Ignatieff calls bilingualism the essence of Canada

[benny]

We coudl argue the other way around too. If I give you money but refuse to give ayou a chance to work, I'm then enslaving you. Giving you an opportunity to work must go hand in hand with help. This is where free trade comes in. If we have high tariffs against a country, how can we honestly expect it to develop no matter how much 'equalization' we give it.?

Money pays the tariffs.

[Machjo]

The poor? Who are you talking about? There is no reason for poverty in Canada. There is work for those that are willing. There are opportunities for those who would rather work for themselves. There is EI and welfare for those in need of temporary or permanent assistance. The only poor I know are those who choose to live off of the system instead of working for a living.

I was referring to the poor internationally. Free trade is a hand up, not a hand out.

[Machjo]

Money pays the tariffs.

?

[Jerry J. Fortin]

I was referring to the poor internationally. Free trade is a hand up, not a hand out.

Even Jesus Christ said that there would always be poor people. In addition I am not advocating that we simple stop assiting other nations with foreign aid, I am saying that we need to rethink what we are really doing with our government.

[Machjo]

Even Jesus Christ said that there would always be poor people. In addition I am not advocating that we simple stop assiting other nations with foreign aid, I am saying that we need to rethink what we are really doing with our government.

I agree there will alwys be the poor. All I'm saying is that, though I'm by no means dogmatically opposed to socialism and recognize that it does have some strong points, I also believe that we should not ignore capitalism as a means of helping the poor too.

Too often we seem to have this dogmatic belief that the only way to help the poor is through socialism. I can agree with that to an extent, where it comes to education, or dealing with the extremes of wealth and poverty. But I think we go way too far when we suggest absolute equality or try to elimiate wealth and poverty altogether. We shouldn't deny that capitalism itself can help the poor too, in some cases more efficiently than socialism. Trade is a perfect example. Through trade, poor countries develop industries. Through tariffs and handouts, they develop dependency. In that respect, capitalism can help the poor more than socialism.

[benny]

?

The money can be used to pay the tariffs. Anyway the trade war is about export subsidies.

[Argus]

I speak both English and French. I don't feel any more Canadian than someone who doesn't.

Apparently Iganatieff does. He is much more Canadian - having lived 30 years abroad - than those useless tools who only speak one language.

[Argus]

Bilingualism means that you can speak English, French, or both...without being anymore than anyone else. I speak English and I'm learning French...it won't make me anymore Canadian. I don't think that he meant that they're more Canadian, but that bilingualism is part of the Canadian identity.

He didn't say that, now did he? Perhaps there's something wrong with his language skills? Are you suggesting he isn't capable of adequately expressing his intent in French?

The essence of Canada? Bilingualism has only been a federal policy since the seventies. Are you saying that Canada didn't exist in the fifties or forties or thirties?

[Argus]

Bilingual means you can speak both languages. We have two official languages, and I suppose that's part of what makes Canada what it is. I think Ignatieff is trying to just identify himself with Quebec voters and there's nothing wrong with that. To be honest I'm confused why a thread was started about this.

For me, him supporting the sign law is a telling sign - no pun intended. First, it's a sign he's willing to suck up to French bigots any possible way he can. If he supports a sign law in Russel he'll support whatever discriminatory laws Quebec implements against its Anglo minority. Second, it's a sign of his ignorance, the ignorance of an academic - aside. Who was it that said "You must be an intellectual, sir, for only an intellectual could say something that stupid.". The effect of the Russel sign law was to break the cordial, congenial relationship between Anglos and French in that community. Now there's anger and acrimony. There's division, and dislike. Business owners are threatening to pick up and move elsewhere, and legal fights are underway. That's the effect on a law whose sole purpose was to trumpet the French fact, put in place by anti-English French rights activists and a hand-wringing, suckup of a mayor very unlikely to be re-elected.

This shows, again, Iganatieff's total unfitness for political office of any kind.

[Argus]

Because leafless doesn't like French - Canadian people....and in the Canadian context, Bilingualism really refers to government policy that says we can use either language when dealing with Federal government.

Why do you insist on talking about policies you clearly don't understand?

[Argus]

Both Langauges are part of Canada. To not recognize that is to deny a reality....and knowing both languages in this country is an asset. It can help you go places that you otherwise couldn't.

If by that you mean it can help make up for your lack of intelligence or ability, then yes, it certainly can, at least in Ottawa.

I guess that's why some work so hard to learn the other language.

[Argus]

You have to admit, though, that it goes far to define us as a nation... the fact that both/either apply. It's existence speaks volumes about us, and how we differ from other countries.

Do you know that while federal politicians like talk about "Canadians" in English, they go to Quebec and have a tendency to instead use the phrase - in French - Canadians and Quebecers.

Define us as a nation? Bilingualism? You mean like Belgium?

Belgium is in effect two separate communities held together by a bi-lingual political system. Much of public and political life in Belgium is dominated by bitter debates around language and the allocation of public resources.

Government aid to poorer Wallonia, home to four million French speakers, has caused resentment among Belgium's 6.5 million Flemish majority, correspondents say.

I guess maybe we're not so unique, huh?

[Argus]

All Fed. jobs have to speak both, and Canada official languages are French and English and that IS essense Canadian. I guess it would have to do with ones attitude towards life and Canada.

Not all fed jobs have to speak both languages. However, it is true that by narrowing the talent pool to the 3% of Canadians who are fluently bilingual an awful lot of mediocre and really dumb people have climbed into high levels of power in the federal government.

Interesting to note you speak so approvingly of this.

[Argus]

Quebec, provincially, has that right, just as at least 4 other provinces have the same right, exculuding (I think) that Manitoba and Ontario do...and New Brunswick certainly doesn't. Manitoba and Ontario already have bilingual government service, and it is official in New Bruswick.

There is a difference between not providing bilingual signs because there are hardly any french people around to read them, and not providing bilingual signs because you despise english speaking people.

[Smallc]

Why do you insist on talking about policies you clearly don't understand?

Well, since that is its purpose, I don't think I'm the one misunderstanding.

[Smallc]

,

Edited June 13, 2010 by Smallc

[Leafless]

Ignatieff is a moron. Canada's essence isn't bilingualism, it's freedom. I'm already sick of that pandering jackass. Go back to Europe, or at the very least America.

Ignatieff even goes further and says and says bilingualism defines 'who we are'.

Bilingualism defines 'who we are': Ignatieff

Support for linguistic minorities to be part of next campaign platform

By Mike De Souza, Canwest News Service June 8, 2010

Bilingualism is an essential part of the Canadian identity that promotes peace, order and good government, Liberal leader Michael Ignatieff said Monday.

Speaking at a forum about official languages organized by his party on Parliament Hill, Ignatieff said the Liberals would pledge to support minority francophone and anglophone communities across the country in the next election campaign with specific dollar figures attached to its platform.

Ignatieff said bilingualism in Canada was about more than policy, but also a question of pride.

"This is why we're the country of peace, order and good government," Ignatieff said. "This is why we're the country that has maintained national unity across hundreds and hundreds of years.

"(It's) because we're able to take the helmet off and put another helmet on and live inside another world. This is what I'm proud of as a Canadian.

"So this isn't just a piece of the platform. This is a much more profound definition of who we are."

Ignatieff said the federal government was the only one that could protect linguistic minorities in provinces and territories. He said he learned to appreciate the value of protecting Canada's official languages partly because of his father, who worked in the public service for 40 years and spoke English, French, and Russian.

"This is in my veins," Ignatieff said. "So I understand how important it is for a member of the francophone community to have access to services in the language of their birth. I understand how important it is in Quebec for someone to have access to services in the language of their birth."

The federal language watchdog's latest annual report expressed concerns last month about the Harper government's "laissez-faire" approach to bilingualism and supporting both languages in the public service for its employees.

At the time, Official Languages Minister James Moore noted that progress was being made, but acknowledged that there is still room for improvement.

© Copyright © The Ottawa Citizen

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/life/Bilingualism+defines+Ignatieff/3124897/story.html

So the federal government demotion of the stature of the de-facto English language of Canada promotes peace, order and good government is laughable.

Looks like this is nothing more than a Liberal stunt to buy Quebec votes.

Edited June 13, 2010 by Leafless

[Machjo]

No matter which way you slice it, the essence of a Canadian has nothing to do with their ability to speak both official languages.

In Nunavut, 6% speak neither according to Stats Can. I doubt it has to do with immigration.

[Machjo]

Double post.

Edited June 13, 2010 by Machjo