Canadian Banks are NOT being 'bailed out'

[Sir Bandelot]

Never believe or trust a man who can't write more than one sentence or ever think they are smarter than you.

When will you learn to write more then one sentance, let alone one that is any good?

Edited November 17, 2008 by Sir Bandelot

[Sir Bandelot]

So what, these are CMHC secured mortgages, the banks would have never made those loans at those rates if they weren't because the buyers didn't meet their lending criteria.

You obviously have no concept of cause and effect. Look 6 months to the future, the hausing market will collapse.

[Wilber]

You obviously have no concept of cause and effect. Look 6 months to the future, the hausing market will collapse.

Maybe so but these mortgages would have never been issued in the first place without government involvement. They really are the governments responsibility because they dictated the terms under which the loans would be made in the first place. Not the banks.

[Sir Bandelot]

The CMHC is no different from a bank... they work on the principle that as long as not everybody needs to draw money, they can continue to run their business. They are just a crown corporation which means when they go belly-up it, will be the government who picks up the tab.

Why not just have the government issue the loans... what role does the bank serve to homoeowners other than just another layer of beaurocracy and siphoning money from peoples accounts. They have outlived their usefulness. The government could guarantee credit to all homeonwers at the best possible rate.

Getting back to the first point I raised, this is not about mortgages, its only a deception. This is about investments getting derailed and government finding a way to move the money around. They used Canada's credit rating to protect the banks, not homeowners.

Mon Nov 17 2008

TORONTO - The Canadian mutual fund industry suffered its worst month ever in October with $8.4 billion in net redemptions, and total industry assets ended the month 19.5 per cent below their year-ago level.

Last month's cash-out deepened the investment fund industry's September slump of $4.5 billion in net redemptions, which was the previous worst month on record. The $8.4-billion October catastrophe compared with net sales of $2.4 billion in October of last year, according to figures released Monday by the Investment Funds Institute of Canada.

The mutual fund sector has been battered by the stock market plunge, which has seen share prices on the TSX drop by more than 40 per cent since a record high above 15,000 in June.

The industry trade group said total assets of $571.3 billion at the end of October were down by $62.3 billion or 9.8 per cent from September.

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/081117/...ss/mutual_funds

[craiger]

When will you learn to write more then one sentance, let alone one that is any good?

You can fool me once or fool me twice oh wait how does that go? rbbrrrr you won't fool me again damn terorists messin

Edited November 18, 2008 by craiger

[craiger]

oh fukk!!!!!! lets just go to war

[Wilber]

The CMHC is no different from a bank... they work on the principle that as long as not everybody needs to draw money, they can continue to run their business. They are just a crown corporation which means when they go belly-up it, will be the government who picks up the tab.

The CMHC insures mortgages that a bank would not otherwise issue. They do so because the government has decided that some people who could not get a mortgage from a bank will now be able to do so because the government will now guarantee the loan on terms that they determine. Up until now they have used the bank depositors money to finance these mortgages. Up until now the government has used the banks to carry out government policy. Now they are going to do it themselves in order to free up the banks to lend to others. You can agree with that policy or not but in no way is it a bailout of the banks.

[craiger]

The CMHC insures mortgages that a bank would not otherwise issue. They do so because the government has decided that some people who could not get a mortgage from a bank will now be able to do so because the government will now guarantee the loan on terms that they determine. Up until now they have used the bank depositors money to finance these mortgages. Up until now the government has used the banks to carry out government policy. Now they are going to do it themselves in order to free up the banks to lend to others. You can agree with that policy or not but in no way is it a bailout of the banks.

Why in peoples name would we do that If the banks are not going too? this why we are in the mess today we are loaning money to people who cannot offord it

Edited November 18, 2008 by craiger

[Smallc]

Why in peoples name would we do that If the banks are not going too? this why we are in the mess today we are loaning money to people who cannot offord it

We (Canada) aren't in a mess.

[Sir Bandelot]

We (Canada) aren't in a mess.

Right... thats why the government just did an emergency about-face, first saying in September that no bailout is needed, then saying we need to give 25 Billion, then 50 Billion. Then saying "it's not a bailout" bwahaha

Edited November 18, 2008 by Sir Bandelot

[Smallc]

Right... thats why the government just did an emergency about-face, first saying in September that no bailout is needed, then saying we need to give 25 Billion, then 50 Billion. Then saying "it's not a bailout" bwahaha

You still have no idea what your talking about.

[craiger]

We (Canada) aren't in a mess.

Everyone keeps saying that but we know this thing is on spin cycle why else would they need taxpayer money's? other than to pay our salary. if everything is stable as long as the working man pay's the bills we have nothing to worry about right?

Edited November 18, 2008 by craiger

[Smallc]

Everyone keeps saying that but we know this thing is on spin cycle why else would they need taxpayer money's? other than to pay our salary. if everything is stable as long as the working man pay's the bills we have nothing to worry

They don't need taxpayer money. The debt purchase is intended to ensure that the working man can keep paying his bills.

[craiger]

They don't need taxpayer money. The debt purchase is intended to ensure that the working man can keep paying his bills.

So we are investing all of that money in jobs? and none to do with the risks banks took on lending money to those that cannot afford it

[Sir Bandelot]

You still have no idea what your talking about.

I know very well, when I am being lied to. Humper said we don't need a bailout, everything is fine. Then the bank guy whispered in his ear and now we need to get 50 Billion. So you show me where you think I am wrong, I want to see some evidence not just your silly parroting

[Sir Bandelot]

M Dancer knows I am right, you can ask him. Maybe just check under your bed I'm sure he's there...

[Sir Bandelot]

Let me answer it for you... so the derivatives traders can make millions using imaginary money, propped up by the banks. The banks are so irresponsible, they don't even deserve to hold the mortgages.

[Wilber]

Why in peoples name would we do that If the banks are not going too? this why we are in the mess today we are loaning money to people who cannot offord it

Whether they can afford it or not depends on their continued ability to make the payments which generally depends on a persons job security. In this respect a high income earner can become just as vulnerable as someone on a lower income. I don't know if the default rate on these mortgages is higher than normal or not. CMHC was founded in 1946 to cope with a severe housing shortage after WW2. There were around a million returning vets who weren't able to save up a down payment while they were getting shot at for four or five years on behalf of their country. Like many government agencies they tend form a life of their own and become a tool of whatever government policy is in vogue at the time. CMHC was created by a Liberal government but has been used by every government since for its own purposes.

I've been through boom and busts in the housing market before. I bought a house in a suburb of Vancouver in 1979. Two years later it I could have sold it for more than twice what I paid. The market then crashed and prices didn't reach that level again for another eight or nine years. The problem isn't the value of housing as over the long term it will increase. As long as you are not in a position where you are unable to cope with the financing or have to sell for some reason, eventually you will come out OK. If you are, you have a problem.

[M.Dancer]

mortgages... think mortgages

Mortgages aren't consumer loans. Think...think...

[M.Dancer]

Never believe or trust a man who can't write more than one sentence or ever think they are smarter than you.

That was one sentence.

[Sir Bandelot]

Mortgages aren't consumer loans. Think...think...

Oh, what are they then, bail-outs?

Definition- "A mortgage loan is a loan secured by real property."

- With you I really have to get the crayons out to splain it

Edited November 18, 2008 by Sir Bandelot

[M.Dancer]

Oh, what are they then, bail-outs?

Definition- "A mortgage loan is a loan secured by real property."

- With you I really have to get the crayons out to splain it

You have defined a mortgage....a consumer loan is more like a car loan...or a loan for a vacation.

Consumer lending (also called retail lending) refers to making a wide range of secured and unsecured loans to consumers for consumable items such as a car, boat, manufactured home, home equity loan, home equity line of credit, signature loan, signature line of credit, recreational vehicle, or share or certificate of deposit or Stocks and Mutual Funds secured loans.

Consumer lending does not include mortgage loans, typically used for home purchases, which follow some different regulations than consumer loans. Also consumer loans are different than commercial loans, which can be calculated on a daily basis, rather than 12 monthly payments (such as with the U.S. Federal calendar), and include interest for leap day (as an extra day of the year), such as in Actual/366 loan calculations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_lending

It really doesn't help your argument about bail outs when clearly you don't know what you are talking about.

[OddSox]

Oh, what are they then, bail-outs?

Definition- "A mortgage loan is a loan secured by real property."

- With you I really have to get the crayons out to splain it

Which is not a consumer loan - "a loan that establishes consumer credit that is granted for personal use; usually unsecured and based on the borrower's integrity and ability to pay"

Your use of crayons explains a lot...

[Sir Bandelot]

It really doesn't help your argument about bail outs when clearly you don't know what you are talking about.

Only problem here is, YOU don't know what I'm talking about. You try to put words in my mouth by twisting the argument. go back to my post yesterday and show where I said that.

the banks cannot loan out money unless they have a certan amount of real capital to back it up. What they have done is too made too many speculative investments. They don't want to lona money to consumers because the interest rates are too low, but they can't continue loaning to speculators. So what the government did is offload they're mortgages, freeing the banks too make more insestments on speculative loans.

- There is no law saying they have to lon any money too small businesses and consumers, no guarantee they would even do that!

All this does give them freedom to spread more wealt too their investment!

Don't you guys get it?

No. You becasue you don't WANT to...

Because when they loan to consumers as opposed to speculators or business...

Let me draw you a piture...

Edited November 18, 2008 by Sir Bandelot

[M.Dancer]

Only problem here is, YOU don't know what I'm talking about.

You are right, I don't know what you are talking about. If you mnade sense it would be easier for everyone to follow...

What they have done is too made too many speculative investments.

No sorry...you will have to back that one up

Maybe if you used a medium you are more comfortabel with...crayons?