Gov't Funded Course in Sharia Law

[gutb]

For crying out loud -- the issue isn't a conspiracy by the government to shove Sharia down our throats; the issue is simply public funds going to religious education. Is there any legitimate reason for the spending of tax dollars on some activist element who managed to hook up to the public teat? Yes, that covers all such "groups" with a sense of entitlement to public funds. Is it too much to ask to let the Sharia activists promote Islam through the private marketplace where no one will have any problem with it? Certainly they can support their lifestyles by selling a service to paying Canadians?

[jbg]

Kanadischer is a variation of the word "kanadier" which means Canadian in German. I hate america, and refuse to go there ever again Sorry I haven't been too active on the posts lately friends, I'm leaving for Europe today! Ciao until the 5th

You'll be sorely missed.

[M.Dancer]

You'll be sorely missed.

It was gone??

[betsy]

Everyday rape and murder in Canada and the US has done more damage to "our existence" than any Sharia teachings or learning about what those teachings mean to a particular culture group. You want to protect "our existence?" Do something about all the rape and murder in North America. Let me know when you feel powerless do anything about it.

Wait a minute here....

Rape and murder is punishable by law! There is a law against rape and murder.

Sharia Law, on the other hand, legitimizes rape and murder!

So how can you equate both?

If Sharia law is done in their own countries....that's one thing! But, it is being imported here!

What kind of rationalization is that?

Edited September 13, 2010 by betsy

[wyly]

Wait a minute here....

Rape and murder is punishable by law! There is a law against rape and murder.

Sharia Law, on the other hand, legitimizes rape and murder!

So how can you equate both?

If Sharia law is done in their own countries....that's one thing! But, it is being imported here!

What kind of rationalization is that?

since you're an expert on Sharia law you won't mind quoting and giving references to those points of law you've mentioned

[Shwa]

Wait a minute here....

OK.

Rape and murder is punishable by law! There is a law against rape and murder.

No kidding. Are you new to the country?

Sharia Law, on the other hand, legitimizes rape and murder!

Wow, I didn't know that. Could you cite something that shows us this to be true please?

So how can you equate both?

I'm not. You missed my point about the damage we are causing ourselves. You know, like the alcoholic who complains about all the drug addicts.

If Sharia law is done in their own countries....that's one thing! But, it is being imported here!

Sure, like all the other customs, mores and cultural laws presently practiced by dozens of other ethnic groups in modern day Canada. They all slide under the Criminal Code too. Or do you fear that Sharia will somehow be exempt from the the Criminal Code and that it's practioners will be able to legitimately go around freely raping and murdering you?

What kind of rationalization is that?

You tell me, it's your rationalization. But I suspect you 'rationalize' such opinions from a feeling of powerlessness and that's OK, you are certainly not alone.

[wyly]

OK.

No kidding. Are you new to the country?

Wow, I didn't know that. Could you cite something that shows us this to be true please?

I'm not. You missed my point about the damage we are causing ourselves. You know, like the alcoholic who complains about all the drug addicts.

Sure, like all the other customs, mores and cultural laws presently practiced by dozens of other ethnic groups in modern day Canada. They all slide under the Criminal Code too. Or do you fear that Sharia will somehow be exempt from the the Criminal Code and that it's practioners will be able to legitimately go around freely raping and murdering you?

You tell me, it's your rationalization. But I suspect you 'rationalize' such opinions from a feeling of powerlessness and that's OK, you are certainly not alone.

personally I don't want to Sharia law in any form here, people can practice whatever customs they want when they come to our country but I draw the line at having those laws/customs supersede our laws or imposing their standards of morality upon us... Edited September 14, 2010 by wyly

[Shwa]

personally I don't want to Sharia law in any form here, people can practice whatever customs they want when they come to our country but I draw the line at having those laws/customs supersede our laws or imposing their standards of morality upon us...

So tell me then, how could Sharia law or their "laws/customs" possibly "supercede our laws" or impose "their standards of morality upon us?" Don't give me some 'ho-hum I dunno' response, actually show me the logical path that these things would take to replace our present system of laws and customs.

Because obviously it is a real possibility to you.

So go ahead, show us how this is possible so we can examine it out in the open.

[Bonam]

So tell me then, how could Sharia law or their "laws/customs" possibly "supercede our laws" or impose "their standards of morality upon us?" Don't give me some 'ho-hum I dunno' response, actually show me the logical path that these things would take to replace our present system of laws and customs.

Because obviously it is a real possibility to you.

So go ahead, show us how this is possible so we can examine it out in the open.

Umm, more Muslims immigrate, like any other group they get into various positions in society, like politics, law, the judiciary, and gain an ever larger voice through voting. When there are enough, if many of them want certain changes to the laws, they will have the influence and support to institute such changes. Just like any other block of voters can eventually make changes if they have large enough numbers. Some might assimilate and adopt more Canadian values and not want Sharia law, but if the rate of immigration is fast enough and the rate of assimilation is low enough, that's exactly what will happen.

[betsy]

Well I found this and my main concern here is the strict adherence to Sharia's principle.

Fatwa and Shariaa Control Board

The Fatwa and Shariaa Control Board is an independent body of scholars specialised in the Islamic jurisprudence as well as fatwa experts in accordance with the Shariaa principles. It directs, monitors and supervises the banks activities to ensure that the banks management follows the provisions and principles of the Islamic Shariaa in the banks operation and transactions.

The Boards decisions and fatwas are compulsory and binding on the banks management.

The General Assembly appoints the Fatwa and Shariaa Control Board based on the Board of Directors nomination, consists of not less than three members and not more than five members, and exception to the foregoing the Board of Directors appoints the primary Fatwa and Shariaa Control Board.

http://www.sib.ae/en/shariaa/fatwa-and-sharias-control-board.html

Just with one issue alone....how women are regarded under Sharia law. Letting this Sharia financing into our country is like going along with the un-equal treatment of women! We are setting aside our own values...looking the other way....turning a blind eye....on the plight of Muslim women in our country! Here,in OUR OWN country!

Other ethnic cultures couldn't be compared to Sharia. Sharia has its notorious reputation. Further more, why should we extend an invitation to such a governing body to practice in Canada....what's in it for us?

Edited September 15, 2010 by betsy

[capricorn]

Some might assimilate and adopt more Canadian values and not want Sharia law, but if the rate of immigration is fast enough and the rate of assimilation is low enough, that's exactly what will happen.

Then, there's the birthrate.

"We're the ones who will change you," Krekar told Norwegian newspaper Dagbladet in his first interview since an uproar broke out over cartoons deemed offensive to Muslims.

"Just look at the development within Europe, where the number of Muslims is expanding like mosquitoes," Krekar said. "Every western woman in the EU is producing an average of 1.4 children. Every Muslim woman in the same countries are producing 3.5 children.

"By 2050, 30 percent of the population in Europe will be Muslim."

He claimed that "our way of thinking... will prove more powerful than yours." He loosely defined "western thinking" as formed by the values held by leaders of western or non-islamic nations. Its "materialism, egoism and wildness" has altered Christianity, he claimed.

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2006/03/krekar-claims-islam-will-win.html

[guyser]

Umm, more Muslims immigrate, and gain an ever larger voice through voting. When there are enough, if many of them want certain changes to the laws, they will have the influence and support to institute such changes. Just like any other block of voters can eventually make changes if they have large enough numbers. Some might assimilate and adopt more Canadian values and not want Sharia law, but if the rate of immigration is fast enough and the rate of assimilation is low enough, that's exactly what will happen.

Just like the Italians 50 yrs ago. Now we have pizza and pasta and fascist govt's all over the place.

The horror!

[Wild Bill]

Just like the Italians 50 yrs ago. Now we have pizza and pasta and fascist govt's all over the place.

The horror!

Well, we do seem to have more political parties and perpetual minority government...

[Shwa]

Umm, more Muslims immigrate, like any other group they get into various positions in society, like politics, law, the judiciary, and gain an ever larger voice through voting. When there are enough, if many of them want certain changes to the laws, they will have the influence and support to institute such changes. Just like any other block of voters can eventually make changes if they have large enough numbers. Some might assimilate and adopt more Canadian values and not want Sharia law, but if the rate of immigration is fast enough and the rate of assimilation is low enough, that's exactly what will happen.

Then why not use your brilliant math skills and calculate when this will happen "exactly?" Use the immigration rates, the birth and death rates of Muslims to non-Muslims, some sort of x-factor range for assimilation and non-assimilation and then give us the figures. I am sure you will want to prove your point right? You did say "exact" after all.

No?

Didn't think so.

[Shwa]

Well, we do seem to have more political parties and perpetual minority government...

LOL! Zing!

But there is a point. History shows that shawarmas are the choice food of the shock troops before the Muslim hordes sweep across the land and convert everyone to Islam, Sharia Law and then the hand and head lopping starts. Anyone that has ever eaten a shawarma is a potential Islamicist. And don't buy this sneaky 'gyro' label. It's a shawarma, but designed to lull us into a false sense of Greek-like safety.

Beware the evil shawarma - with or without the tahini.

[The_Squid]

There was that straw-dog a few years ago in Ontario about having Sharia law tribunals to resolve disputes. Thankfully, there was a hue and cry from the general public and the gov't went so far as to say that there will be no faith-based tribunals of any kind in Ontario. The gov't repealed the part of the Arbitration Act that allowed courts to recognize the decisions of faith-based tribunals (not just Muslim).

This was the proper decision. We should be a secular society and faith-based justice of any kind shouldn't be part of this Nation's fabric in any sense.

However, what any of this has to do with a business course offered by community college that teaches people to invest in Sharia-based countries, I have no idea. It seems people set their hair on fire at the first sniff of anything "Muslim" these days.

[jbg]

However, what any of this has to do with a business course offered by community college that teaches people to invest in Sharia-based countries, I have no idea. It seems people set their hair on fire at the first sniff of anything "Muslim" these days.

Maybe the Muslims need to change their approach to the non-Muslim world.

[Wayne McQ.]

I fail to see anything wrong with this whatsoever. Please explain to me what exactly you find objectionable about it?

Any law that basically makes a woman property of the husband as Sharia Law is intended to do, has no place in Canada or in any other civilized country. If Muslims want this type of law, I suggest they climb back on that plane or carpet, and fly the hell back to whatever backward country they came from. Canada should have one law for everyone, and if cultures from other parts of the world don't like that they can always leave, nobody is begging them to stay.

[charter.rights]

Any law that basically makes a woman property of the husband as Sharia Law is intended to do, has no place in Canada or in any other civilized country. If Muslims want this type of law, I suggest they climb back on that plane or carpet, and fly the hell back to whatever backward country they came from. Canada should have one law for everyone, and if cultures from other parts of the world don't like that they can always leave, nobody is begging them to stay.

Canada has what it needs - the Rule of Law. And that Law says that we must make reasonable accommodation to anyone in the application of fairness and equity. If that means Sharia is used on a civil basis within the Muslim communities who subscribe to it, then we have no say in the matter. Community justice, and settlement conferences and arbitration have a root in Canada as part of our civil society. Accommodation is just and reasonable.

[CANADIEN]

Canada has what it needs - the Rule of Law. And that Law says that we must make reasonable accommodation to anyone in the application of fairness and equity. If that means Sharia is used on a civil basis within the Muslim communities who subscribe to it, then we have no say in the matter. Community justice, and settlement conferences and arbitration have a root in Canada as part of our civil society. Accommodation is just and reasonable.

Any arbitration mechanism that contradicts Canadian law has, and should have, no standing in this country. How anyone does their banking, as long as they do not violate Canadian law, is indeed the individual's own business. Religious-based arbitration is contrary to the letter and the spirit of our laws, and has no business here.

[bloodyminded]

Then why not use your brilliant math skills and calculate when this will happen "exactly?" Use the immigration rates, the birth and death rates of Muslims to non-Muslims, some sort of x-factor range for assimilation and non-assimilation and then give us the figures. I am sure you will want to prove your point right? You did say "exact" after all.

No?

Didn't think so.

You're right; all the fear-mongering depends not only on elevated birth-rates (which demographic experts claim to be highly contentious findings anyway, not at all a "done deal"), but on assumptions of unassimibility. I don't believe this is going to be the problem that the Mark Steyn-generated fears claim (bizarrely) as irrefutable "common sense."

[Shwa]

You're right; all the fear-mongering depends not only on elevated birth-rates (which demographic experts claim to be highly contentious findings anyway, not at all a "done deal"), but on assumptions of unassimibility. I don't believe this is going to be the problem that the Mark Steyn-generated fears claim (bizarrely) as irrefutable "common sense."

If the sex, drugs and rock 'n roll don't get 'em, WalMart will.

[charter.rights]

Any arbitration mechanism that contradicts Canadian law has, and should have, no standing in this country. How anyone does their banking, as long as they do not violate Canadian law, is indeed the individual's own business. Religious-based arbitration is contrary to the letter and the spirit of our laws, and has no business here.

Absolutely incorrect.

There are a number of Christian and Jewish based arbitration systems in place that do not fall under the letters of our laws. Then we have community justice circles that also exist outside of the justice system. There are lots of non-orthodox methods to deal with disputes and issues. Sharia would just be another.

[jbg]

You're right; all the fear-mongering depends not only on elevated birth-rates (which demographic experts claim to be highly contentious findings anyway, not at all a "done deal"), but on assumptions of unassimibility. I don't believe this is going to be the problem that the Mark Steyn-generated fears claim (bizarrely) as irrefutable "common sense."

If the sex, drugs and rock 'n roll don't get 'em, WalMart will.

Slicing the birth rate should be easy; cut off the procreation party cradle to grave welfare, so people would have to limit the children to those they could support.