Derek 2.0 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 Canada's can't-do attitude is legendary. Sure, when reality comes into play..... Quote
DogOnPorch Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 Sure, when reality comes into play..... You and I would go nuts buying ships if able...lol. We're not the issue. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Derek 2.0 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 You and I would go nuts buying ships if able...lol. We're not the issue. Not at all, but the Russian Mistrals were/are a solution looking for a problem in Canadian service. Quote
DogOnPorch Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 No way...is Canada not a seafaring nation ? Build ships I say...build them now...on budget if possible...but always fine ships ! Please....nothing says attack submarine quite like Virginia. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
bush_cheney2004 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 How was this sad constipation story busted loose last time (Halifax class) ? Who needs to be bribed ? Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
DogOnPorch Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 Not at all, but the Russian Mistrals were/are a solution looking for a problem in Canadian service. Probably. But so are countless 'Syrian' refugees which promise to suck billions if not more....more zeros, that is. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Smallc Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 (edited) Not if we're to become a coast guard.........like I was saying. For what we do, the reality is, we may not need AAD. Self defence systems for each of the major combatants, as we have right now, is probably enough. Note that if it were up to me, we'd be getting a larger number of more capable ships, no matter the cost - I'm dealing in reality. No matter who is in power when these are built, it looks like we're going to have to sacrifice something. What Canada does, for the most part, requires combatants, but not AAD. Edited December 4, 2015 by Smallc Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 Probably. But so are countless 'Syrian' refugees which promise to suck billions if not more....more zeros, that is. For the money spent to allow them to enter Canadian service, we could have built several AFSBs like USNS Chesty Puller...... Quote
Smallc Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 For the money spent to allow them to enter Canadian service, we could have built several AFSBs like USNS Chesty Puller...... See, for what Canada does, this, or a Mistral type ship built for us, would be useful. Of course then, we probably need AAD. Quote
DogOnPorch Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 Good old Chesty. Bloody Ridge and such. I agree...or build our own. But like 'dog-fighting', there is no 2nd place in the warship biz. We had better build good ones armed to the teeth. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
bush_cheney2004 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 Good old Chesty. Bloody Ridge and such. I agree...or build our own. But like 'dog-fighting', there is no 2nd place in the warship biz. We had better build good ones armed to the teeth. That's the spirit....build good ones because they need to last a long time. Damn the bean counters....full speed ahead ! Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
DogOnPorch Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 That's the spirit....build good ones because they need to last a long time. Damn the bean counters....full speed ahead ! Hooper: Aye-aye, Captain...arrr, arrr. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
DogOnPorch Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 Hooper: ...arrrr...Jimboy....arrr. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
bush_cheney2004 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 Maybe what you guys need is a bitchin' YouTube video to get into the shipbuilding mood: Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Derek 2.0 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 For what we do, the reality is, we may not need AAD. Self defence systems for each of the major combatants, as we have right now, is probably enough. Not if we ever envision ourselves operating in a medium threat environment......see INS Hanit. Note that if it were up to me, we'd be getting a larger number of more capable ships, no matter the cost - I'm dealing in reality. No matter who is in power when these are built, it looks like we're going to have to sacrifice something. What Canada does, for the most part, requires combatants, but not AAD. Ahh no, what Canada has done operationally, since the Halifax class entered service, could have been done with the USCG's National Security Cutters........we have/had combatants in case of war, where sending naval forces abroad without a modern area air defense capability would be criminal........without an AAD capability, we're at the mercy of every third world tin-pot with a former Soviet Missile boat armed with supersonic anti ship missiles. As such, if this Government is not prepared to invest in modern defensive capacities for our navy, we'd be better off cutting our losses and build a second batch of AOPS and call it a day..... Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 As such, if this Government is not prepared to invest in modern defensive capacities for our navy, we'd be better off cutting our losses and build a second batch of AOPS and call it a day..... Oh...I get it...build Q-ships like in WW2. Sneaky AOPS that are heavily armed....I like it ! Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
DogOnPorch Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 Speaking of Chesty, BC...I recall building his kit back in the day. This looks like the one. http://www.militarymodelling.com/sites/1/images/member_albums/120591/426326.jpg Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Derek 2.0 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 Oh...I get it...build Q-ships like in WW2. Sneaky AOPS that are heavily armed....I like it ! Nope, remuster as a Coast Guard........ Quote
DogOnPorch Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 I think it was WW1 with the ol' Q-Ships...at least originally. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Smallc Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 build a second batch of AOPS and call it a day..... I'm thinking something faster, and lighter...and far better armed. Quote
Smallc Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 without an AAD capability, we're at the mercy of every third world tin-pot with a former Soviet Missile boat armed with supersonic anti ship missiles. We do that all the time now, without AAD. If we're in a shooting war, we're probably not going to be in it alone. If we're not willing to put more money into the program, AAD is the obvious cut if you want to save a great deal of money. Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 I'm thinking something faster, and lighter...and far better armed. Why? That's what the helicopter is for.......and why would it need to be better armed to fend off drug smugglers and poachers? Quote
Derek 2.0 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 We do that all the time now, without AAD. If we're in a shooting war, we're probably not going to be in it alone. If we're not willing to put more money into the program, AAD is the obvious cut if you want to save a great deal of money. We've been shot at with supersonic missiles? If we're in a shooting war, we can provide trainers and warm blankets, and be smug in the knowledge that we've saved billions......... The obvious cut is dependent on who decides......the RCN would sacrifice GP frigate numbers over modern AAD. Quote
DogOnPorch Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 What about Red China and Russia who are bound to cause Canada a few issues over territory in the future? A coastguard cutter with a deck gun might not impress them. Something that can drop a pill on 'em is the language they understand. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Derek 2.0 Posted December 4, 2015 Report Posted December 4, 2015 What about Red China and Russia who are bound to cause Canada a few issues over territory in the future? A coastguard cutter with a deck gun might not impress them. Something that can drop a pill on 'em is the language they understand. Well no, it wouldn't impress them........but this thought exercise is on Canada not being able to afford a modern navy. Quote
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