Ron Paul still may have a chance to beat Romney

[bush_cheney2004]

His supporters will love him no matter what, especially because Nixon is to blame for our economic woes today. Ron will create a gold-standard for the economy and once the minimum wage is gone, all of our salaries will soar !

Yes...it will be a grand time for all. Grandmas will start giving away Double Eagle coins again as birthday presents, and silver dollars will jingle in America's pockets once again. I can't wait...

[Jack Weber]

His supporters will love him no matter what, especially because Nixon is to blame for our economic woes today. Ron will create a gold-standard for the economy and once the minimum wage is gone, all of our salaries will soar !

I realize kool-aid drinkers are...kool-aid drinkers...

[bud]

ron paul is right; the current system is not sustainable.

if this continues, it's only a matter of time that it all collapses. i don't know if ron paul's system would succeed, because we don't have an example of it succeeding. however, we do have the example of the current system not succeeding.

[Michael Hardner]

ron paul is right; the current system is not sustainable.

Given that the sun will explode in 5 billion years, no system is sustainable.

if this continues, it's only a matter of time that it all collapses.

True - but what about the sun ?

i don't know if ron paul's system would succeed, because we don't have an example of it succeeding.

however, we do have the example of the current system not succeeding.

Also - don't forget the sun.

---

Seriously, 5,000 years of human history shows us that some things are always with us:

economics and scare mongering are just two of those things.

[bud]

Given that the sun will explode in 5 billion years, no system is sustainable.

True - but what about the sun ?

Also - don't forget the sun.

i thought you were above terrible sarcastic humour. oh well.

i'm talking about the credit and money printing system that the current economic structure is based on. i'm talking about the socialist system created for the corporations. i'm talking about the increasing power of the lobby/special interest groups that trump the need of the majority. the sun will outlive the current corrupt system just like it has during the collapse of numerous empires in the past 3000 years.

here is crrrrrazy ron paul and status quo paul krugman discussing the economic system:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5gv3DcyY38

[dre]

His supporters will love him no matter what, especially because Nixon is to blame for our economic woes today. Ron will create a gold-standard for the economy and once the minimum wage is gone, all of our salaries will soar !

Wow what trash. Strawman followed by another strawman, followed by retarded garbage. Hard to even tell who youre talking at here since nobody in this thread took any of those positions.

Hitting the sauce pretty hard tonight Mike?

Edited May 15, 2012 by dre

[dre]

Given that the sun will explode in 5 billion years, no system is sustainable.

True - but what about the sun ?

Also - don't forget the sun.

---

Seriously, 5,000 years of human history shows us that some things are always with us:

economics and scare mongering are just two of those things.

Ah yes, the sun...

Edited May 15, 2012 by dre

[dre]

i thought you were above terrible sarcastic humour. oh well.

i'm talking about the credit and money printing system that the current economic structure is based on. i'm talking about the socialist system created for the corporations. i'm talking about the increasing power of the lobby/special interest groups that trump the need of the majority. the sun will outlive the current corrupt system just like it has during the collapse of numerous empires in the past 3000 years.

here is crrrrrazy ron paul and status quo paul krugman discussing the economic system:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5gv3DcyY38

Responding to questions about the sustainability of something by pointing out that the sun will one day cease to exist is at least good for a few laughs

[dre]

Canada's recent debt to GDP peaked in 1995 and has declined sharply. Income gap and employment rates also improved in Canada since the magic Nixonian shock of 1971. But some folks would rather ignore such facts just to pursue a "golden" agenda.

This infantile lapse of logic has already been answered. And nobody in this thread that I know of is proposing a return the gold standard.

[dre]

That may all be true...

Mr. Paul is also an unabashed supporter of Right to Work legislation.We know this is corporate driven legislated union busting to artificially keep wages and benefits down under the guise of "individual worker rights and freedom"..

He let it slip in one of the debates that he feels the US requires a national RTW strategy to "compete" with the low wages that are seen in places like China.That's not "freedom",that's corporate tyrrany!Especially when one delves into who is really behind Right to Work...

So,either Mr. Paul is truly naive in thinking RTW is really about individual workers rights and freedoms in the workplace (which means he's completely clueless and infantile) or,he's a mouthpiece for the scary people behind Right to Work legislation (which makes him an ignorant elitist)...

Finally a post that attempts to actually discuss something. Youre right... Much of Ron Pauls adgenda is flat out crazy. Hes right on banking, mostly right on foreign policy, but I cant stomach anything else the guy says at all.

One quick point though... China can only flood the west with cheap garbage because we run large trade deficits with them. If we had sound money we couldnt do this, because we would simply run out of whatever was backing the purchasing power of our money. Of course to some extent this is already happening. Our dollars are losing value against most of the important things we need to buy (food, energy, college tuition, medical care, etc)

[Michael Hardner]

Responding to questions about the sustainability of something by pointing out that the sun will one day cease to exist is at least good for a few laughs

It's a response to irrational scare mongering, is what it is. 'Sustainability' is a relative term.

[Michael Hardner]

One quick point though... China can only flood the west with cheap garbage because we run large trade deficits with them.

"Cheap garbage" such as cars, electronics, pharmaceuticals ?

"We" run trade deficits ? Who is "we" ? Does that include the multinationals that manufacture over there, and secure profits on our shores ?

Our dollars are losing value against most of the important things we need to buy (food, energy, college tuition, medical care, etc)

"Our" dollars, again... you overstate the value of national borders. If they were as strong as you seem to think they are, then the business wouldn't go there in the first place.

[dre]

It's a response to irrational scare mongering, is what it is. 'Sustainability' is a relative term.

Pointing out that modern monetary policy is regressive isnt scare mongering. I explained exactly why thats the case and if you could write a real rebuttal or point out any obvious flaws in my logic you would have. You dont have a clue what youre talking about which is fine... not everyone is interested in this stuff, but not sure why youd bother polluting the thread with meaningless crap at all if thats the case.

[Michael Hardner]

Pointing out that modern monetary policy is regressive isnt scare mongering.

Saying the system is about to collapse is scare mongering.

I explained exactly why thats the case and if you could write a real rebuttal or point out any obvious flaws in my logic you would have.

Bud says: "ron paul is right; the current system is not sustainable."

That's a statement of a conclusion, not an argument. I feel fine with starting out a rebuttal by juxtaposing an opposing statement of equal weight, and a dash of ridiculous as well.

"Not sustainable" has, in these discussions, included a statement that economic systems have only gone up to 300 years without collapsing.

You dont have a clue what youre talking about which is fine... not everyone is interested in this stuff, but not sure why youd bother polluting the thread with meaningless crap at all if thats the case.

I came into these discussions on money supply and economics with less knowledge than I have now. You were very polite and engaged with me until I educated myself to the point where I disagreed with some of your more outrageous statements.

If we're talking about major changes to economies, which we are, then dispassionate consideration of facts is what needed, not scare-mongering and scapegoating.

[bush_cheney2004]

..."Our" dollars, again... you overstate the value of national borders. If they were as strong as you seem to think they are, then the business wouldn't go there in the first place.

Agreed...the self admitted commerce in cross border contracts belies any credibility in such a position. Fifteen years ago I provided "technology transfer" to the Chinese in exchange for opening up a huge market for my company's goods and proprietary processes. They were not the scary "red menace" so often portrayed in media, but rather hard working people with an insatiable appetite for "western ways".

If US investment is/was good enough for Canada, then it is is good enough for China too, with way more upside.

[bud]

Bud says: "ron paul is right; the current system is not sustainable."

That's a statement of a conclusion, not an argument. I feel fine with starting out a rebuttal by juxtaposing an opposing statement of equal weight, and a dash of ridiculous as well.

despite your troll-like comment, i gave a response and if you were truly interested in a real discussion, you would have responded to it.

however, you didn't respond. here is another chance:

i'm talking about the credit and money printing system that the current economic structure is based on. i'm talking about the socialist system created for the corporations. i'm talking about the increasing power of the lobby/special interest groups that trump the need of the majority.

this is the unsustainable system that, if not fixed, will result in a collapse.

Edited May 23, 2012 by bud