Quebec student strike

[jacee]

And then again, if its these antics that start putting tutions across the country back into perspective where students are subject to a Debt sentence after graduating then who knows...perhaps others will benefit without having to fight for it.

Even if the Students fail to achieve their goal of lower tutions, its set the tone to other students that you have to do SOMETHING (not necessarily strike) but something to get governments to put tuitions back to an affordable level.

As its well over 100days, I cannot see the Quebec government budging.

Yet I don't see a rise in the fortunes of any opposition party on this specific issue.

Charest did nothing because he was getting support for doing nothing. However, since the antiprotest law his support is sliding and support for the students is increasing. I think it was somewhat over 70% of Quebeckers said he should negotiate with students.

[Fletch 27]

THATS extreme!! I would settle for rubber bullets and a good hosing from a water-cannon. Then send the bill for the bullets to thier mommies. No need for the camps or gas chambers.. Yet..

Why stop there Peeves, why not say how you really want them to finish the job...

Concentration camps and some gas chambers would be right up your side's alley now wouldn't it...

[Rick]

THATS extreme!! I would settle for rubber bullets and a good hosing from a water-cannon. Then send the bill for the bullets to thier mommies. No need for the camps or gas chambers.. Yet..

I know...the camps aren't quite ready yet eh?

[TimG]

However, since the antiprotest law his support is sliding and support for the students is increasing.

More cluelessness on the part of the Quebequers I guess. What I find ironic is many of the opponents of this law are strong supporters of the 'bubble-zone laws' that keep protesters away from abortion clinics.

It is also worth noting that Bill 78 is temporary - it will expire automatically in 1 year. And that provision will likely be enough to protect it against any charter challenge.

Edited May 24, 2012 by TimG

[Signals.Cpl]

It's NOT a student protest! It's anarchy and rioting

What REALLY pisses me off is the support from outside agencies. The Marxist Syd Ryan and other union leaders taking members money from Ontario workers and giving it to lazy rioters that haven't a cause at all!

Imagine, they whine because the tuition would be increased a paltry amount. An amount that would,with inflation, be only what it was 40 years ago!. And amount that when it reached it's max. would still be lower than any other North American tuition!.

Then there are the leftist pinko profs and their agenda.

No! and NO!it's not about student demonstration it's insurrection, riot and anarchy!

And..arresting a few...20-30-40? Not enough, arrest anyone breaking the law even if that's a thousand. Pull in busses to cart them to some holding area. Charge them and jail them and fine them.

That's what you do with criminals.

http://torydrroy.blogspot.ca/2012/05/ezra-on-quebec-rioters.html

Truncated for brevity.

Full article at link.

The police does not need to arrest that many protestors, all they need to do is arrest at random, if there are 100 people that are breaking the law, take 15-20 at random and throw the book at them. This way everyone will think twice about breaking the law. If the there are thousands of "protestors" then many feel secure in the anonymity of the crowd but if the police take that security away by arresting the guilty parties at random then every one of them will think that they could be next.

[Fletch 27]

But But... Can we also leave the ones that smashed the car windows and threw the trash-can through the store-front? Im confused now.... Just pick "some" of the criminals? I agree with "Throw the book at them" but shouldnt the criminals also get the book thrown at them?

The police does not need to arrest that many protestors, all they need to do is arrest at random, if there are 100 people that are breaking the law, take 15-20 at random and throw the book at them. This way everyone will think twice about breaking the law. If the there are thousands of "protestors" then many feel secure in the anonymity of the crowd but if the police take that security away by arresting the guilty parties at random then every one of them will think that they could be next.

[fellowtraveller]

It's NOT a student protest! It's anarchy

I reckon you're right abouyt the first point and wrong about the second. The opponents of Charest-definitely unions and the PQ- see an opportunity to saw the legs off Charest and weaken his support going into an election.

The 'cause' is not releavnt, the mayhem on the streets suits them quite nicely.

Charest occasionally mumbles about trimming back the civil service, and that won't do.

It is not anarchy, but an increasingly well managed campaign to discredit the govt and influence the next election. The payoff for the students is that they will get whatever they want from a PQ govt for their service now.

[jacee]

http://m.ctv.ca/topstories/20120524/montreal-march-turns-violent-400-arrested-120524.html#menu

"We've actually been supportive of the position taken by the students from the beginning," said the executive director of the Canadian Association of University Teachers

"At the heart of it is an issue about ensuring that post-secondary education is accessible and our organization has held for many years that tuition fees are not the proper way to fund post-secondary education," James Turk said in an interview from Halifax.

The association has opposed tuition hikes in other provinces and Turk said the association s pleased students are speaking out against the "abandonment of the historic position of Quebec in keeping tuition fees accessible."

Turk said Canada has historically funded most of the costs for higher education, but over the last decade or so there's been a dramatic increase in the portion borne by students.

I think there's a definite signal here that there may be more student protests to come across Canada.

Edited May 25, 2012 by jacee

[jacee]

PANdemonium

Percussive protests took place Thursday night n neighbourhoods in Sorel, Longueuil, Chambly, Repentigny, Trois-Rivières, Quebec City and even in Abitibi — several hundred kilometres away from the hot spot of Montreal. Montreal They appeared nonetheless, loudest and most widespread in Montreal, where media reports ndicated the chorus of metallic clanks rang out at 8 p.m. in neighbourhoods around the city, spilling into the main demonstrations and sounding like aluminum symphonies. The pots-and-pans approach to protest has roots in Ireland and Chile, as a tool to express civil disobedience The noisy cacerolazo tradition predates the Pinochet regime in Chile, but has endured there and spread to other countries as a method of showing popular defiance.

...

On Thursday night, with thousands – including children, their parents, students and the elderly – packing the streets in support, the Twitterverse exploded with reactions and observations.“Spotted a man in an Armani suit banging a pot,” tweeted Christina Stimpson on one of Thursday’s participants. “Feel the love people.” Another man rolled a small barbecue through the streets of Montreal, banging the lid.

I love this method of protest! Just stand outside at 8pm and bang a pot!

Not sure if neighbours with young kids will appreciate it, but I have a feeling it's going to catch on, involve the whole community, not just those who are able to walk in the streets.

[Fletch 27]

Of coarse it will catch on in Quebec, The land of the "Gimme sonething for nuthin'"!

PANdemonium

Percussive protests took place Thursday night n neighbourhoods in Sorel, Longueuil, Chambly, Repentigny, Trois-Rivières, Quebec City and even in Abitibi — several hundred kilometres away from the hot spot of Montreal. Montreal They appeared nonetheless, loudest and most widespread in Montreal, where media reports ndicated the chorus of metallic clanks rang out at 8 p.m. in neighbourhoods around the city, spilling into the main demonstrations and sounding like aluminum symphonies. The pots-and-pans approach to protest has roots in Ireland and Chile, as a tool to express civil disobedience The noisy cacerolazo tradition predates the Pinochet regime in Chile, but has endured there and spread to other countries as a method of showing popular defiance.

...

On Thursday night, with thousands – including children, their parents, students and the elderly – packing the streets in support, the Twitterverse exploded with reactions and observations.“Spotted a man in an Armani suit banging a pot,” tweeted Christina Stimpson on one of Thursday’s participants. “Feel the love people.” Another man rolled a small barbecue through the streets of Montreal, banging the lid.

I love this method of protest! Just stand outside at 8pm and bang a pot!

Not sure if neighbours with young kids will appreciate it, but I have a feeling it's going to catch on, involve the whole community, not just those who are able to walk in the streets.

[Signals.Cpl]

But But... Can we also leave the ones that smashed the car windows and threw the trash-can through the store-front? Im confused now.... Just pick "some" of the criminals? I agree with "Throw the book at them" but shouldnt the criminals also get the book thrown at them?

If you have 1,000 or 10,000 people in the street protesting only a very small fraction of them don't care about arrest or the consequences, therefore if the police arrest people breaking the law at random at every protests, and by this I mean arresting throughout the area of the protest rather just the fringes where the protestors clash with police, there would be real fear in the protestors at that point that the police can and is enforcing the laws and breaking the law well behind the frontline of the protest is no guarantee you will not get arrested. If they arrest everyone on the frontline of the protest those in the back or the middle see the crowd as their security and thus they feel they can do anything without any consequence.

If I know that there are 100 people around me breaking the law but the police just arrested 20 of them at random then I will begin to think that hey maybe this is a bad idea because next time It could be me. And then if it is well publicized that they get jail time for their crimes or large financial hit for them people will think twice even if in a large crowd.

[g_bambino]

I love this method of protest!

I think you just love to protest.

[g_bambino]

since the antiprotest law...

Now, there's a good propagandist at work: turn something into what it is not in order to make people hate it.

The law doesn't ban protest.

[jacee]

Of coarse it will catch on in Quebec,

How about those Ontario students!

Here we go!

Ontario students plan support of Quebec counterparts

Ontario students are planning to take to the streets in solidarity with the students on strike in Quebec. A group of students and staff confirmed Friday at a Queen’s Park news conference that a rally is planned for June 5

“The most important thing we can do in Ontario to support the struggle in Quebec is to bring the spirit of democracy and activism into the province of Ontario,” said student and activist Xavier Lafrance. “The spirit is in the air. Mr. McGuinty needs to be aware that it can and will happen in Ontario.”

The group is calling on the provincial government to lower tuition costs, stating that since 2006 fees have raised by as much as 71%. In comparison, they pointed to the fact that Quebec’s students are opposing a 75% tuition hike.“We have to turn back what has happened here in Ontario,” said Sandy Hudson, chairperson of the Canadian Federation of Students – Ontario.

[Signals.Cpl]

How about those Ontario students!

Here we go!

Ontario students plan support of Quebec counterparts

Ontario students are planning to take to the streets in solidarity with the students on strike in Quebec. A group of students and staff confirmed Friday at a Queen’s Park news conference that a rally is planned for June 5

“The most important thing we can do in Ontario to support the struggle in Quebec is to bring the spirit of democracy and activism into the province of Ontario,” said student and activist Xavier Lafrance. “The spirit is in the air. Mr. McGuinty needs to be aware that it can and will happen in Ontario.”

The group is calling on the provincial government to lower tuition costs, stating that since 2006 fees have raised by as much as 71%. In comparison, they pointed to the fact that Quebec’s students are opposing a 75% tuition hike.“We have to turn back what has happened here in Ontario,” said Sandy Hudson, chairperson of the Canadian Federation of Students – Ontario.

And yet I haven't heard how they plan to fund that. With ontario having a deficit as it is, and Canada having a deficit as it is, and Quebec having a small deficit as it is I wonder who will pay for it. Do we have to bankrupt the country because people are unwilling to work to pay their way?

[g_bambino]

Hilarious: They ignore the courts when the courts rule against them, but now want to use the courts to advance their cause.

Quebec students and their union backers have filed a court challenge to strike down parts of the special provincial law that put limits on their right to protest.

Quebec students challenge bill aimed at protest crackdown

[ed.: sp]

Edited May 25, 2012 by g_bambino

[socialist]

Hilarious: They ignore the courts when the courts rule against them, but now want to use the courts to advance their cause.

[ed.: sp]

of course they are gonna fight for the right to protest and try to turn canada into a country that treats all equally. whats wrong with that?

[jacee]

And yet I haven't heard how they plan to fund that. With ontario having a deficit as it is, and Canada having a deficit as it is, and Quebec having a small deficit as it is I wonder who will pay for it. Do we have to bankrupt the country because people are unwilling to work to pay their way?

1) Cancel all corporate tax cuts, loopholes and writeoffs.

2) Cancel all corporate subsidies.

3) Raise taxes of the wealthiest, cancel loopholes and writeoffs (eg, wifey's money-losing business 'jobette' that is really just a writeoff, boats, jets and other toys that are claimed as 'business expenses', etc)

4) Hunt down those hiding UNTAXED money offshore, bring the money back, tax them and fine them and throw them in jail to think about it.

5) Tax investment income the same as employment income.

6) Invest in health and wellbeing of children and youth for savings in social, health and justice services.

...

Harper created the deficit and he can uncreate it.

Austerity-for-all-but-the-wealthiest is not on.

Edited May 25, 2012 by jacee

[g_bambino]

whats wrong with that?

"That" being what you said? It missed the point entirely.

[Signals.Cpl]

of course they are gonna fight for the right to protest and try to turn canada into a country that treats all equally. whats wrong with that?

And what do you mean treats all equally? Who is Canada NOT treating equally in this case?

[Signals.Cpl]

1) Cancel all corporate tax cuts, loopholes and write-offs.

Now justify why we should use the money from this source to pay for higher education to some people rather then pay down our national debt?

2) Cancel all corporate subsidies.

Quebec might not like that.

3) Raise taxes of the wealthiest, cancel loopholes and writeoffs (eg, wifey's money-losing business 'jobette' that is really just a writeoff, boats, jets and other toys that are claimed as 'business expenses', etc)

Define wealthiest, is it people who make 90k/year 150k/year or over a million/year? How are business jets not a business expense? For the rest I agree.

4) Hunt down those hiding UNTAXED money offshore, bring the money back, tax them and fine them and throw them in jail to think about it.

Any suggestions how?

5) Tax investment income the same as employment income.

Ok

6) Invest in health and wellbeing of children and youth for savings in social, health and justice services.

You mean like teachers telling them how to eat properly?

Harper created the deficit and he can uncreate it.

Austerity-for-all-but-the-wealthiest is not on.

Yeah and he created a 480 billion dollar debt too right?

Now, tell me how much money would it take to get free education to all Canadians, how much money you would get from these sources and why shouldn't we use these funds to improve healthcare, infrastructure, pay down the debt, rebuild the military, fix education problems in the primary and secondary level or give us all some tax cuts?

Edited May 25, 2012 by Signals.Cpl

[g_bambino]

Who is Canada NOT treating equally in this case?

One group of unequally treated people in Canada would be the students in every province other than Quebec who all pay higher fees for post-secondary education than students in Quebec do.

Conversely, one could see Quebec students as the ones being unfairly treated, given how unique they are amongst Canadians in terms of the low tuition they pay. If the Quebec protesters want equal treatment for all students in Canada, they could express a wish for their government to increase their school fees to a level that matches the average paid by students in the rest of Canada... [cough... hahah, yeah, right... cough]

[ed.: +]

Edited May 25, 2012 by g_bambino

[jacee]

And what do you mean treats all equally? Who is Canada NOT treating equally in this case?

Postsecondary students tuition is the edge of the wedge of G20 austerity.

It is being resisted.

[Signals.Cpl]

One group of unequally treated people in Canada would be the students in every province other than Quebec who all pay higher fees for post-secondary education than students in Quebec do.

Well aside from the students in other provinces and the other provinces that foot the bill for Quebec.

[socialist]

One group of unequally treated people in Canada would be the students in every province other than Quebec who all pay higher fees for post-secondary education than students in Quebec do.

education is a right that should be free. the university system is controlled by greedy pis who only care about money while keeping a portion of the population as serfs forever.