Who is the greatest Prime Minister of all time?

CPCFTW · January 4, 2012

good on ya! Having the courage to admit that Harper has no existing foundation to support... your... poll vote, is your first step. On the other hand, the fact you so unabashedly admit you voted Harper as the greatest... of all time... based on your expectations of what he may or may not do, may lead some to question the soundness of your, err... rationale/logic - just sayin!

I clearly stated that my support for Harper is not only based on my trust in his future accomplishments, but also on Canada not having any great PMs as competition. Did you expect me to vote for Trudeau for plunging Canada into socialism? :lol:

Evening Star · January 4, 2012

This is the best job anyone's done here of selling Harper.

It's true that we don't know what history will write of Harper......but history is in the making right now. I can think of several things that are building Harper's legacy:

1) Steering the economy through the worst modern recession. It's not that he did so many things right - it's that he's done very few things wrong.

2) His decision on long-term, predictable funding for Healthcare will prove to be prescient. Instead of the decades-old squabbling over money - each province will have to look for solutions.....they can't hide behind "it's Ottawa's fault". Look for some innovative approaches over the next 5 years that will become common across Canada.

3) He will apply a pragmatic approach to Native concerns that will have an incremental, substantial and positive effect. We'll finally be moving forward.

4) He has proven that the Federal Government does not have to be held hostage by Quebec to win a majority. Quebecers have not yet embraced Harper but he has shown respect for them by recognizing the Quebecois as a nation "within a united Canada" - and he speaks in both languages - usually French first when speaking publicly. One could say it's a coincidence - but the fact is that support for separation has dropped steadily since Harper came to power.

5) Slowly but surely, he is rebuilding Canada's sense of self - recognizing our history, re-enforcing our values. Surely people have recognized how Canadian history has all but disappeared from school carriculums. How many kids know about Vimy Ridge and the sacrifices of WWI and WWII. How about all of our Prime Ministers (this poll is a good example of the lack of knowledge). How about British history upon which our institutions are based. New Canadians are learning more about our country's history through the revised immigration policy.

waldo · January 4, 2012

I clearly stated that my support for Harper is not only based on my trust in his future accomplishments, but also on Canada not having any great PMs as competition. Did you expect me to vote for Trudeau for plunging Canada into socialism?

no... after failing to provide any manner of substantiating accomplishment, you quite clearly stated your vote for Harper as the greatest... of all time... of all time... was based on your hoped for future expectations! Unabashedly claimed it! Just wow - wow!

but let's play with your LOL, hey? Just exactly what/when/how did, as you say, "Trudeau plunge Canada into socialism"? Just what parts of a "socialist" Canada does one with a "CPC...FTW" board ID have concerns over? In your wet dream future expectations for Harper, just what do you want/expect Harper to do to remedy your concerns over these same "socialist" parts of Canada? Perhaps you can redeem yourself by, for a change, actually offering something to support your statements, hey?

CPCFTW · January 4, 2012

no... after failing to provide any manner of substantiating accomplishment, you quite clearly stated your vote for Harper as the greatest... of all time... of all time... was based on your hoped for future expectations! Unabashedly claimed it! Just wow - wow!

but let's play with your LOL, hey? Just exactly what/when/how did, as you say, "Trudeau plunge Canada into socialism"? Just what parts of a "socialist" Canada does one with a "CPC...FTW" board ID have concerns over? In your wet dream future expectations for Harper, just what do you want/expect Harper to do to remedy your concerns over these same "socialist" parts of Canada? Perhaps you can redeem yourself by, for a change, actually offering something to support your statements, hey?

I have no reason to "redeem" myself over your unnatural obsession with who I voted for in an anonymous poll on the mapleleafweb forums. I won't waste my time justifying a meaningless anonymous vote in response to your belittling remarks. Put the tinfoil hat back on and get back to cooking up conspiracy theories instead of worrying about who 20 people voted for on an anonymous mapleleafweb poll. I was just letting you know that it wasn't government brainwashed aliens from Andromeda. :lol:

Edited January 4, 2012 by CPCFTW

CPCFTW · January 4, 2012

I agree!

But then why did you vote for Harper?

And can you imagine how much better Canada would be if we had some good leaders,perhaps from the NDP!

WWWTT

Gross. We would be even worse off. We are in a decent position only because we embraced only moderate socialism rather than full fledged socialism. We would be in Greece's position had we had NDP leaders. We will need a decade of Harper rule to right the ship... but that's a hell of a lot better than Greece will do.

waldo · January 4, 2012

Did you expect me to vote for Trudeau for plunging Canada into socialism?
but let's play with your LOL, hey? Just exactly what/when/how did, as you say, "Trudeau plunge Canada into socialism"? Just what parts of a "socialist" Canada does one with a "CPC...FTW" board ID have concerns over? In your wet dream future expectations for Harper, just what do you want/expect Harper to do to remedy your concerns over these same "socialist" parts of Canada? Perhaps you can redeem yourself by, for a change, actually offering something to support your statements, hey?

We are in a decent position only because we embraced only moderate socialism rather than full fledged socialism.

??? so... in FTW world, decent equates to... "moderate socialism". Just how did 'we' get from your denigrating Trudeau "plunge into socialism", to your, now walk-backed, "decent socialism", hey? :lol:

by the by... your misplaced exception to my suggestion you redeem yourself was in terms of you actually finally answering questions to substantiate your claims. In any case, although you again avoided answering questions to clarify your "Trudeau plunge into socialism" statement... to project your greatest of all time expectations on Harper remedying "the plunge"... reading you walk-back your statement to "decent socialism" is even better than seeing you attempt to actually substantiate another of your statements. It was gold, real gold...

as for the poll itself, it has no magic hold/meaning - it's nothing more than another anonymous online poll... but I've just now checked the results again and laugh at where the latest flurry of votes magically came from to 'tie it up'. You also must be new to what 'freeping' a poll means. What's most bizarre is to read you take exception to having the Macleans survey of ~120 experts posted... you know, to read cross-Canada expert career views of those ensconced in history, political science, economics, etc..... that you would take exception to having the views of who the experts interpret as the 'best' Prime Ministers of Canada... of all time!

cybercoma · January 4, 2012

I have no reason to "redeem" myself over your unnatural obsession with who I voted for in an anonymous poll on the mapleleafweb forums. I won't waste my time justifying a meaningless anonymous vote in response to your belittling remarks. Put the tinfoil hat back on and get back to cooking up conspiracy theories instead of worrying about who 20 people voted for on an anonymous mapleleafweb poll. I was just letting you know that it wasn't government brainwashed aliens from Andromeda.

And you're not going to bother substantiating your claim about Trudeau either because you can't.

CPCFTW · January 4, 2012

??? so... in FTW world, decent equates to... "moderate socialism". Just how did 'we' get from your denigrating Trudeau "plunge into socialism", to your, now walk-backed, "decent socialism", hey?

by the by... your misplaced exception to my suggestion you redeem yourself was in terms of you actually finally answering questions to substantiate your claims. In any case, although you again avoided answering questions to clarify your "Trudeau plunge into socialism" statement... to project your greatest of all time expectations on Harper remedying "the plunge"... reading you walk-back your statement to "decent socialism" is even better than seeing you attempt to actually substantiate another of your statements. It was gold, real gold...

as for the poll itself, it has no magic hold/meaning - it's nothing more than another anonymous online poll... but I've just now checked the results again and laugh at where the latest flurry of votes magically came from to 'tie it up'. You also must be new to what 'freeping' a poll means. What's most bizarre is to read you take exception to having the Macleans survey of ~120 experts posted... you know, to read cross-Canada expert career views of those ensconced in history, political science, economics, etc..... that you would take exception to having the views of who the experts interpret as the 'best' Prime Ministers of Canada... of all time!

I'm sorry I'm not quite clear on what you're asking. Could you use more ellipses? :lol:

Edited January 4, 2012 by CPCFTW

waldo · January 4, 2012

Could you use more ellipses?

I accept your unconditional capitulation!

sharkman · January 4, 2012

I just noticed that Harper is #1 on this poll. That's kind of odd, isn't it?

CPCFTW · January 4, 2012

In any case, although you again avoided answering questions to clarify your "Trudeau plunge into socialism" statement... to project your greatest of all time expectations on Harper remedying "the plunge"... reading you walk-back your statement to "decent socialism" is even better than seeing you attempt to actually substantiate another of your statements. It was gold, real gold...

You should add that to your sign right underneath the part about how the government stole your hat. Have your empty timmies cup ready, I have a quarter with your name on it! :lol:

Wild Bill · January 4, 2012

I just noticed that Harper is #1 on this poll. That's kind of odd, isn't it?

Not at all! MLW has always been more of a conservative board. Those of other persuasions are merely a vocal minority.

Would you not expect a poll on "rubble.com" to favour Jack Layton as best party leader ever?

waldo · January 4, 2012

I just noticed that Harper is #1 on this poll. That's kind of odd, isn't it?

well, factoring out the guys who voted based on future expectations... it is odd on several levels. Although Harper has now governed for a period of time that places him in the 'longer serving' category, he has managed no real 'lasting achievements'... other than to reinforce his partisanship, disrespect for Parliament and authoritarian governing style. That he is "not Liberal" seems to be the prevailing benchmark for many... all that is required! :lol:

waldo · January 4, 2012

You should add that to your sign right underneath the part about how the government stole your hat. Have your empty timmies cup ready, I have a quarter with your name on it!

buddy... like cybercoma highlighted! You won't back up your statement about "Trudeau plunging Canada into socialism"... because, you can't!

sharkman · January 4, 2012

Not at all! MLW has always been more of a conservative board. Those of other persuasions are merely a vocal minority.

Would you not expect a poll on "rubble.com" to favour Jack Layton as best party leader ever?

Hmm, yes, a very very vocal minority.

WWWTT · January 4, 2012

Gross. We would be even worse off. We are in a decent position only because we embraced only moderate socialism rather than full fledged socialism. We would be in Greece's position had we had NDP leaders. We will need a decade of Harper rule to right the ship... but that's a hell of a lot better than Greece will do.

Man you change your mind like dirty underwear!

First you say Canada has done well because of our natural resources-good coment that I agree with.

But then somehow and for some reason if there was an NDP PM Canada would suddenly turn into Greece.Greece?!?!

How does Canada go from the second largest country(geographical),largest in resources to a small barren hot Medeterrarian only resource is tourism country?Where did all the mountains,rivers,lakes,coastline,forests,agriculture,people,farms,fields,buildings etc etc etc go?!?!?

And where did North America go,would we then be in the geographical location of Europe?Would we then be an archipegalo of small islands making up an land mass less then that of southern Ontario?

Is Harper somehow responsible for keeping Canada in North America and is he aswell responsible for the size and geography of Canada?Is Harper responsible for the natural resourses in Canada?Did Harper create the forest and all of Canadas fresh water?

According to you if Harper was not PM all the fish would die!99% of all the fresh water would evaporate!Over 95% of Canadas land mass would disapear and approx.60-70% of Canadas population would die or dissapear!

Absolutely incredible!

WWWTT

UofGPolitico · January 4, 2012

I picked Lester Pearson just purely based on what he accomplished in such a short period of time and with a minority government no-less. In my lifetime though I'd probably pick Stephen Harper.

jbg · January 4, 2012

I picked Lester Pearson just purely based on what he accomplished in such a short period of time and with a minority government no-less. In my lifetime though I'd probably pick Stephen Harper.

Pearson's "accomplishments":

Shredding Canada's flag;
Ditching the Red Ensign for the Liberal Party banner;
"Bi-bi" policies which elevated an enclave's culture to a position dominant over the majority;
Opening the immigration floodgates to people with nothing in common with Canadians; and
Birthing Trudeaumania

Great work, Lester.

And I should add, becoming an airport.

LonJowett · January 4, 2012

Pearson's "accomplishments":

[*]Shredding Canada's flag;

[*]Ditching the Red Ensign for the Liberal Party banner;

Aren't one and two the same thing? But I don't think there's a living soul in Canada who opposes that change. I guess it's only a concern among Republicans from the U.S. :lol:

Evening Star · January 4, 2012

Everything he did, aside from the official languages act, which has itself accomplished nothing of substance, has been done at around the same time in every other western nation save the US. Trudeau simply adopted what everyone else was adopting. If Trudeau hadn't done it someone else would have.

I have to assume that this is not true at least of the repatriation of the Constitution and the Charter of Rights.

Evening Star · January 4, 2012

Not at all! MLW has always been more of a conservative board. Those of other persuasions are merely a vocal minority.

Would you not expect a poll on "rubble.com" to favour Jack Layton as best party leader ever?

Under Layton, the NDP became the Official Opposition and also won most of Quebec's seats, crushing the BQ in the process. These are two truly historic achievements in NDP history. It's much harder to say that Harper has so far achieved something on that scale for his cause(s). (And I hope he fails to ever do so, though he very well may!)

In any case, I would have probably expected Tommy Douglas to win that poll on Babble, although you might be right. I don't think it's that clear-cut anyway.

jbg · January 4, 2012

Aren't one and two the same thing? But I don't think there's a living soul in Canada who opposes that change. I guess it's only a concern among Republicans from the U.S.

I am from the U.S. I am not a Republican. I am a liberal Democrat.

And as for the flag, yes I know those "accomplishments" are similar, and deplorable.

Edited January 4, 2012 by jbg

Evening Star · January 4, 2012

Come on, surely you love all the social programmes that began under LBP. Not mentioning universal health care must be a deliberate omission in any case.

And don't tell me you prefer the immigration policy that preceded points-based immigration in Canada. (If anyone truly 'opened the floodgates', it was probably PET and I love him for it.)

Pearson's "accomplishments":

Shredding Canada's flag;

Ditching the Red Ensign for the Liberal Party banner;

"Bi-bi" policies which elevated an enclave's culture to a position dominant over the majority;

Opening the immigration floodgates to people with nothing in common with Canadians; and

Birthing Trudeaumania

Great work, Lester.

And I should add, becoming an airport.

LonJowett · January 5, 2012

I am from the U.S. I am not a Republican. I am a liberal Democrat.

And as for the flag, yes I know those "accomplishments" are similar, and deplorable.

In Canada, we love our flag. We were happy to ditch the British version.

You indicated in a recent post you are a registered Republican. Your posts clearly indicate you are neither liberal nor a Democrat.

guyser · January 5, 2012

Pearson's "accomplishments":

Shredding Canada's flag;

It wasnt ours in the true sense.
We now have one, a fine one I might add.

Ditching the Red Ensign for the Liberal Party banner;

Big deal

"Bi-bi" policies which elevated an enclave's culture to a position dominant over the majority;
Opening the immigration floodgates to people with nothing in common with Canadians; and
Birthing Trudeaumania

Great work, Lester.

I might get some blowback, but those are accomplishments that we have highly benefitted from.