olp1fan Posted November 28, 2011 Report Posted November 28, 2011 the rights of residency will still be there, bring cash buy a home and or business and I'm in...but then cuba is looking good to me as well... why would you leave a safe nation like Canada and move to Europe? Quote
Jack Weber Posted November 28, 2011 Report Posted November 28, 2011 Currency Unions = Bad Idea. Especially when there is'nt really a central government creating policy for all the disparate members.. Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
WWWTT Posted November 28, 2011 Report Posted November 28, 2011 Yeah, what would those grasshoppers do if the worker ants like Germany and France can't hold it together anymore? Actually France,Germany,Netherlands,British isles(northern Europe in general) made circumstance difficult in the south. I don't believe its entirely the fault of the north,just saying their hands aren't squeeky clean and that this situation is much more difficult/complicated then we may think when all we know is what we see on the 6 o'clock news. WWWTT Quote Maple Leaf Web is now worth $720.00! Down over $1,500 in less than one year! Total fail of the moderation on this site! That reminds me, never ask Greg to be a business partner! NEVER!
dre Posted November 28, 2011 Report Posted November 28, 2011 Yeah, what would those grasshoppers do if the worker ants like Germany and France can't hold it together anymore? Problem is, recession and currency devaluation are economic medicine that force you to change your behavior. If countries like Greece had their own currency they could just tell international bankers to piss up a rope like Argentina did, suffer the recession and come back stronger. Devaluation helps encourage domestic production and exports while discouraging imports. This would help these countries in the long term, and they would be debt free. Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
Wild Bill Posted November 28, 2011 Report Posted November 28, 2011 Germany and France are far more socialist than we are with state-sponsored universities and healthcare, subsidized food prices and high taxation. Perhaps they are, Michael. So what? As long as they pay their own way they are entitled to have any political system they want. My point is that many of the EU nations have NEVER paid their own way and eagerly joined the EU to sponge off the productivity of others. I think that if you worked in Germany you would feel very resentful of Greece, Spain and Portugal right about now. Certainly you would have little consequence that having to be taxed for a bailout won't mean constantly being taxed to do the same thing over and over, since those countries have learned they don't have to! After all, they've been bailed out before, are being bailed out now and will likely be bailed out again! Perhaps resentful is too mild a word. Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
olp1fan Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 So what? As long as they pay their own way they are entitled to have any political system they want. Unless they want communism right? Quote
Wild Bill Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 Unless they want communism right? Why not? A communist is only a problem if he decides to rob you because his own system doesn't work. There were may communist governments in Europe before the fall of the USSR. France or Germany never cared about the economic problems of communist Poland or the Ukraine, except maybe to gloat a bit! No, most folks can get along with anyone as long as he buys his share of the beer! Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
wyly Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 Germany and France are far more socialist than we are with state-sponsored universities and healthcare, subsidized food prices and high taxation. even the conservative EU governments are as socialist if not more so than we are... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
wyly Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 why would you leave a safe nation like Canada and move to Europe? get a passport and see the world, i've never felt unsafe in europe...mild climate, multiple vibrant cultures, anything i can buy here i can find there...retiring to a low crime seaside location on the Mediterranean in a modern civilized culture where's the downside?... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
olp1fan Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 (edited) get a passport and see the world, i've never felt unsafe in europe...mild climate, multiple vibrant cultures, anything i can buy here i can find there...retiring to a low crime seaside location on the Mediterranean in a modern civilized culture where's the downside?... you really should move there then like now hop on that plane! btw culture sucks, I hate religion and religion is mainly culture Edited November 29, 2011 by olp1fan Quote
wyly Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 you really should move there then like now hop on that plane! btw culture sucks, I hate religion and religion is mainly culture someday you'll move out of your moms basement and see that the big scary world isn't so scary after all... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
olp1fan Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 someday you'll move out of your moms basement and see that the big scary world isn't so scary after all... I don't and the world is very scary Quote
Michael Hardner Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 Perhaps they are, Michael. So what? As long as they pay their own way they are entitled to have any political system they want. Your quote: "A couple of producing countries and a whole passle of socialistic deadbeat nations looking for someone else to sponge off when the budgets needed to be balanced." My point is that many of the EU nations have NEVER paid their own way and eagerly joined the EU to sponge off the productivity of others. Understood, but the socialism of participating countries doesn't seem to be the matter here. Quote Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
wyly Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 A couple of producing countries and a whole passle of socialistic deadbeat nations looking for someone else to sponge off when the budgets needed to be balanced. there was never an intention of any nation to sponge off others...characterizing it as "socialist' sponging of non socialist countries is absolutely false, germany, france, netherlands, are very socialist...the issue is responsible spending,if nations want to have strong social programs they need to be able to pay for them, greece could not... The entire Union was always a political thing and never a true economic one. it was economic from day one with the original Benelux (belguim,netherlands,luxemburg)Agreement, political considerations came later... Quote “Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives.”- John Stuart Mill
Wild Bill Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 Your quote: "A couple of producing countries and a whole passle of socialistic deadbeat nations looking for someone else to sponge off when the budgets needed to be balanced." Understood, but the socialism of participating countries doesn't seem to be the matter here. No contradiction from me, Michael. If a nation chooses to be socialistic or even communist that's their business! Expecting to be bankrolled by their more productive neighbours is another thing altogether... Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
Michael Hardner Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 No contradiction from me, Michael. If a nation chooses to be socialistic or even communist that's their business! Your warm embrace of Communism is comforting to us comrades. We will remember this act of kindness on your part, after the revolution. Quote Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
Wild Bill Posted November 29, 2011 Report Posted November 29, 2011 Your warm embrace of Communism is comforting to us comrades. We will remember this act of kindness on your part, after the revolution. I wouldn't call it a warm embrace, Michael. I happen to believe that no communist country EVER prospers economically and ALWAYS looks to other countries for bailouts! However, as I said, the problem is not that they are communist. If they can make it work more power to them. They just would have a hard time finding a successful model to emulate. How about North Korea? That's worked out well! Meanwhile, the problems of countries like Greece were there long before they joined the EU. If they ever had any intention of being fiscally responsible and productive I've yet to see any evidence of it. Quote "A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul." -- George Bernard Shaw "There is no point in being difficult when, with a little extra effort, you can be completely impossible."
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