Flu vaccine

[Oleg Bach]

Good points and all repect due to the learned medical people. BUT correct me if I am wrong..but is it not true that by the time a vacine is developed to deal with a certain strain of virus - that that particular virus has evolved (mutated) and in effect become a brand new virus? Is it true that our way of creating vacines on mass is to slow to keep up with the speedy virus? That vacines for this type of clever bug will always be one step behind? If that is the case then it is just wishful thinking and profit taking that motivates the production and deployment of the new vacine.

[segnosaur]

Good points and all repect due to the learned medical people. BUT correct me if I am wrong..but is it not true that by the time a vacine is developed to deal with a certain strain of virus - that that particular virus has evolved (mutated) and in effect become a brand new virus?

Not exactly true...

Yes, viruses do mutate. And there is a chance that, in the months that it takes to develop a vaccine the influenza virus may change. But, even if there ARE changes, the virus' is not going to be totally re-written, and any vaccine is still likely to be effective against even a mutated virus.

Heck, one of the things that researchers are noticing is that older people may actually have some immunity from the current H1N1 virus because they were exposed to other H1N1 viruses decades ago.

Is it true that our way of creating vacines on mass is to slow to keep up with the speedy virus? That vacines for this type of clever bug will always be one step behind? If that is the case then it is just wishful thinking and profit taking that motivates the production and deployment of the new vacine.

Nope, not true at all.

The biggest problem with creating a flu vaccine isn't the mutation rate of the virus, but in the fact that the government scientists basically have to guess which flu strains are going to be most common in a particular year, months before widespread infections set in. (You see, there are dozens of possible flu strains, but vaccines can only be made for a couple of strains.) Well, they don't exactly guess which flu strains they should worry about, but they do have to make some predictions based on imperfect data.

Sometimes, the scientists guess correctly, and the vaccine does end up covering the most common forms of flu that are circulating during the year. Sometimes, they guess wrong, and the virus handles one type of flu well, but not not the most common one in circulation.

However' you're still better off to have an imperfect vaccine than non at all.

[bush_cheney2004]

....Heck, one of the things that researchers are noticing is that older people may actually have some immunity from the current H1N1 virus because they were exposed to other H1N1 viruses decades ago.

Yep....being "old" finally pays off. There was a different strain by the same name back in the mid 70's that was not so kind to old people. I remember mandatory vaccine testing as a member of the military just to save those old geezers. Anyone around in 1957 should also have been exposed. Now I will get my reward.

[PocketRocket]

To address the topic, but not any of the post which have previously been made, I've had flu shots twice in my life. First time I ended up with flu-like symptoms for several days. Missed some work.

The second time I got the shot whilst on a leave from work. Still ended up with symptoms for 5 or 6 days.

Haven't had a fly shot in about 5 years, and I think I'll likely pass on this one.

I think I'm at a lower risk than many people. No kids at home, so no one to drag the infection home from school.

I work in a large workplace with many other employees, but there is little or no physical contact. I tend to wash my hands regularly both at work and at home, so that also reduces the risk.

My final self-administered defense is large daily doses of vitamin c, which has, since I began taking it several years ago, reduced both the rate and severity of colds, flus etc.

I find that the only time I get sick is when I am not able to get enough rest over a prolonged period. As long as I can get a good night sleep 2 out of 3 nights, I'm usually pretty good.

[segnosaur]

First time I ended up with flu-like symptoms for several days. Missed some work.

The second time I got the shot whilst on a leave from work. Still ended up with symptoms for 5 or 6 days.

Yes, quite likely that you had a reaction to the shot (it does happen in a small number of cases). Also possible that you just happened to catch some other illness at about time the flu shot was given.

Of course, you're still better off to have 'flu-like symptoms' for several days than to end up in the hospital or dead. At least that's my opinion.

Haven't had a fly shot in about 5 years, and I think I'll likely pass on this one.

Anecdotes are useless in determining effectiveness or risk. After all, I'm sure plenty of people have some "friend of a friend who smoked 3 packs of cigarettes a day and lived to 100". That doesn't mean that cigarettes are safe. It means that some people just get lucky, either through genetics, or by pure chance avoiding certain people.

I think I'm at a lower risk than many people.

The fact that you're at a 'lower risk' doesn't necessarily mean that there is no risk.

And while there is no need to panic, it looks like the upcoming H1N1 infections are causing more problems (hospitalizations and deaths) for adults. Children and the elderly seem to have fewer severe complcations.

No kids at home, so no one to drag the infection home from school.

I work in a large workplace with many other employees, but there is little or no physical contact.

So? The flu is not spread through physical contact. Probably the most common transmission method is through coughing/sneezing.

I tend to wash my hands regularly both at work and at home, so that also reduces the risk.

Washing your hands may be a good idea (it does impact the chance of picking up colds), but it may not be an issue when dealing with the flu.

http://www.cmaj.ca/earlyreleases/1oct09_co...ndwashing.shtml

My final self-administered defense is large daily doses of vitamin c, which has, since I began taking it several years ago, reduced both the rate and severity of colds, flus etc.

Studies have shown that taking Vitamin C is not useful in preventing or treating colds in otherwise 'healthy' adults.

http://mrw.interscience.wiley.com/cochrane...0980/frame.html

I find that the only time I get sick is when I am not able to get enough rest over a prolonged period. As long as I can get a good night sleep 2 out of 3 nights, I'm usually pretty good.

Being well rested is probably a good thing, but it is no guarantee that you will be protected. (And what exactly do you mean 'pretty good'? You never get sick? Sometimes but not as often?

I think what's happened here is that you've had 'good luck' for the past few years, and you're incorrectly assuming that the result is due to your vitamins, etc. That's why actual large scale studies are run, to separate actual effects from 'placebo' effects.

[bush_cheney2004]

......I think what's happened here is that you've had 'good luck' for the past few years, and you're incorrectly assuming that the result is due to your vitamins, etc. That's why actual large scale studies are run, to separate actual effects from 'placebo' effects.

No doubt, but there are statistical gradients to severity of symptoms when exposed. On Monday, I had very mild symptoms typically associated with the onset of flu, but no fever. As in years past, the lymph nodes swelled and kicked it into high gear, sallying forth to engage the enemy. I took Thermoscans reading twice a day all week....nuthin'.

My wife also got her seasonal flu shot on Monday, but she is not fairing as well.

Purely anecdotal, with zero statistical validity.....but I will pass unless they put it in a sugar cube like the polio vaccine and boosters of my childhood....wanna live your life in an IRON LUNG? Now that was a very serious choice to be made.

http://www.vaccineinformation.org/photos/poliaap001.jpg

Edited October 17, 2009 by bush_cheney2004