Left wing councillors vote against turfing TCHC board!

[Mr.Canada]

Council voted 26-16 in favour of moving forward in the process of addressing the proposal. But Ford needed two-thirds approval — two more votes — to proceed without any delay.

Hopefully the poor in this city will once and for all see that these left wing councilors at City Hall don't have their best interests at heart. How can anyone left, right or centre possible support this current TCHC board?

They are out of touch with what the public wants to be sure.

The delay will be short. The mayor has called a special council meeting for Wednesday afternoon at which the proposal will only require the support of a simple majority.Source

The thing that kills me is that Paula Fletcher in her rant last year against a citizen, which can be found in my sig, is actually what was needed. She said that you cannot lead audit every board in order to find waste and to do so was akin to the Spanish inquisition. Miller was Mayor then, if he cared enough to do it he could've save Toronto some money.

Some people here are against Rob Ford and wish to continue the way the city was with Miller. That means waste, manicures, chocolates and spa getaways would continue all the while the TCHC board saying it has no money. Incredible.

[Shwa]

Hopefully the poor in this city will once and for all see that these left wing councilors at City Hall don't have their best interests at heart. How can anyone left, right or centre possible support this current TCHC board?

They are out of touch with what the public wants to be sure.

The thing that kills me is that Paula Fletcher in her rant last year against a citizen, which can be found in my sig, is actually what was needed. She said that you cannot lead audit every board in order to find waste and to do so was akin to the Spanish inquisition. Miller was Mayor then, if he cared enough to do it he could've save Toronto some money.

Some people here are against Rob Ford and wish to continue the way the city was with Miller. That means waste, manicures, chocolates and spa getaways would continue all the while the TCHC board saying it has no money. Incredible.

Really?

So you need to calm down and figure something out: were those expenses allowable under the rules for training and employee recognition programs in the TCHC?

If they were allowable and people got fired over accessing legitimate spending, then who looks like an over-reacting red-faced idiot?

You know, it would have been more useful for the "poor people" had you made such stirring comments about bonuses, retreats and perks being given to large multi-national corporations while the government was bailing them out to the tune of billions. Did you? Did you go on and on about it?

Sure, let the TCHC be managed by a corporation because everyone knows they always get it right.

[Mr.Canada]

Stop changing the channel, stop making excuses, stop attacking Rob Ford and deal with the issue of inappropriate spending. Prove that the Auditor General was wrong.

[Black Dog]

The thing that kills me is that Paula Fletcher in her rant last year against a citizen, which can be found in my sig, is actually what was needed. She said that you cannot lead audit every board in order to find waste and to do so was akin to the Spanish inquisition. Miller was Mayor then, if he cared enough to do it he could've save Toronto some money.

Some people here are against Rob Ford and wish to continue the way the city was with Miller. That means waste, manicures, chocolates and spa getaways would continue all the while the TCHC board saying it has no money. Incredible.

I hate to break the news to you, but the audit of the TCHC was started under Miller.

Stop changing the channel, stop making excuses, stop attacking Rob Ford and deal with the issue of inappropriate spending. Prove that the Auditor General was wrong.

Rob Ford=The Red Queen. "Orf wiv their 'eads!"

[Mr.Canada]

So again, stop changing the channel and prove that the Auditor General was wrong in his findings.

[Shwa]

Stop changing the channel, stop making excuses, stop attacking Rob Ford and deal with the issue of inappropriate spending. Prove that the Auditor General was wrong.

I am not proving the Auditor General anything. It is the issue of "appropriateness" that the councillors - some of the Ford supporters - objected too. They made their case pretty plain on several news channels last night.

Were those expenses allowable under the budget programs as laid out by the governing rules of the TCHC? Do you know? Because there is a VAST difference between legitimate fraud - in which people should be fired and allowable program spending - in which people should be warned and the rules changed or tightened up.

It isn't a moral issue until fraud is proven, which it hasn't, which is why those 16 councillors voted as they did. If it was a procedural matter - and even worse - a common practice over the years, then let's make the punishment fit the crime.

Now, if you have some evidence that they committed fraud - even an Auditor's report, please post it and we can discuss.

[Black Dog]

So again, stop changing the channel and prove that the Auditor General was wrong in his findings.

Who is claiming the AG was wrong?

[Mr.Canada]

Who is claiming the AG was wrong?

Great, so you're saying his findings were accurate. So with all the inappropriate spending some think that those board members should keep their positions. Wow. The sense of entitlement is insane.

[Shwa]

Great, so you're saying his findings were accurate. So with all the inappropriate spending some think that those board members should keep their positions. Wow. The sense of entitlement is insane.

Nope, you are trying to spin this and it ain't working. No one is saying the AG is wrong. It is about the spending rules for that organization and whether those rules were broken and fraud was committed. It doesn't do anyone any good by firing those people and not correcting the rules now does it?

One would think a prudent council would have carefull considered the issue and whether or not such activities were approvable in the current budgetary framework. Instead we get a lot of baying at the moon.

[Mr.Canada]

No one is saying the AG is wrong. It is about the spending rules for that organization and whether those rules were broken and fraud was committed. It doesn't do anyone any good by firing those people and not correcting the rules now does it?

One would think a prudent council would have carefull considered the issue and whether or not such activities were approvable in the current budgetary framework. Instead we get a lot of baying at the moon.

The problem is that there isn't a detailed audit every year.

Since you agree with the AG here is his findings.

Some of the irregularities found in Jeffrey Griffith’s review of TCHC procurement practices covering Jan. 1, 2009 to June 30, 2010.

• Inappropriate expenses: a $40,000 Christmas staff dinner, $1,000 for Holt Renfrew chocolates, $5,000 given to one staffer without documentation of how it was spent; $800 for massages at a staff picnic.

A “lack of due diligence” in reimbursing expenses to third parties.

Frequently, a lack of a proper bidding process in buying goods or services, which could have saved $4 million to $10 million.

$500,000 worth of solar panels bought from China using an overseas agent who was a long-time friend of a TCHC staff member, without declaring a conflict of interest.

• A $25 million refurbishment deal handed to a vendor who put forward an unsolicited proposal. Source

These expenditures are inappropriate and the public has lost trust in this board. The best way is to dissolve the entire board and appoint a new one and hold new tenant elections. Cut out the cancer. The same people who got the TCHC into this mess claims it can clean it up? Yeah right.

There should be more tenant members of the board as well. They're the ones who live in these cockroach infested apartments they should have more of a say.

That's what bothers me. These people are living in bed bug and cockroach infested buildings while the TCHC is off at lavish spa getaways, munching $1k chocolates and getting manicures. The problem isn't that the TCHC doesn't have any money but that it's being misspent.

[Black Dog]

Great, so you're saying his findings were accurate. So with all the inappropriate spending some think that those board members should keep their positions. Wow. The sense of entitlement is insane.

I'd rather see a real investigation to determine who was responsible for what instead of a mass purge and the installation of Fordite puppets.

[Mr.Canada]

I'd rather see a real investigation to determine who was responsible for what instead of a mass purge and the installation of Fordite puppets.

Yes, there was a real investigation by the AG. His findings have been made public. Time to take action now. Time for talk is over. I'm sick and tired of the wussifed society we have now. Everyone too much of a puss to take any action. What a bunch of sniveling wimps we've become.

Edited March 9, 2011 by Mr.Canada

[Black Dog]

Yes, there was a real investigation by the AG. His findings have been made public.

Which of the AG recommendations entailed shit-canning the entire board?

[Shwa]

The problem is that there isn't a detailed audit every year.

Since you agree with the AG here is his findings.

These expenditures are inappropriate and the public has lost trust in this board. The best way is to dissolve the entire board and appoint a new one and hold new tenant elections. Cut out the cancer. The same people who got the TCHC into this mess claims it can clean it up? Yeah right.

There should be more tenant members of the board as well. They're the ones who live in these cockroach infested apartments they should have more of a say.

That's what bothers me. These people are living in bed bug and cockroach infested buildings while the TCHC is off at lavish spa getaways, munching $1k chocolates and getting manicures. The problem isn't that the TCHC doesn't have any money but that it's being misspent.

Hey I read Joe Fiorito's columns in the Star.

But here's the thing: I agree that some of the expenditures may be lavish according to what I think is inappropriate, but I wouldn't find that a reason to chase people away in the public spotlight, especially when the rules that they operate by may be deemed perfectly appropriate and accountable as legitimate corporate expenses for a corporation of that size. Would you take the provincial or federal government to task for these types of executive and staff expenses? Because I am telling you now they routinely spend this kind of money on staff, especially the executives almost every single day. And they likely spend way more that the TCHC.

Eh, the devil is in the details according to Ford Nation, details which they cannot access. And if they did determine whether these expenses are legitimate and within the rules the corporation operates by, then some good can come out of instead of a lot of frothing and baying. It makes no sense to me to hand it over to some management corporation that operates under the same rules you see, because it won't be long before they are doing the exact same thing.

[Shwa]

Everyone too much of a puss to take any action. What a bunch of sniveling wimps we've become.

Speak for yourself. I prefer careful oversight and correction rather than throwing people under the bus to satisfy some out-moded sense of righteousness.

[Shwa]

Which of the AG recommendations entailed shit-canning the entire board?

None because the AG is smarter than your typical Ford Nation cement head.

[Mr.Canada]

None because the AG is smarter than your typical Ford Nation cement head.

Mayor Ford got over 50% of the vote. The second place guy, Smitherman, got 25%.

[Shwa]

Mayor Ford got over 50% of the vote. The second place guy, Smitherman, got 25%.

So?

[Mr.Canada]

So?

The right wing won the election by a massive amount. Over half the people of Toronto agree with Rob Ford. The left wing are in the minority this time around so the age of forever rising taxes and ever increasing spending is over.

Edited March 9, 2011 by Mr.Canada

[Black Dog]

The right wing won the election by a massive amount.

12 per cent margin. 93,669 votes, to be precise. More voters cast ballots for the two nominally "left wing" candidates than Ford.

[Shwa]

The right wing won the election by a massive amount. Over half the people of Toronto agree with Rob Ford. The left wing are in the minority this time around so the age of forever rising taxes and ever increasing spending is over.

Well I suspect plenty of those smack dab in the middle voted for Ford for his fiscal conservative ideas. Which I don't completely disagree with. But there are many ways to achieve that without being a cement head member of the Ford Nation.

[Mr.Canada]

Well I suspect plenty of those smack dab in the middle voted for Ford for his fiscal conservative ideas. Which I don't completely disagree with. But there are many ways to achieve that without being a cement head member of the Ford Nation.

Expand on cement head. What does that include? name calling jsut slows down discussion. Please stop the name calling and focus on the issues please.

Edited March 9, 2011 by Mr.Canada

[Michael Hardner]

Expand on cement head. What does that include? name calling jsut slows down discussion. Please stop the name calling and focus on the issues please.

Calling Ford supporters cement heads may indicate that you're out of ammo in the argument department, or it may just mean that you want to slander them by the by.

[Black Dog]

Calling Ford supporters cement heads may indicate that you're out of ammo in the argument department, or it may just mean that you want to slander them by the by.

I can't think of a worse thing to call Ford supporters than "Ford supporters".

[Mr.Canada]

zzz

Edited March 9, 2011 by Mr.Canada