Tories move to eliminate faint-hope clause

[Oleg Bach]

The right is no better by any stretch!

Exactly! We need intelligent moderates who want the best for all...a non-advesarial system would be better - what is this eternal competition that we all partake in? What's the point? It's a system that is hundreds of years old based on a fight between have and have nots. Centralism is the key - It's like a body..that controls both hands equally - the theocratic image of Christ holding both hands out represents a kind and good balance...a quantum mechanical wisdom that states - that the righteours and sinister co-exist and we should managed and control both - this is ancient forgotten stuff....the universe is devide into positive and negative forces - called reality - and it is natural - To be super - natural ----one must not be "torn asunder" and at war with himself - once you grasp this concept and understand it - the war within ends - power and glory result - and all war stops...love it the glue - even the supified evil ones need love - but thrive on hate...which is the lack of intelligent life...It's a choice ----------------and I repeat the most powerful bit of ancient doctrine that I know....."Young men for you are strong for you have mastered evil (chaos) ---- you do not practice evil - but you face it and understand it - and control it -----it's fearlessness - with that comes focus and accomplishment.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

Exactly! We need intelligent moderates who want the best for all...a non-advesarial system would be better - what is this eternal competition that we all partake in? What's the point? It's a system that is hundreds of years old based on a fight between have and have nots. Centralism is the key - It's like a body..that controls both hands equally - the theocratic image of Christ holding both hands out represents a kind and good balance...a quantum mechanical wisdom that states - that the righteours and sinister co-exist and we should managed and control both - this is ancient forgotten stuff....the universe is devide into positive and negative forces - called reality - and it is natural - To be super - natural ----one must not be "torn asunder" and at war with himself - once you grasp this concept and understand it - the war within ends - power and glory result - and all war stops...love it the glue - even the supified evil ones need love - but thrive on hate...which is the lack of intelligent life...It's a choice ----------------and I repeat the most powerful bit of ancient doctrine that I know....."Young men for you are strong for you have mastered evil (chaos) ---- you do not practice evil - but you face it and understand it - and control it -----it's fearlessness - with that comes focus and accomplishment.

The end goal, in my view is the improvement of the human condition. All else has little permanent value to society. Whether we can get there by any secular means is a mystery that we have yet to solve. I will suggest that religion be left out of the equation.

[benny]

Zoo animals? You mean putting them in cages and displaying them in public? Nice idea, but not one I think you could get passed as a law. I suppose you are willing to live next door to these "citizens" when you let them out of jail. I guess you will even have the child molester living next door babysit your kids. If you are not willing to do these things then I suggest your argument and sentiments are just so much nonsense. So whats the truth?

The truth is that I like to live in downtown Montreal where the turnover of my neighbors is so intense that I see my paranoia as a laughing matter.

[Oleg Bach]

The truth is that I like to live in downtown Montreal where the turnover of my neighbors is so intense that I see my paranoia as a laughing matter.

I am in downtown toronto - lower east side - the strip is like a small town - kind of like pleasant ville - the neighbours do not move - they slowly die one at a time - Urban living kills people - God I love the country side - How the hell did I get here?

[benny]

I am in downtown toronto - lower east side - the strip is like a small town - kind of like pleasant ville - the neighbours do not move - they slowly die one at a time - Urban living kills people - God I love the country side - How the hell did I get here?

What kills people is when the village fool is forced to migrate in a megalopolis because of intolerant rural areas rednecks.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

What kills people is when the village fool is forced to migrate in a megalopolis because of intolerant rural areas rednecks.

I am the resident rural redneck, but I am very tolerant. What you do is your own business, not mine. Just so long as it does not endanger me and mine we get along just fine. If you are a dingbat and decide to interact with me face to face, as long as you stay cool, you have no problem with me. On the other hand if you loss your cool and become a problem, rest assured that your neighbors will have something to say. By the time we are through with you, you will be in the process of moving, and we will not have laid a hand on you doing it. Of course that only applies if you are a relatively nice person with some problems of your own. If you make your problems ours, well then some different rules apply.

[benny]

I am the resident rural redneck, but I am very tolerant. What you do is your own business, not mine. Just so long as it does not endanger me and mine we get along just fine. If you are a dingbat and decide to interact with me face to face, as long as you stay cool, you have no problem with me. On the other hand if you loss your cool and become a problem, rest assured that your neighbors will have something to say. By the time we are through with you, you will be in the process of moving, and we will not have laid a hand on you doing it. Of course that only applies if you are a relatively nice person with some problems of your own. If you make your problems ours, well then some different rules apply.

Playing the police role now!?

[jbg]

Treating some people like zoo animals is everything but a needed solution.

I'll give this one a serious response though you meant it as a trolling post.

If people act like zoo animals that's how they'll be treated.

[benny]

If people act like zoo animals that's how they'll be treated.

Zoo animals are very well treated.

[Borg]

I can see what you are getting at, my family moved to Alberta in 1903 from Quebec. They buried the first born and bred Canadian ancestor of mine there in 1732. So I guess you can say we came from the east!

Tsk. Tsk.

Now you are talking like an indian - you have been here before others so you must have all the rights.

You are entitled!! Love it and support it - after all the folks in the east believe the indian is entitled - why not the long term canadian - how far back do we go?

Best thing about the east? They generally stay there - inbreeding is pretty much standard. I wish the west would do three things:

1. Collect their own taxes - much like those folks from kebec - the place that outlaws one of the official languages

2. Put up borders to keep the easterners out

3. Outlaw french and kebec immigration

And back to the topic - remove the faint hope clause?

Hell - let those real nice criminals out early? Nope - leave them there to rot - do the crime lose your rights and live behind bars. Only when time is served, then out you go.

Borg

Edited June 13, 2009 by Borg

[eyeball]

The solution that I envision is rather complex. It would take an entire book to write it all down.

The solution to this topic is actually simple. Lockup repeat offenders and never let them out again. In the case of violent offenders, no second chance to harm a citizen, lock them up forever upon conviction. These are damned harsh methods, but nothing short of these will accomplish what NEEDS to be done. If you want a system of justice that acts to both punish and prevent crime there is simply no other way to go.

We need several systems to accomplish what needs to be done. What we don't need is a vindictive justice system that has no use for discretion.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

We need several systems to accomplish what needs to be done. What we don't need is a vindictive justice system that has no use for discretion.

Discretion should only go so far. The law should be applied equally, discretion works against that to at least some degree. Violent offenders are a special case and should be treated as such. Setup a new court system just to handle them if you like. Go a step further and build some new facilities for them. This is one expenditure worth every penny. The punishment of convicted criminals and the protection of citizens must not come to be viewed as anything less than a just society. We need to set a standard that says some things are wrong and punishable with harsh consequences.

[benny]

We need to set a standard that says some things are wrong and punishable with harsh consequences.

This is the domain of morality with its guilty feelings, not the domain of a justice system.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

This is the domain of morality with its guilty feelings, not the domain of a justice system.

Web forums are a growing medium o communication. They would serve well as advice to elected representatives of the people.

[Oleg Bach]

Web forums are a growing medium o communication. They would serve well as advice to elected representatives of the people.

Any cutting edge elected offical needs all the advisors he or she can get - an intelligent offical will scan and read - and absorb what is useful and disgard what is not - you would be surprised who reads this tripe - the Americans and those in China just love eaves dropping.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

Any cutting edge elected offical needs all the advisors he or she can get - an intelligent offical will scan and read - and absorb what is useful and disgard what is not - you would be surprised who reads this tripe - the Americans and those in China just love eaves dropping.

Of course! If I was an elected politician my website would have every bill before the Commons on it along with my party position( if I was a partisan) and my personal position. I would have all the registered voters in my riding as a focus group and register them for access to a voting system. I would leave them to vote right up to the last day before the bill is read for each reading. My vote would be based on one single factor, the desires of the constituents.

[benny]

Discretion should only go so far. The law should be applied equally, discretion works against that to at least some degree. Violent offenders are a special case and should be treated as such. Setup a new court system just to handle them if you like. Go a step further and build some new facilities for them. This is one expenditure worth every penny. The punishment of convicted criminals and the protection of citizens must not come to be viewed as anything less than a just society. We need to set a standard that says some things are wrong and punishable with harsh consequences.

Keep in mind that a few generations ago, Australia was a British penitentiary colony and is now at the top of the Human Development Index of the United Nations. Just like that!

[Jerry J. Fortin]

Keep in mind that a few generations ago, Australia was a British penitentiary colony and is now at the top of the Human Development Index of the United Nations. Just like that!

Isn't progress wonderful!

[Oleg Bach]

Harsh consequences? Hah - what ever happened to the day where we had real correctional institutions where people were corrected? Are we so mindless now that we do not have the human expertise` to repair people - seems that sadism is not just in the penal institutions but everywhere - looks like our Christian based system that used to cure offenders has been tossed by the way side and secular hooliganism now rules supreme.

[Argus]

Of course! If I was an elected politician my website would have every bill before the Commons on it along with my party position( if I was a partisan) and my personal position. I would have all the registered voters in my riding as a focus group and register them for access to a voting system. I would leave them to vote right up to the last day before the bill is read for each reading. My vote would be based on one single factor, the desires of the constituents.

And you would be thrown out of the party, be unable to get financing for the next election, and be gone.

[Argus]

The end goal, in my view is the improvement of the human condition. All else has little permanent value to society. Whether we can get there by any secular means is a mystery that we have yet to solve. I will suggest that religion be left out of the equation.

Look, the role of government is to get the grass cut, the garbage taken away, and the sewers looked after. It's to maintain police, roads, health care, and to make sure the barbarians don't get over the walls. It's not to try and change "the human condition" with poorly designed social engineering experiments.

[benny]

Isn't progress wonderful!

No. Just by giving criminals some space to breath!

[Oleg Bach]

No. Just by giving criminals some space to breath!

There are those that say "There are the convicted and the yet to be convicted" - we are all innocent and we are all crimminals - who are the real crimminals are those that over the years create these rediculous social policies and experiments that generate lunitics who in the end are violent - I go across Queen street towards the core - there is a stretch and I see the lowest most violent of the low - all are young adults who grew up in single parent families - families redefined by the state - families that are not families - each one of these young men and woman (for the most part) are product of failed eugenics and less than masterful maniputlation of the breeding public - These people are mistakes - and they will fill our prisons - and we created them.

[benny]

There are those that say "There are the convicted and the yet to be convicted" - we are all innocent and we are all crimminals - who are the real crimminals are those that over the years create these rediculous social policies and experiments that generate lunitics who in the end are violent - I go across Queen street towards the core - there is a stretch and I see the lowest most violent of the low - all are young adults who grew up in single parent families - families redefined by the state - families that are not families - each one of these young men and woman (for the most part) are product of failed eugenics and less than masterful maniputlation of the breeding public - These people are mistakes - and they will fill our prisons - and we created them.

It is intolerance to revolt that is suspect.

[Oleg Bach]

It is intolerance to revolt that is suspect.

They revolt themselves and the authorities are revolting...take a close look at the staff at the Toronto city hall - they revolt constantly against common sense...and this spreads up the ladder to the federal level - they are all revolting in such a manner.