under the radar" for many years, but the problem is only now coming to the fore, with further court cases expected soon, he said.

[...]

Asked if there was evidence of ethnicity being a factor in child exploitation, he replied: "Yes, and it is no good pretending otherwise.

"If there is some form of political correctness around ethnicity which is getting in the way of police and other agencies investigating, tracking down and nailing these perpetrators, then that needs to be removed and we need to do something about it."

[Wild Bill]

Right - so let's be clear here - we're talking about guilt by association. People who come from that country and of that religion should be prevented from coming here because people with the same nationality and religion have committed crimes.

It's not a standard that can or should be followed, because the link is associative only, not causative. You can't say that these people are worse people because of extremists. We don't do that with other races, religions or nationalities why would we do it here ?

It's muddle-headed and emotional thinking.

Forgive me Michael but to arbitrarily jump to the conclusion that it is "guilt by association" is in itself "muddle-headed and emotional thinking".

What has to be established is whether or not this was an isolated spontaneous act of a few bad apples or a cultural aspect of a large group. Only when a problem is properly understood can it be corrected.

By large group I am NOT saying all Muslims everywhere! Please do not take my argument to some ridiculous extreme. It may or may not involve religion or nationality. Nothing should be ignored or taken for granted. The obvious inference here is that it was religious racism on the part of the rapists against girls not of their religion or their cultural heritage. It's possible that is true! Racism is not solely a white Christian man's disease. The most racist man I ever met was a Hindu.

Ethnic cultures exist in every society. They vary from city to city and from neighbourhood to neighbourhood. There are also youth cultures, usually spawned and encouraged by those who make money selling them music and fashion.

It would be important to try to find out what happened in this situation. Perhaps there is some radical Imam spreading nonsense, or some local thug who is a hero to this sub-culture.

It all gets back to culture when we start to deal with groups and not individuals. What about the culture of the UK police force? Perhaps the idea that they did not act for fear of being labelled racist is true? There may have been specific examples of policemen unfairly reprimanded as racist before.

We don't know, which means that before one can give a considered opinion one would have to find out! To just immediately decide on the basis of one's own biases would indeed be "muddle-headed and emotional thinking".

[kraychik]

I think we should note that the "police being petrified of being called racists" bit--which has been repeated in each article, and several times on this thread--is the opinion of a single person, an ex-labour MP.

Seems slightly disproportionate, doesn't it?

Do you not realise that many people have been murdered as a result of "political correctness"? Nidal Hassan is a prime example of this leftist behaviour at work. This is a systemic problem that infects all levels of government in Canada, the USA, and the UK (as well as many other countries). There is nothing that is hard to believe about this story.

[bud]

It's a widespread story. Here is another sources of the same story. If it's true , it's true inflammatory or not is irrelevant. We as a society cannot simply bury our heads in the sand and pretend it's not happening.

one more for good measure.

from your own link:

Abdul Qayyum (left), 43, was sentenced to five years for conspiracy. Mohammed Amin (right) 45, was handed five years for conspiracy and sexual assault. The gang's 59-year-old ringleader, who cannot be named for legal reasons, was sentenced to 19 years in jail

Abdul Aziz (left), 41, was given nine years for conspiracy and trafficking for sexual exploitation. Mohammed Sajid (right), 35, received 12 years tor conspiracy, trafficking, one count of rape and one count of sexual activity with a child

Hamid Safi (left), 22, was given four years for conspiracy and trafficking but not guilty of two counts of rape. Adil Khan (right), 42, was found guilty of conspiracy and trafficking for sexual exploitation

Kabeer Hassan (left), 25, was jailed for nine years for conspiracy and rape. Abdul Rauf (right), 43, was found guilty of conspiracy and trafficking for sexual exploitation and jailed for six years

looks like the title of the thread is correct and they're holding back in punishing these brown skinned assholes.

can't wait to see the thread where you're up in arms in regards to the hundreds of catholic priests who fuck little boys and a system that allows them to get away with it.

[Mr.Canada]

Bud, if you read the article you'll see that the police and child services knew about the raping of the 13 year old child long before the people responsible were brought to justice but were afraid of being labeled a racist. This child was passed around by these Muslims to be raped. It wasn't until the child became pregnant and had an abortion that the police took action.

Edited September 25, 2012 by Mr.Canada

[bleeding heart]

In reading further, it does seem as if the "PC" factor might be holding people back from dealing with some of these cases, including the case in question

Yes, it might be. As I stated.

[bleeding heart]

Do you not realise that many people have been murdered as a result of "political correctness"? Nidal Hassan is a prime example of this leftist behaviour at work. This is a systemic problem that infects all levels of government in Canada, the USA, and the UK (as well as many other countries). There is nothing that is hard to believe about this story.

Well, like I said, it might or might not be the case.

Evidently a profoundly controversial opinion.

[bleeding heart]

Bud, if you read the article you'll see that the police and child services knew about the raping of the 13 year old child long before the people responsible were brought to justice but were afraid of being labeled a racist.

Mr. Canada,if you read the article you'll see that this remains, at least at the moment, speculative.

[kraychik]

Well, like I said, it might or might not be the case.

Evidently a profoundly controversial opinion.

This is happening everywhere. I can recall a few examples off the top of my head. In NYC, for example, there were accusations from the left, including certain Islamic public relations organisations such as CAIR, which accused the NYPD of using an "Islamophobic" training video. Let's look at how the TSA is searching infants, grannies, and disabled individuals. And, as I've already stated, the case of Nidal Hassan. Granted, these are all American stories, but similar events have also occurred in Canada where "political correctness" impedes the abilities of all levels of government, most frighteningly those involved with security and justice, of effectively fulfilling their obligations.

[jbg]

If I can't even click on a link at work, it's a sign that the source might not be the best.

Please check your sources for inflammatory stories such as this - they're often from race-bating groups.

Even if it's true are you saying it's inflammatory?

Frankly I think you're being bigoted if you don't believe Muslims should have the same degree of self-control as you expect of yourself.

[Bonam]

I don't see the point of attaching this to their religion, unless it's to denigrate people who have nothing to do with this. People think that way, I suppose, but I don't.

It's not so much a matter of religion, as it is of culture. People from certain parts of the world are likely not to know how to behave themselves in a Western country. And we don't need to be inviting them in. At all. Cease all immigration from violent third world hellholes, unless the potential immigrant proves beyond any reasonable doubt that they are an intelligent educated individual willing and capable to understand and follow laws and behaviors appropriate to their new home. The onus and cost of proving this should be entirely on the prospective immigrant. The proof must be presented prior to their entry.

The religion/race aspect comes into play when one looks into why the authorities fail to properly investigate and prosecute such cases. It is a condemnation not of Muslims, but of idiotic Western sensitivity/guilt when it comes to anything that might offend Muslims.

[bleeding heart]

Granted, these are all American stories, but similar events have also occurred in Canada where "political correctness" impedes the abilities of all levels of government, most frighteningly those involved with security and justice, of effectively fulfilling their obligations.

Then your beef should be with the inarguable perpetrators of the political correctness stultification--officials, law enforcement, etc--rather than with the arguable precipitators: "the left."

[Michael Hardner]

Even if it's true are you saying it's inflammatory?

Frankly I think you're being bigoted if you don't believe Muslims should have the same degree of self-control as you expect of yourself.

People can mix true facts in with editorial lies... and that's a bad way to source news stories.

[Michael Hardner]

It's not so much a matter of religion, as it is of culture. People from certain parts of the world are likely not to know how to behave themselves in a Western country. And we don't need to be inviting them in. At all. Cease all immigration from violent third world hellholes, unless the potential immigrant proves beyond any reasonable doubt that they are an intelligent educated individual willing and capable to understand and follow laws and behaviors appropriate to their new home. The onus and cost of proving this should be entirely on the prospective immigrant. The proof must be presented prior to their entry.

The government already has ways to limit people in this way, but immigration isn't decreasing. It's likely that way because there are more net benefits for immigration than is apparent if you read these scapegoating stories.

The religion/race aspect comes into play when one looks into why the authorities fail to properly investigate and prosecute such cases. It is a condemnation not of Muslims, but of idiotic Western sensitivity/guilt when it comes to anything that might offend Muslims.

People would like for that to be true, but I don't think that it is. At least, let's see what people say. Certainly, there are more hysterical accusations of bad "PC-thinking" than there are examples... and there are more examples of bad scapegoating than either - I'm sure this thread provides an example.

[kraychik]

Even if it's true are you saying it's inflammatory?

Frankly I think you're being bigoted if you don't believe Muslims should have the same degree of self-control as you expect of yourself.

Michael Hardner is a bigot, of course, because when discussions involving culture/ethnicity arise, he is accusing his detractors of "racism" within about two seconds. And as you've said, he has such contempt for Muslims that he believes they should be judged by a different standard and given more leeway to be criminals. It's pathetic.

[Michael Hardner]

Michael Hardner is a bigot, of course, because when discussions involving culture/ethnicity arise, he is accusing his detractors of "racism" within about two seconds.

Your posting behavior is very poor. I already responded to this accusation by asking you WHERE I accused people of racism and didn't get a response.

And as you've said, he has such contempt for Muslims that he believes they should be judged by a different standard and given more leeway to be criminals. It's pathetic.

You have very poor posting habits. Continually accusing people without acknowledging their response is tantamount to insults - which are not permitted here.

[jacee]

from your own link:

Abdul Qayyum (left), 43, was sentenced to five years for conspiracy. Mohammed Amin (right) 45, was handed five years for conspiracy and sexual assault. The gang's 59-year-old ringleader, who cannot be named for legal reasons, was sentenced to 19 years in jail

Abdul Aziz (left), 41, was given nine years for conspiracy and trafficking for sexual exploitation. Mohammed Sajid (right), 35, received 12 years tor conspiracy, trafficking, one count of rape and one count of sexual activity with a child

Hamid Safi (left), 22, was given four years for conspiracy and trafficking but not guilty of two counts of rape. Adil Khan (right), 42, was found guilty of conspiracy and trafficking for sexual exploitation

Kabeer Hassan (left), 25, was jailed for nine years for conspiracy and rape. Abdul Rauf (right), 43, was found guilty of conspiracy and trafficking for sexual exploitation and jailed for six years

looks like the title of the thread is correct and they're holding back in punishing these brown skinned assholes.

can't wait to see the thread where you're up in arms in regards to the hundreds of catholic priests who fuck little boys and a system that allows them to get away with it.

Thanks bud.

We gotta deport those Catholics, eh?

And right here right now in every city in Canada, Hell's Angels criminal creeps, mostly white, are raping and 'grooming' vulnerable girls and boys for the sex trade.

Let's deport all the white people too. ... Never should have let them in!! Riding a motorcycle? Must be a criminal creep. ... deport them all!!

OR ... treat crime as crime regardless of race, religion or culture perhaps?

I would deport the Vatican-authorized priests of 'Holy' Orders, the worst sex offenders, who answer to no church in Canada, only to the Pope ... himself guilty of enforcing protection of pedophile priests and arguably kingpin of the largest sex crime ring in the world.

It's about the crimes, not the cultures.

Edited September 25, 2012 by jacee

[jacee]

Michael Hardner is a bigot, of course, because when discussions involving culture/ethnicity arise, he is accusing his detractors of "racism" within about two seconds. And as you've said, he has such contempt for Muslims that he believes they should be judged by a different standard and given more leeway to be criminals. It's pathetic.

Pathetic? Got a mirror?

[Michael Hardner]

Pathetic? Got a mirror?

Let's not add insults to insults. The point is that I already asked K to back up his assertion that I accused people of racism. That was yesterday, and there was no response. He's also called me a "leftist" for some reason.

Posters like this eventually run out of baseless accusations and leave the board, from what I've seen.

[kraychik]

Let's not add insults to insults. The point is that I already asked K to back up his assertion that I accused people of racism. That was yesterday, and there was no response. He's also called me a "leftist" for some reason.

Posters like this eventually run out of baseless accusations and leave the board, from what I've seen.

You're not a left-winger? Thanks for proving my point that those on the left often view themselves as "moderates" or "centrists". You're objective, unbiased, and fair. You're post-ideology, post-partisan, and you only want to do "what works". Right?

[bud]

Bud, if you read the article you'll see that the police and child services knew about the raping of the 13 year old child long before the people responsible were brought to justice but were afraid of being labeled a racist.

that's obviously bullshit because they have had no problems arresting and sentencing other brown skinned people who have raped.

you sir are trying to create a story out of nothing. grow up.

[Guest American Woman]

Yes, it might be. As I stated.

Just pointing out that it's not just the opinion of the one former MP, which you were making reference to.

[Guest American Woman]

that's obviously bullshit because they have had no problems arresting and sentencing other brown skinned people who have raped.

you sir are trying to create a story out of nothing. grow up.

There's an investigation into why the police didn't inititally respond in the manner they should have, so it's not "a story out of nothing;" I've provided quotes and links that confirm that it's hardly "a story out of nothing."

The fact that they've had "no problems arresting and sentencing other brown skinned people who have raped" doesn't speak for this case and/or every case by any means. If fact, it's ridiculous and irresponsible to dismiss the possibility that 'the PC factor' is a problem, based on that criteria alone.

[Canuckistani]

This is a pretty old story. The police did admit they didn't interfere because they were afraid of being labelled racist. Social services did not act, even tho these were young girls underage. They were not just raped, but turned out as prostitutes.

Some people like to cry racist at the drop of a hat. I think it leads to this sort of bullshit. The judge in the case dismissed the allegations of racism made by the perpetrators. I think the people who need to be investigated are the officials who knew about this and did nothing. When the police in Vancouver didn't act while Willie Pickton went on his murderous rampage, they were accused of racism because many of the victims were Indigenous. This incident in England is the reverse side of that coin.