August1991 Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 Speaking at a caucus meeting in the provincial capital Tuesday, the Bloc Québécois Leader noted that Ottawa didn’t hesitate to spend $1-billion to host the G8 and G20 summits in Ontario last summer – a portion of which came from Quebec taxpayers. And in 2001 the federal government contributed $500-million toward Toronto’s failed 2008 Olympic bid. ... “We are just asking for the same treatment Toronto received in 2001,” Mr. Duceppe said in previewing his pre-budget demands for the Quebec City region. G & MHarper is going to rue the day he approved the overtime for all those Toronto police officers. Duceppe is right. How can Harper justify spending over $1 billion in Toronto/Ontario and then refuse to give $175 million to Quebec City? The fact that Toronto has nothing to show for the money except for some widescreen TVs in the basements of several policemen, and a gazebo or two in Huntsville, is beside the point. Not only did Harper spend a whack of money in Toronto and get no credit (ie votes) for it, he managed also to lose votes in Quebec. Moreover, if Harper now tries to get back those Quebec votes by approving $175 million federal money to the Colisée René Lévesque, Harper will insult many English Canadians. Indeed, Duceppe will get credit in Quebec for having forced Harper's hand. (Quebec only gets something when Harper is in a minority and the Bloc applies pressure.) ---- For those who hate Harper and love the situation Duceppe has created, you should stop and think. Duceppe neither cares about Harper nor about an amphitheatre in Quebec. Duceppe merely wants to show how the federal government is wasteful and does not respond to the wishes of people in Quebec. Quote
Battletoads Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 Whats wrong with showing how wasteful the Cons are? Seems getting rid of a spend like a drunken sailor politician like harper would be in the best interest of all Canadians. Quote "You can lead a Conservative to knowledge, but you can't make him think."
Smallc Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 Duceppe is right. How can Harper justify spending over $1 billion in Toronto/Ontario and then refuse to give $175 million to Quebec City? Really? Really? Because Ottawa never spends any money in Quebec. Quebec gets twice as much money as Ontario per capita. Give it a rest. Quote
August1991 Posted January 26, 2011 Author Report Posted January 26, 2011 (edited) Really? Really? Because Ottawa never spends any money in Quebec. Quebec gets twice as much money as Ontario per capita. Give it a rest.According to your numbers, smallc.But everyone agrees that Harper spent over $1 billion on a three day summit in Toronto and Huntsville. Fake lakes, anglo police overtime, the works. Duceppe pointedly noted how Chretien spent $500 million on a Toronto Olympic bid in 2001. So, when Quebec City asks for $175 million - everyone (in English Canada) says: "Those Quebecers. Always asking for money." WTF? ---- I happen to think that Harper was foolish to spend a billion on the summit. (And yes, Harper signed off on that money. He approved it.) And he may well lose 24 Sussex because of it. Not because the money was wasted (it was) but because of how the expense is perceived in the rest of Canada. The first rule of a federal Prime Minister is that if you are going to spend a whack of money, make sure you get some votes for it. (We live in a democracy.) Harper's spending garnered no votes in Toronto. Imagine, for a second, if Harper had organized the G8 in Huntsville and the G20 in Quebec City. ----- Anyway, Harper is hardpressed to refuse to give Quebec City $175 million when he gave $1 billion to Toronto. The optics are terrible. Even if Harper gives the money, the rest of Canada will hate him and Duceppe will gain the credit. Whats wrong with showing how wasteful the Cons are?Seems getting rid of a spend like a drunken sailor politician like harper would be in the best interest of all Canadians. You may want to get rid of a wasteful Con. Duceppe wants to get rid of a wasteful federal government. There's a difference.Then again, Duceppe tried before to put Harper into a tight spot and Harper extricated himself. Let's see how this one plays out. Edited January 26, 2011 by August1991 Quote
Smallc Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 According to your numbers, smallc. Yep, just me....and the federal department of finance. http://www.fin.gc.ca/fedprov/mtp-eng.asp Quote
Jack Weber Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 You may want to get rid of a wasteful Con. Duceppe wants to get rid of a wasteful federal government. There's a difference. Then again, Duceppe tried before to put Harper into a tight spot and Harper extricated himself. Wrong!!! The difference is that Duceppe wants to extricate the "country" of Quebec from the rest of Canada... That's fine! The traitor can also take Quebec's portion of the national debt it has created for the rest of this country... Mr.Duceppe is nothing more than low life traitor scum. The best that can be done for the likes of him is to be forced to swim to St.Pierre and Miquelon from Perce Rock in February... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
August1991 Posted January 26, 2011 Author Report Posted January 26, 2011 Yep, just me....and the federal department of finance.http://www.fin.gc.ca/fedprov/mtp-eng.asp We're in the world of perceptions, smallc. But there is some reality.The federal government gave Quebec the boondoggle of Mirabel. Such costs are included in your statistics as federal money spent in Quebec, but did they benefit anyone (other than a few land developers)? Similarly, the federal government spent over $1 billion dollars in Toronto/Ontario for the 2010 G8/G20 Summit, but who gained? Smallc, your argument is the same as the argument Duceppe is making. Mr.Duceppe is nothing more than low life traitor scum.I disagree. I have spoken to Gilles Duceppe and you are wrong in your description of him. Quote
Smallc Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 The federal government gave Quebec the boondoggle of Mirabel. Such costs are included in your statistics as federal money spent in Quebec, but did they benefit anyone (other than a few land developers)? In fact, those things (or things like the G8/20 are not included (no to mention that there are many other summits held...there have been at least two in Quebec - one in Chelsea and one in Wakefield - that Hillary Clinton attended) are not included. I'm talking about money given as transfers from the federal government to the provinces. Much of the one time spending isn't included. Similarly, the federal government spent over $1 billion dollars in Toronto/Ontario for the 2010 G8/G20 Summit, but who gained? In fact, much of that money would have been spend across the country, not just in Ontario. There would have been equipment, goods, and supplies procured from provinces stretching from BC all the way to Newfoundland and Labrador. I disagree. I have spoken to Gilles Duceppe and you are wrong in your description of him. He is a separatist. I (and I would assume the same for Jack) and a Canadian patriot. This summer, instead of going to Europe, I will probably be visiting Ottawa (again) and Montreal (last year was Quebec City). I love this entire country, and I see no reason why language does or should have to divide us to the point where we're forced to separate this great Canadian experiment. You and Duceppe are both wrong if you think this. Quote
Jack Weber Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 In fact, those things (or things like the G8/20 are not included (no to mention that there are many other summits held...there have been at least two in Quebec - one in Chelsea and one in Wakefield - that Hillary Clinton attended) are not included. I'm talking about money given as transfers from the federal government to the provinces. Much of the one time spending isn't included. In fact, much of that money would have been spend across the country, not just in Ontario. There would have been equipment, goods, and supplies procured from provinces stretching from BC all the way to Newfoundland and Labrador. He is a separatist. I (and I would assume the same for Jack) and a Canadian patriot. This summer, instead of going to Europe, I will probably be visiting Ottawa (again) and Montreal (last year was Quebec City). I love this entire country, and I see no reason why language does or should have to divide us to the point where we're forced to separate this great Canadian experiment. You and Duceppe are both wrong if you think this. Duceppe is the worst type of traitor.. Unlike Levesque,who just came out a said what he wanted,Duceppe always tries the soft sell on his treason... It's even more dispicable,in my estimation... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
August1991 Posted January 26, 2011 Author Report Posted January 26, 2011 (edited) I'm talking about money given as transfers from the federal government to the provinces. Much of the one time spending isn't included.In fact, much of that money would have been spend across the country, not just in Ontario. There would have been equipment, goods, and supplies procured from provinces stretching from BC all the way to Newfoundland and Labrador. Smallc, in some ways, you pretend Canada does not exist.You are the favoured daughter/son/child in your family, and you don't understand Canada at all. ----- Smallc, Stephen Harper gave $1 billion to Toronto. How can he now refuse $175 million to Quebec City? Edited January 26, 2011 by August1991 Quote
Battletoads Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 Smallc, in some ways, you pretend Canada does not exist. You are the favoured daughter/son/child in your family, and you don't understand Canada at all. ----- Smallc, Stephen Harper gave $1 billion to Toronto. How can he now refuse $175 million to Quebec City? 'Gave' and 'pissed away on an event no one in Toronto wanted' are two diffrent things. Quote "You can lead a Conservative to knowledge, but you can't make him think."
August1991 Posted January 26, 2011 Author Report Posted January 26, 2011 'Gave' and 'pissed away on an event no one in Toronto wanted' are two diffrent things.Is there really difference?IMV, Duceppe is right about Canada's federal State. And as an aside, I would prefer a new Canadian confederation too. Quote
bloodyminded Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 According to your numbers, smallc. But everyone agrees that Harper spent over $1 billion on a three day summit in Toronto and Huntsville. Fake lakes, anglo police overtime, the works. Duceppe pointedly noted how Chretien spent $500 million on a Toronto Olympic bid in 2001. So, when Quebec City asks for $175 million - everyone (in English Canada) says: "Those Quebecers. Always asking for money." WTF? Even if I were to agree with your premise, there's the little factor that most Canadians don't live in Ontario and Quebec. So shouldn't we all get a nice chuck of change? New Brunswick could use it. Hell, who couldn't? Now, I understand that some Ontarians, Quebeckers, and, yes, Albertans are under the delusion that they are the only parts of Canada worth discussing. The rest of of the country, perhaps being less wise than the Centre of Canada (Ont), the Distinct Nation (QC), and The Alienated Victims(AB), are inclined to disagree. Quote As scarce as truth is, the supply has always been in excess of the demand. --Josh Billings
Smallc Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 Even if I were to agree with your premise, there's the little factor that most Canadians don't live in Ontario and Quebec. Well to be fair, most Canadians actually do. Quote
Smallc Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 IMV, Duceppe is right about Canada's federal State. And as an aside, I would prefer a new Canadian confederation too. So the truth comes out. Quote
Smallc Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 Smallc, Stephen Harper gave $1 billion to Toronto. How can he now refuse $175 million to Quebec City? Harper did no such thing. It's a figment of your imagination. Quote
bloodyminded Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 Well to be fair, most Canadians actually do. Yes, true enough. I might have phrased it a little differently. Quote As scarce as truth is, the supply has always been in excess of the demand. --Josh Billings
g_bambino Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 (edited) How can Harper justify spending over $1 billion in Toronto/Ontario and then refuse to give $175 million to Quebec City? Harper didn't spend $1 billion in Toronto/Ontario. He directed that summits be held in Toronto and Huntsville and the subsequent costs, including wages for police officers from all over Canada, were just under $1 billion. Besides, Quebec already had its turn: the Summit of the Americas in Quebec City, 2001. [c/e] Edited January 26, 2011 by g_bambino Quote
guyser Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 (edited) How can he now refuse $175 million to Quebec City? Dear Quebec City About that money you want , sorry.........NO. See you at the Carnival ! I even bought a new vest. Steve Harper Potentate of all Canada Edited January 26, 2011 by guyser Quote
Shwa Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 Amphitheatre?? Wha...? Harper will give Quebec City some coin for a new NHL spec'd Colisée, and then he will go on and on about hockey, the Canadian tradition, bring on the Russians, etc. Then, for that chunk of change, the Federal Identity Program will get the choice spot for the signage to remind every patron of le nouveau Colisée that it was paid for by the blood, sweat and tears - and tax bux - of every Canadian across the country. Actually Harper could do well to exceed the actual request by a few more millions, see, TROC is damned generous when it comes to hockey. Quote
PIK Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 (edited) I don't think harper will give the money for the rink ,if he does ,it is wrong, as for duceppe,he just trying to make it look like he is the one the got the coin.Who knows this could back fire on duceppe by trying to black mail harper into doing it and the money does not come along,maybe duceppe will get blamed. Edited January 26, 2011 by PIK Quote Toronto, like a roach motel in the middle of a pretty living room.
Smallc Posted January 26, 2011 Report Posted January 26, 2011 (edited) Besides, Quebec already had its turn: the Summit of the Americas in Quebec City, 2001. [c/e] La Francophonie, 2008....the three amigos summit...2007....and so on and so forth. Edited January 26, 2011 by Smallc Quote
August1991 Posted January 28, 2011 Author Report Posted January 28, 2011 (edited) Harper didn't spend $1 billion in Toronto/Ontario. He directed that summits be held in Toronto and Huntsville and the subsequent costs, including wages for police officers from all over Canada, were just under $1 billion.Bambino, are you a lawyer? Or, are you just a PR guy?Besides, Quebec already had its turn: the Summit of the Americas in Quebec City, 2001.Did it? But I at least understand your argument here, Bambino.----- If we're going to argue federalism, we can fall into a simplistic "dollars/cents" argument. That's what Duceppe is doing here. But is Canada a zero-sum game? To wit, what does English-Canada bring to the table other than endless Quebec bashing, wasted federal money and well-meaning but clueless federal politicians? Edited January 28, 2011 by August1991 Quote
Jack Weber Posted January 28, 2011 Report Posted January 28, 2011 Amphitheatre?? Wha...? Harper will give Quebec City some coin for a new NHL spec'd Colisée, and then he will go on and on about hockey, the Canadian tradition, bring on the Russians, etc. Then, for that chunk of change, the Federal Identity Program will get the choice spot for the signage to remind every patron of le nouveau Colisée that it was paid for by the blood, sweat and tears - and tax bux - of every Canadian across the country. Actually Harper could do well to exceed the actual request by a few more millions, see, TROC is damned generous when it comes to hockey. Pro-Canada signage at sporting venues in Quebec???? WHOAH!!!!! Do NOT go there!!! Bad memories,dude... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
Shwa Posted January 28, 2011 Report Posted January 28, 2011 Pro-Canada signage at sporting venues in Quebec???? WHOAH!!!!! Do NOT go there!!! Bad memories,dude... No, it doesnt have to be gaudy 'Just Say No' campaign type signage, just a nice discreet reminder as to who laid out a good chunk of coin. Maybe even print the FIP logo on all their tickets. Quote
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