Police Self-Investigations; Conflict of Interest?

[MysTerri]

How safe do you feel about police investigation themselves? And I am talking to police. How do you feel when you witness a fellow officer break the law and you are being asked to testify? Are you certain you want to tell the truth? Have you been on the force long enough to tell the truth? Are you still learning the ropes and are you afraid what you say may cost you your job or at least a lot of grief?

It IS a Conflict of Interest for police to investigate themselves, by anyone's standards. When police investigate themselves, our officers are challenged in 'telling the truth' for fear of retribution from fellow officers, even chiefs (Stanley Park Six trail). We need to change this and make it as safe as we possibly can for our strong, brave men & women of Canada to be good, honest officers when they are asked to uphold the law. Let's give them that and outlaw police self-investigations.

http://www.gopetition.com/online/35135.html

Edited April 20, 2010 by MysTerri

[Bonam]

Police investigations should be handled by another police department.

Online petitions don't do anything.

Edited April 20, 2010 by Bonam

[MysTerri]

Police investigations should be handled by another police department.

Online petitions don't do anything.

Another police department is still police.

Online petitions can be copied into a word processor and printed out, then it can do something.

[Oleg Bach]

I have no problem with OUR private standing army called police..If they make a mistake they usually can correct themselves. IF cop is caught on tape breaking the ribs of some fool who was foolish enough to offend his own protectors then...the cop should be removed for not having the mental metal to not be sucked into a bad situation...by someone that does not know what cops are really for. Civilians investigating police is like little old ladies investigating the lawfulness of ultimate fighting.

[MysTerri]

I have no problem with OUR private standing army called police..If they make a mistake they usually can correct themselves. IF cop is caught on tape breaking the ribs of some fool who was foolish enough to offend his own protectors then...the cop should be removed for not having the mental metal to not be sucked into a bad situation...by someone that does not know what cops are really for. Civilians investigating police is like little old ladies investigating the lawfulness of ultimate fighting.

What the petition calls for is professional independent investigators along with members of the jury pool to conduct investigations into police wrong doings. Do you, alone, not trust our jurors to be impartial, even if they ARE little old ladies?

[M.Dancer]

I think the police, when accused or involved in an event that warrents an investigation, should be investigated by an organization that has no experiance in criminal investigations or the criminal code.

That should make you happy.

[MysTerri]

I think the police, when accused or involved in an event that warrents an investigation, should be investigated by an organization that has no experiance in criminal investigations or the criminal code.

That should make you happy.

We require judges to become most familiar with the criminal code; why wouldn't we require independent investigators who are members of a team that investigates police? Police codes of conduct are spelled out. Anyone who can read, can understand what is required response by an officer from that which is not.

Edited April 20, 2010 by MysTerri

[Oleg Bach]

I think the police, when accused or involved in an event that warrents an investigation, should be investigated by an organization that has no experiance in criminal investigations or the criminal code.

That should make you happy.

Imagine some elected twits such as the Toronto city council investigating police wrong doings?

[Oleg Bach]

What the petition calls for is professional independent investigators along with members of the jury pool to conduct investigations into police wrong doings. Do you, alone, not trust our jurors to be impartial, even if they ARE little old ladies?

Police are street wise- little old ladies are not. IF we can not trust seniour police officers in charge then all is lost. As a young guy..I was quite wild and had a few clashes with police...all I know is that I was never mistreated and always respected - because I empowered them with respect also...I just don't understand how a person can be so stupid to irritate cops...I was not brought up that way...ONCE a cop understands that you are intelligent enough to get it...they act properly - If you offend them - you MIGHT just get offended back because cops are human beings with failings also.

[eyeball]

The solution to the problem of using crime investigators to investigate police is to monitor and record the process they follow and then audit that record with an independent third party - a party with expertise in accountability and transparency.

[M.Dancer]

We require judges to become most familiar with the criminal code; why wouldn't we require independent investigators who are members of a team that investigates police? Police codes of conduct are spelled out. Anyone who can read, can understand what is required response by an officer from that which is not.

Can anyone who can read know how to conduct an investigation? Judges are the end product of 20 odd years of exp[eriance....never the less, there has been no demonstrated need for the SIU to be replaced...they get their convictions far better than a well meaning group of dilletants.

[Oleg Bach]

The solution to the problem of using crime investigators to investigate police is to monitor and record the process they follow and then audit that record with an independent third party - a party with expertise in accountability and transparency.

IT'S not the cops who will insist on hiding documention...It is usually those that appoint the judges who pass down the word to cover something up. Arrogant and corrupt judicary and rat faced lawyers usually instigate cover ups...crown attorneys who are overy ambitious can be problematic.

[M.Dancer]

The solution to the problem of using crime investigators to investigate police is to monitor and record the process they follow and then audit that record with an independent third party - a party with expertise in accountability and transparency.

That pie in the sky idea rests on the 360 3D camera technology that doesn't exist and the belief that police would only commit crimes while on duty. Past investigations by competant bodies proves that is not the case.

[eyeball]

there has been no demonstrated need for the SIU to be replaced...

No, just the need to subject SIU's to independent third party audits has been demonstrated.

See Dziekanski et al.

[eyeball]

IT'S not the cops who will insist on hiding documention...It is usually those that appoint the judges who pass down the word to cover something up. Arrogant and corrupt judicary and rat faced lawyers usually instigate cover ups...crown attorneys who are overy ambitious can be problematic.

There is definitely a trickle down effect of corruption. It may well be we only need to audit the very top echelons of the state to get honesty and decency trickling down instead.

[Oleg Bach]

We have a policy in the crimminal system..to convict by any means possible..A very busy Crown once told me that the policy is to convict even if he knows the person is clearly innocent. HOW can we have a proper and just system with such an oppressive means of populace control? What I have learned over the years is that police dispise the judical system....so how can they have the power to investigate - properly when their hands are tied...those appointed as independants to over see police must be questionable persons also - who influences them?

[eyeball]

That pie in the sky idea rests on the 360 3D camera technology that doesn't exist and the belief that police would only commit crimes while on duty. Past investigations by competant bodies proves that is not the case.

So what, that's no excuse for not subjecting SIU investigations to third party audits.

Edited April 20, 2010 by eyeball

[MysTerri]

Police are street wise- little old ladies are not.

I beg your pardon, I am a little old lady and I AM street wise. You give me less credit & respect than you do an officer who may have broken the law. THAT speaks volumes.

IF we can not trust seniour police officers in charge then all is lost.

Read the transcripts from the Stanley Park Six trail transcripts and you will see that, yes indeedy, the chief called the good officer "delusional" for telling the truth.

As a young guy..I was quite wild and had a few clashes with police...all I know is that I was never mistreated and always respected - because I empowered them with respect also...I just don't understand how a person can be so stupid to irritate cops...I was not brought up that way...ONCE a cop understands that you are intelligent enough to get it...they act properly - If you offend them - you MIGHT just get offended back because cops are human beings with failings also.

Exactly, cops are human too. It is that human frailty of ours that causes us to sometimes make bad choices in our actions, all of us. Everyone understands that fact. That is why we have LAWS to obey, to keep us in line. PENALTIES are spelled out in Martin's Code, as well as in the police act, etc, for police to follow. Society has made Martin's Code the standard by which we conduct ourselves in society. So when ANYONE steps over the line, it is clear where the line is, even for a little old lady whose intelligence does not deem your respect.

Edited April 20, 2010 by MysTerri

[Oleg Bach]

Little old ladies can be very smart and wise - some are not...There is this retired female doctor that just got a job a the immigration board---she wants more and more immigrants - on her days off she volunteers at the food bank and gloats about what a wonderful person she is as the poor starving patrons look more and more like Holocaust victims...No I do not want a jerk like this over seeing police...she would be jailing them and singing hippy folk songs as she tossed them some wormy craft dinner. WHEN it comes to cops I am conservative - I like having my own army - so should you!

[Bonam]

I beg your pardon, I am a little old lady and I AM street wise. You give me less credit & respect than you do an officer who may have broken the law. THAT speaks volumes.

MysTerri Icon

*

* New Member

* Add as Friend

* PM this member

* Group: Members

* Posts: 16

* Joined: 23-March 10

* Gender:Male

Might want to fix your profile.

[Oleg Bach]

When have I ever been known to speak volumes? Little old ladies that do not like cops are a weird and dangerous bunch..wonder if there is a trail of former now deceased husbands behind this one...just kidding - and please do not smash me with your walker. I might just have to call out the boys in blue and taze your wrinkled butt.

[MysTerri]

Might want to fix your profile.

Holy Cow! I never noticed that one. Thank you for pointing that out, not that is makes any difference to the verity my argument.

No investigation needed, I AM am little old lady, who's not nor has ever been male, except here, once.

[MysTerri]

;-x

Edited April 20, 2010 by MysTerri

[MysTerri]

We have a policy in the crimminal system..to convict by any means possible..A very busy Crown once told me that the policy is to convict even if he knows the person is clearly innocent. HOW can we have a proper and just system with such an oppressive means of populace control? What I have learned over the years is that police dispise the judical system....so how can they have the power to investigate - properly when their hands are tied...those appointed as independants to over see police must be questionable persons also - who influences them?

And what about our jurors? Are THEY in doubt with you too? You seem to not trust everyone but police. I trust police, but not to investigate themselves. There have been far too many questionable inquests into in-custody deaths that have left a very sour taste in the mouths of most Canadians.

Independent investigation is done in many other places. In other countries, it would be unheard of to allow police to investigate themselves. And so it should be here, independent investigators & jurors should be the only ones allowed to investigate police everywhere in Canada.

As for the war between the police and the judicial system, perhaps things would be evened out if there were independent investigators to look into judicial wrongdoings as well. That branch of the government should not be excluded from the public eye.... or justice.

Edited April 20, 2010 by MysTerri

[M.Dancer]

So what, that's no excuse for not subjecting SIU investigations to third party audits.

No need for an excuse not to until there is a compelling reason to in the first place.