who are the rioters?

Thorn · August 11, 2011

Want to know what the "less-well off" and "students with pink hair and trendy pop-band t-shirts" have in common with regards to "poverty?" Both groups feel impoverished from power so they took an opportunity to grab some when they could

How much power do you believe such people should have or deserve to have? Bear in mind that the U.K. has had a very progressive government for decades now which has done its level best to assist, understand and empower those in poverty, most especially including ethnic groups and enclaves. They have also gone a long way to ease the harshness of law and policing and to force a more cooperative and tolerant approach on local police in their dealings with the 'downtrodden', if you will. None of that appears to have had the slightest positive impact. A sizable number of young people make little effort at their education, binge drink, drop out of school, and go on public assistance with little thought of real alternatives. They don't want to sit in boring classrooms and learn anything. They wouldn't mind a high paying job but have no skills with which to obtain one. Nor, in fact, do they seem to have the drive or motivation even to obtain a lower paying, low skill job. And on those occasions when they do, by chance, their work ethic is so low they can't keep one.

So just how much power and what kind of power do you believe such people deserve to have?

They took the initiative and made their own statement loud and clear. For a few moments they rejected this horsehit left-right model and went for one of their own.

Don't pretend their actions were a political statement. They weren't. At most, their actions are a statement on the thin veneer of civilization resting upon many of them. It takes little imagination to see where, absent the police, such behaviour would quickly have gone. Rioting, robbery, violence and arson would be followed by more organized violence where gangs would stake out territory, taking and holding it by violence against anyone and everyone, and then, of course imposing their own rules on the residents. It's almost tribal, harkening back thousands of years.

DogOnPorch · August 11, 2011

Oleg Bach · August 11, 2011

Don't usually listen to videos but I took some time here and flicked a few switches - the only thing the old guy got wrong was the "packet of herion" - any rioter that had junk or used junk would have been home sleeping...other than that little error, He was hard hitting and right on target...sad to say...But how do you repair these problems with a youth culture that have not been trained or to take pride in the art of thinking?

This was always my point also - some where along the line in life- you decide whether it be formal - or informal - that you want to KNOW - to understand - to be educated....to develope as a human being...ignorance is not about intelligence it is about a choice to ignore intelligence. I have seen single mothers who dispise education and teach there kids to do the same..they simply DO NOT WHAT TO KNOW...Because to become aware means to become responsilble.

Shwa · August 11, 2011

How much power do you believe such people should have or deserve to have? Bear in mind that the U.K. has had a very progressive government for decades now which has done its level best to assist, understand and empower those in poverty, most especially including ethnic groups and enclaves. They have also gone a long way to ease the harshness of law and policing and to force a more cooperative and tolerant approach on local police in their dealings with the 'downtrodden', if you will. None of that appears to have had the slightest positive impact. A sizable number of young people make little effort at their education, binge drink, drop out of school, and go on public assistance with little thought of real alternatives. They don't want to sit in boring classrooms and learn anything. They wouldn't mind a high paying job but have no skills with which to obtain one. Nor, in fact, do they seem to have the drive or motivation even to obtain a lower paying, low skill job. And on those occasions when they do, by chance, their work ethic is so low they can't keep one.

Well I guess those best efforts didn't work out now did they because THEY STILL have problems. Maybe more workhouses? More prisons?

So just how much power and what kind of power do you believe such people deserve to have?

Deserve? Have you not been keeping up with your current events? They got all the power they deserved and look what they did with it. For a moment, they were pretty powerful.

Don't pretend their actions were a political statement. They weren't. At most, their actions are a statement on the thin veneer of civilization resting upon many of them. It takes little imagination to see where, absent the police, such behaviour would quickly have gone. Rioting, robbery, violence and arson would be followed by more organized violence where gangs would stake out territory, taking and holding it by violence against anyone and everyone, and then, of course imposing their own rules on the residents. It's almost tribal, harkening back thousands of years.

No shit sherlock. Try to follow along will ya? :rolleyes:

Shwa · August 11, 2011

Thanks for the reference. But just like other observers of what's going on, I'll stick to formulating my assessment with the information currently available from various sources.

Of course you will. But, above all, make sure those sources align with your ideological outlook.

The lessons to be learned will be of greater benefit to those dealing directly with the situation.

And what "lessons" do you think they will learn? Hopefully the first lesson they learn is that no matter what you do, when people get fed up enough, they riot.

I don't understand how you could draw a parallel between those events and the wanton lawlessness in the UK.

I am sure those on the side of Ben Ali, Mubarek and Assad would disagree with you.

DogOnPorch · August 11, 2011

And what "lessons" do you think they will learn? Hopefully the first lesson they learn is that no matter what you do, when people get fed up enough, they riot.

Ah yes...the Hell Hole that is London. No opportunities there, at all.

August 11, 2011

Ah yes...the Hell Hole that is London. No opportunities there, at all.

Can you blame the "less fortunate" masses for just helping themselves to others' hard earned property? They're entitled to so much more than what they've been given!

M.Dancer · August 11, 2011

Ah yes...the Hell Hole that is London. No opportunities there, at all.

Oh come on..it can take 30 to 45 minutes from Walthamstow to the other side of town by subway...surely you can't expect people to travel that far for a job!

DogOnPorch · August 11, 2011

Oh come on..it can take 30 to 45 minutes from Walthamstow to the other side of town by subway...surely you can't expect people to travel that far for a job!

McDonalds is always hiring...even in yea olde Engelande. But, I imagine the local McDs was looted for their designer Hot Apple Pies just like the other shops on the High Street. "A pity" as the old Red Rose cliche' goes.

bud · August 11, 2011

here is a list of looters and rioters who appeared in court. most of their names and images appear in the gallery. notice that majority are not black youths or asians. most are white:

Bernard Moore, 46, of Monsall was jailed for 20 weeks for assaulting a police officer during the rioting in Manchester city centre
Owen Flanagan, 28, of Burnage was jailed for eight months for stealing clothes and electrical items
Paul Ruane, 47, of Newton Heath was jailed for eight weeks for handling stolen goods during the rioting in Manchester
Tom Skinkis, 22, of Manchester was sentenced to four months for a section 4 public order offence during the rioting in Manchester
Jason Ullett, 38, of Ancoats was sentenced to 10 weeks in prison for a section 4 public order offence during the rioting in Manchester
Aaron Grima, 22, of Eccles was jailed for four months for attacking a police officer during the rioting in Manchester
Ricky Gemmell, 18, of Manchester was sentenced to 16 weeks in youth custody for a section 4 public order offence during the rioting in Manchester
Paul Obonyano, 42, of Moss Side was jailed for 14 weeks for assaulting a police officer and a public order offence during the rioting in Manchester
Alexis Bailey, 31, from Battersea, south London, appears at Highbury Corner Magistrates' Court. He was arrested in Richer Sounds in Southend Road, Croydon, and pleaded guilty to burglary with intent to steal.
Richard Myles-Palmer appears at court. He was found wheeling a shopping trolley full of stolen power tools through south London
Palmer and his co-defendant, Jason Gary White, pleaded guilty and were referred to the Crown Court for sentence.
An 11-year-old boy who admitted looting a Debenhams in Romford arrives at Highbury Magistrates Court
A 12-year-old boy, who can not be named or identified for legal reasons, leaves Manchester Magistrates Court after he appeared in the dock. The boy appeared in a separate youth court, before District Judge Jonathan Feinstein. He admitted burglary after being spotted running from a looted Sainsbury's shop carrying a £7.49 bottle of wine
Four teenagers who were arrested by police in Liverpool appeared at Liverpool Magistrates Court. They were: Michael Doyle, 19
Sebastian Praxitelous, 18
Joseph Moran, 18

where is the anti-immigration crowd?

Edited August 11, 2011 by bud

DogOnPorch · August 11, 2011

Finally...the Race Card is played. It's rather obvious that only white folks were involved in these riots.

:lol:

Edited August 11, 2011 by DogOnPorch

M.Dancer · August 11, 2011

Alexis Bailey, 31, from Battersea, south London, appears at Highbury Corner Magistrates' Court. He was arrested in Richer Sounds in Southend Road, Croydon, and pleaded guilty to burglary with intent to steal. The 31-year-old, who works full-time in a primary school in Stockwell and lives with his parents, was given bail but must adhere to a curfew. His case was committed to Wood Green Crown Court for sentencing. There was a moment of humour as he covered his face with a newspaper and walked into a lamp post

:lol: :lol:

DogOnPorch · August 11, 2011

Shwa · August 11, 2011

Can you blame the "less fortunate" masses for just helping themselves to others' hard earned property? They're entitled to so much more than what they've been given!

Why "less fortunate?"

Shwa · August 11, 2011

Ah yes...the Hell Hole that is London. No opportunities there, at all.

Do you think the rioters care?

August 11, 2011

Why "less fortunate?"

Isn't that the way this is being played out? - That the rioters and looters are the oppressed, the forgotten, the disillusioned?

GostHacked · August 11, 2011

People don't seem to like austerity measures. Cutting jobs, wages, benefits, all while the cost of living goes up, and all you can afford is cheap stuff from places like China because all your good manufacturing jobs have been moved there.

But if I was to riot against the system in England, I'd take the fight down to Canary Wharf and see how fast the cops react.

DogOnPorch · August 11, 2011

Do you think the rioters care?

Then 'no jobs' isn't an excuse.

DogOnPorch · August 11, 2011

People don't seem to like austerity measures. Cutting jobs, wages, benefits, all while the cost of living goes up, and all you can afford is cheap stuff from places like China because all your good manufacturing jobs have been moved there.

But if I was to riot against the system in England, I'd take the fight down to Canary Wharf and see how fast the cops react.

The Isle of Dogs was one of these so-called deprived areas...once.

August 11, 2011

Then 'no jobs' isn't an excuse.

No, it's not. It's the sense of entitlement that so many people have today. Evidently they have to make do with "cheap stuff from China" - What a life of deprivation! Why is no one handing them the means to buy top of the line brands? No wonder they went out and helped themselves ..... if no one will hand it to them, they have to help themselves, right?

:rolleyes:

capricorn · August 11, 2011

But, above all, make sure those sources align with your ideological outlook.

You have no idea what sources I consult.

And what "lessons" do you think they will learn?

The first lesson politicians and authorities have already learned is that they failed in their duty to maintain law and order, and their actions/inactions placed the population in danger. UK citizens will be sure to remind them of this. Obviously, they will approach similar occurrences in a different manner in the future.

Hopefully the first lesson they learn is that no matter what you do,

That's the problem. The cops did nothing in the beginning of these riots and there are reports they actually stood by while fires were set and businesses looted.

when people get fed up enough, they riot.

That's a generalization which I disagree with. Reports regarding who was rioting and looting clearly detail people from poor and middle class communities joined in the carnage and lawlessness; when it was initially realized the cops were tolerant of criminal acts they tested the limits and took their lawlessness to a higher level, and others joined in until it became unmanageable. Fed up people indeed.

Thorn · August 11, 2011

And what "lessons" do you think they will learn? Hopefully the first lesson they learn is that no matter what you do, when people get fed up enough, they riot.

Fed up? Fed up with what? I think the old guy in the video above was correct. Let these scum go and complain to the starving people in Somalia about their lack of opportunities. I'm sure they'll get plenty of sympathy!

The undeniable fact is that not all people are created equal. Some are smarter and dumber than average. Some are kinder or meaner than others. Some think of others, and some care about no one but themselves. In a well-ordered society, the poorer members are cared for to a degree, but also held in line by imposed discipline. Unfortunately, those human refuse in Britain have learned that no one will hold them to account for their laziness and criminality. The police are not permitted to do much, and the courts are extremely lenient.

Frankly, no one who is healthy should be given welfare under any circumstances, and those people who took part in the riots ought to spend the next few years on a chain gang planting potatoes and cutting weeds.

Thorn · August 11, 2011

Well I guess those best efforts didn't work out now did they because THEY STILL have problems. Maybe more workhouses? More prisons?

I think both would be appropriate for that sort of person.

Thorn · August 11, 2011

Ah yes...the Hell Hole that is London. No opportunities there, at all.

With lower unemployment than in the US -- roughly the same as in Canada, in fact, and a very generous welfare state willing to provide shelter, food, clothing, and skills training.

Thorn · August 11, 2011

McDonalds is always hiring...even in yea olde Engelande.

You expect them to take a job in a fast food restaurant!!? Come now! That's beneath them! They're too proud for that! Eastern Europeans might journey two thousand miles and gladly take a job like that, but these people are destined for greater things!