The sad story of Bruce Carson

[betsy]

deleted. moved.

Edited April 19, 2011 by betsy

[YEGmann]

Nor is the manner in which H2O Pros disburses the proceeds of a sale. 20% is probably an unusually high commission, but what of it?

This "20% commission" issue just shows absence of any ethics in accusers (aptv, media and opposition). There is no such clause in Ms. McPherson contract. This is a pure smear campain.

[Tilter]

Or the NDP. Or the Bloc.

Or in the Caribbean country where she somehow immigrated she could belong to the Exalted Miniking forever Ruling potentiating bananatreewood throne party.

[Moonlight Graham]

5 criminal convictions.

1 convicted money launderer/madam.

1 escort with access to inside information.

Yup, pure as the driven snow. Exactly the kind of guy we want with access to the PMO.

Bingo.

[WIP]

Please WIP, don't start your senseless anti-religion rant on Federal Politics.

I'm not anti-religion, just anti your kind of religion! And it's a valid question: if you have such a superior source of morality and ethics as layed out in religion threads, why do you toss that guidebook out in favour of moral relativism here in the dirty world of politics?

Moral relativist? Will you please analyse what I've posted about Bruce Carson.

Am I not endorsing FORGIVENESS? After all the man had already paid for his past crimes.

Am I not endorsing COMPASSION? After all his last sentence indicated that he has some mental/psychological issues.

A man his age going out with a 22 year-old....something is going on inside that man.

What's wrong about what I said as to politics attracting corrupt people? That's stating a fact! Just like daycares and orphanages attract pedophiles....schools and churches attract perverts!

Because I don't see offers of forgiveness or compassion towards people who fall outside of your universe, whether they be liberals, leftists, homosexuals, atheists, believers in other Gods etc. The only ones worthy of 2nd chances and rehabilitation seem to be those who work in service of the Conservative Party.

This is not a unique pattern for conservatives. From the U.S. examples, it seems that Christian charity is only offered to people like David Vitters, Newt Gingrich, Mark Sanford, Rick Santorum or Ralph Reed....oh I could write half a page....the point is that these clowns issue brief statement of regret for their actions...claim they've asked God for forgiveness....never bother apologizing or making amends to the people they should be asking forgiveness from, and then continue on their merry way. The only third rail in fundie-conservative land is if they are nabbed in some sort of gay scandal. There seems to be no way back to their former positions of respect if they've done something queer....I guess there's still no forgiveness for that sin!

[wyly]

For most people, going to jail for a few ounces of pot makes it hard to get a job later. Not for Bruce Carson, he smashed right through that glass ceiling faced by those with a criminal past.

ya but he didn't have a picture of himself on facebook with ignatieff so he was deemed trustworthy and cleared by security...

[betsy]

I'm not anti-religion, just anti your kind of religion! And it's a valid question: if you have such a superior source of morality and ethics as layed out in religion threads, why do you toss that guidebook out in favour of moral relativism here in the dirty world of politics?

You don't make any sense. Anyway, correction: don't do your senseless anti-your-kind-of-religion rant in Federal Politics.

Because I don't see offers of forgiveness or compassion towards people who fall outside of your universe, whether they be liberals, !

Whoa. That's news to me indeed. I didn't know being a liberal requires forgiveness. Anyway....whatever, WIP.

Edited April 17, 2011 by betsy

[WIP]

You don't make any sense. Anyway, correction: don't do your senseless anti-your-kind-of-religion rant in Federal Politics.

Whoa. That's news to me indeed. I didn't know being a liberal requires forgiveness. Anyway....whatever, WIP.

If Bruce Carson was a Liberal, would you present his criminal conduct, and just plain immoral conduct as a "sad story?"

[betsy]

If Bruce Carson was a Liberal, would you present his criminal conduct, and just plain immoral conduct as a "sad story?"

First of all, we're not sure if he did any current crime. What is being repeatedly brought up by Ignatieff is his past crimes. Furthermore, his last sentencing indicated a mental/psychological problem. So yes, I don't care about his leanings....I'm talking about breaking a man publicly for the sake of getting votes! That it's being done by a Liberal leader is not my fault.

I ask you, do you approve of Ignatieff's conduct in exploiting Carson's past to his own political gain?

[cybercoma]

So you want someone with a history of fraud spending your money?

[betsy]

name='Shwa' date='16 April 2011 - 04:46 PM' timestamp='1302993989' post='656561']

Oh wait. I guess Harper only shows compassion is alien to him - since he referred everything to be investigated by the RCMP.

Okay, out of curiousity, answer this then:

If someone brings on serious allegations such as those that Bruce Carson is currently being accused of, how do you think Ignatieff should act?

name='WIP' date='18 April 2011 - 02:43 AM' timestamp='1303116208' post='657127']

If Bruce Carson was a Liberal, would you present his criminal conduct, and just plain immoral conduct as a "sad story?"

First of all, we're not sure if he did any current crime. What is being repeatedly brought up by Ignatieff is his past crimes. Furthermore, his last sentencing indicated a mental/psychological problem. So yes, I don't care about his leanings....I'm talking about breaking a man publicly for the sake of getting votes! That it's being done by a Liberal leader is not my fault.

I ask you, do you approve of Ignatieff's conduct in exploiting Carson's past to his own political gain?

What happened to Shwa and WIP? No answer?

Edited April 19, 2011 by betsy

[betsy]

So you want someone with a history of fraud spending your money?

Explain. How did he spend our money?

[Cameron]

Are there any investigations or documents to prove that he was engaged in criminal activity while working for the PMO?

[cybercoma]

If you don't let a sex offender teach children, why would you let a fraud-artist at the public purse?

[betsy]

If you don't let a sex offender teach children, why would you let a fraud-artist at the public purse?

That's not the question. I want to understand. Maybe you know something that I don't.

Explain how Bruce Carson was given the public purse? How did he spend our money?

Edited April 19, 2011 by betsy

[betsy]

Are there any investigations or documents to prove that he was engaged in criminal activity while working for the PMO?

None that I know of.

[betsy]

So far, this is all I know. Emphasis on the statement which I enboldened.

As APTN reported, Carson secured meetings between H20 Global and ministerial staff at Indian Affairs for water filtration contracts reported to be worth millions of dollars; Carson was also working on a deal with Assembly of First Nations Chief Shawn Atleo, and as recently as last month met with Environment Minister Peter Kent to flog H20′s wares. According to APTN, McPherson stood to gain a 20 per cent fee on any government contract the company secured with native bands across the country­­.

Carson wasn’t a registered lobbyist, so he technically hasn’t done anything wrong.

Nevertheless, Harper has since referred the whole affair to the RCMP.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2011/03/28/the-carson-show-2/

[betsy]

How did he end up in Harper's office? By proving himself over the years!

Following his release in 1983, Carson took up a position at the Library of Parliament, where, as the Toronto Star recently reported, he wrote a synopsis of prime minister Brian Mulroney’s lobbyist legislation. He didn’t have much influence within Mulroney’s Progressive Conservative Party—”Never met him, don’t know anything about him,” former cabinet minister Don Mazankowski told Maclean’s.

Yet Carson moved up the Tory ranks, first as a contract worker for a number of senators and, soon enough, as a policy adviser for Senate Opposition leader John Lynch-Staunton. (“I’m not talking about Bruce Carson,” Lynch-Staunton told Maclean’s, before hanging up.) Carson also worked for former Ontario premier Mike Harris’s office in the 1990s; coupled with his work with the federal Tories, he made enough of an impression as a policy wonk to catch the eye of Philip Murphy, Harper’s chief of staff, in 2003. Murphy tapped Carson to advise Harper following the merger of the PC and Reform parties, which had left a bitter taste in the mouths of many old-school PC types. Carson was charged with smoothing out relations between the old guard and the Reformers. “He came highly recommended by people in the PC party at the time,” Murphy said.

Others concur. “Bruce quickly proved himself to be very capable, and Harper started to rely on him more and more,” Flanagan told Maclean’s. “There’s not really anything odd about it. Bruce had been around politics for a long time, working for both the federal and Ontario PCs.” Also key to Carson’s success in the PMO was his soft touch, some say. “In his professional life he’s always been part of the solution, and one of the grown-ups in the room,” says writer and former Mulroney speechwriter L. Ian MacDonald. “In a PMO that had too many zealots, he was one of the cooler heads.” “He’s a very smart guy, he has a good EQ and he never had to have the biggest dick in the room,” says one of Carson’s long-time friends.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2011/03/28/the-carson-show-2/

For him to make such a good impression - THROUGHOUT THE NUMEROUS YEARS - must definitely mean he was good at his job!

Granted he had a criminal record for fraud, his performance must be such that people in politics had deemed it okay to overlook that past.

[betsy]

The Oppositions are so hypocritical that they ignored this fact! I enboldened the statement.

Yet Carson moved up the Tory ranks, first as a contract worker for a number of senators and, soon enough, as a policy adviser for Senate Opposition leader John Lynch-Staunton. (“I’m not talking about Bruce Carson,” Lynch-Staunton told Maclean’s, before hanging up.)

Who is Lynch-Staunton? What Opposition party did he represent?

Bruce Carson came to Harper's inner circle several decades after serving penalty for his criminal past. Opposition questions Harper's judgement.

And yet they deemed it okay that Carson served as an advisor to an Opposition leader Lynch-Staunton, only a few years after committing those crimes!

The Oppositions are not consistent! They shift around....flip-flopping as they go along.

And we're supposed to trust them????

[betsy]

This is what it really boils down to:

This is the biggest black eye the Conservatives have suffered to date,” said NDP MP Pat Martin. “The other scandals may be bigger in scale and in scope but nothing resonates like this.

They crucify a man in public - someone who's supposed to be deemed innocent until proven guilty - just for the sake of giving the Conservatives a "black eye!"

I feel for Carson. With his mental/psychological state...I hope these Opposition Inquisitors do not drive him to commit suicide!

This is the way the Oppostion mete "justice!" This is their "democracy!"

They speak of contempt of parliament....and yet they have this arrogant contempt for the public! They lump everyone like as if everyone is stupid! They treat the public like as if they're all stupid and cannot see past the hypocrisy and lies!

Edited April 19, 2011 by betsy

[Molly]

Who is Lynch-Staunton? What Opposition party did he represent?

Bruce Carson came to Harper's inner circle several decades after serving penalty for his criminal past. Opposition questions Harper's judgement.

And yet they deemed it okay that Carson served as an advisor to an Opposition leader Lynch-Staunton, only a few years after committing those crimes!

The Oppositions are not consistent! They shift around....flip-flopping as they go along.

And we're supposed to trust them????

Perhaps you should read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Lynch-Staunton

Lynch-Staunton was the very first leader of (drum roll........)

the Conservative Party of Canada!

Yer welcome.

[Shwa]

Wow! Who did receive a completed RCMP report on the investigation? Ignatieff or you? Or you both ... stretching the facts?

Bullshit. Carson is being investigated by the RCMP for a reason, and it ain't a saintly one. No one - including me nor Ignatieff - has convicted him of anything, but his dealings appear shady enough for Mr. Harper to ask the RCMP to investigate.

Those are all the facts you - and our dear OP - need concern yourself with.

[Shwa]

It's highly unclear whether what Carson has done qualifies as lobbying under the legal definition. It might, which is why the matter was referred to the RCMP.

Likewise, no fraud of any sort is being alleged. His relationship with the young woman, while probably distasteful to many, is certainly not illegal. Nor is the manner in which H2O Pros disburses the proceeds of a sale. 20% is probably an unusually high commission, but what of it?

The grand sum of allegations against Carson are that he broke lobbying rules. Claims of fraud are completely unsubstantiated. -k

Which is all for the RCMP to figure out. If they do find some sort of grift going on, well, good thing Mr. Harper didn't step in it.

Edited April 19, 2011 by Shwa

[Shwa]

This "20% commission" issue just shows absence of any ethics in accusers (aptv, media and opposition). There is no such clause in Ms. McPherson contract. This is a pure smear campain.

Foot, meet mouth:

Wow! Who did receive a completed RCMP report on the investigation? Ignatieff or you? Or you both ... stretching the facts?

[Shwa]

What happened to Shwa and WIP? No answer?

Are you asking a question?