Liberals and NDP fanning the flames

[Argus]

The reason our economy is going to suffer is because of NAFTA. The whole point of NAFTA is to make trade easier with the US, and so now over 75% our exports go to that country.

They have ALWAYS gone to the US. You truly are an economic illiterate, aren't you?

[Argus]

If ever there was an innately Canadian response to a crisis, the national reaction to the credit crunch must be it.

Thus far Canada appears to be in better shape than other western economies caught up in the backwash of the U.S. meltdown. Far from taking comfort from the fact -- perhaps even exhibiting a little national pride -- Canadians seem intent on punishing the government for not being panicked enough.

Give us a Bailout, We'll supply the crisis

I confess I must be totally out to lunch on this. I actually find it reassuring that the Prime Minister isn’t panicking. I was alarmed last week by Stephane Dion, who looked like he might burst into tears of sheer frustration at several points during the English debate. The last thing we need now is some badly thought-out, last-minute rescue package slapped together in a haze by a bunch of overexcited political operatives seeking to make up political ground at the expense of the economy and the population at large.

[M.Dancer]

Or that Harper's Conservatives don't believe in the same sort of lassez faire prescriptions that set the stage for the disaster unfolding in the US?

You really don't have a clue what that term means I'm sure....

1) If you believe the sub prime mess is a republican error

2) If you believe what has been going on in the US is laissez faire economics...

I'll give y9ou this though, you finally learned how to spell it, now just learn what it means.

[M.Dancer]

You simply don't get it. This country is 6 months away from a depression-type downturn and you not only want to muzzle that type of talk, you seriously believe that Harper has the character, temperament and record to deal with the victims of the coming downturn.

Harper's Republican pals have now destroyed a generation's worth of wealth production while triggering a global recession/depression - did you really think Canada would be exempt?

6 months away? Please...the only way that could hapen is if the NDP get elected. Best way to ensure economic malaise is to talk the economy down and to suck money out of it.

We aren't 6 months or even 16 months from a depresion....christ almighty...we aren't even in a recession!!

What has been hurting our manufacturing sector the most, eeven more than the "fear" of a US slowdown is our high dollar, which ironically was because of the strength of our economy....well now that the dollar is trading around .90 cents expect the manufaturing sector to stop bleeding.....and expect the NDP and Liberals to cheer any layoff that make the news....

Edited October 8, 2008 by M.Dancer

[Argus]

6 months away? Please...the only way that could hapen is if the NDP get elected. Best way to ensure economic malaise is to talk the economy down and to suck money out of it.

We aren't 6 months or even 16 months from a depresion....christ almighty...we aren't even in a recession!!

What has been hurting our manufacturing sector the most, eeven more than the "fear" of a US slowdown is our high dollar, which ironically was because of the strength of our economy....well now that the dollar is trading around .90 cents expect the manufaturing sector to stop bleeding.....and expect the NDP and Liberals to cheer any layoff that make the news....

I don't know. She could be right. Suppose Dion and Layton decide to form a coallition. Dion, of course, insists on the Green Shift, which tacks on big anti-pollution charges to industry and manufacturing, not to mention big increases in transportation and electricity. And Layton insists on his $50 billion tax increase for business. Add the two of them together and given the present state of the economy, that ought to push us over real fast.

[M.Dancer]

I don't know. She could be right. Suppose Dion and Layton decide to form a coallition. Dion, of course, insists on the Green Shift, which tacks on big anti-pollution charges to industry and manufacturing, not to mention big increases in transportation and electricity. And Layton insists on his $50 billion tax increase for business. Add the two of them together and given the present state of the economy, that ought to push us over real fast.

That's what I mean.....a recession is certain if Goverment vacuums money out of the economy....best way to avoid it is not to inject money but to let busnisses keep thier own money to invest in growth.

[capricorn]

Where have Manley and Chretien endorsed Harper? Seems they are endorsing sound Liberal economic practices.

Chretien says Canada is not in a financial turmoil. Manley says we will not suffer as other countries will. That is exactly what Harper has been saying. It is Dion who appears to lack confidence in the safeguards put in place by previous Liberal governments. How else would you explain his "chicken little" and over the top reaction.

People still don't trust Harper to be empathetic to their suffering if we have some tough times ahead.

What is it with this Liberal omniscient knowledge of what is in people's minds?

[kengs333]

That's what I mean.....a recession is certain if Goverment vacuums money out of the economy....best way to avoid it is not to inject money but to let busnisses keep thier own money to invest in growth.

Who says they would invest in growth?

[jdobbin]

Chretien says Canada is not in a financial turmoil. Manley says we will not suffer as other countries will. That is exactly what Harper has been saying. It is Dion who appears to lack confidence in the safeguards put in place by previous Liberal governments. How else would you explain his "chicken little" and over the top reaction.

It is a lack of confidence in Harper that Dion and others have not to run into deficits because he can't control his spending, makes the wrong tax cuts and waits until an election to announce small assistance to a manufacturing sector which has been suffering for almost his entire government's time in office.

What is it with this Liberal omniscient knowledge of what is in people's minds?

Just repeating what some polls are saying today. What do you account for the drop? Support for Dion?

[capricorn]

Just repeating what some polls are saying today. What do you account for the drop? Support for Dion?

The polls show that 33% of voters support Harper. His leadership numbers have been consistently higher than any of the other leaders. For you to say "people don't trust Harper" is stretching it. Why am I not surprised?

[kengs333]

You sound like Layton and Dion, you know, wishing a recession on us. Making up a platform on the go in response to day-to-day changes in the market isn't exactly the tempermant I consider virtuous in helping deal with economic matters.

Also, which of Harper's policies have contributed to declining wealth and global recession? Please, I am all ears.

Finally, perhaps this will calm your nerves and get you back to reality:

GDP Growth:

Country.....2008.....2009

Canada.....0.7.....1.2

USA.....1.6.....0.1

France.....0.8.....0.2

Germany.....1.8.....0.0

UK.....1.0.....-0.1

Japan.....0.7.....0.5

http://www.cbc.ca/money/story/2008/10/08/imf.html

Well, look at that: the IMF is fear mongering!!!!

"All of the major industralized countries are grappling with the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression in the 1930s, the IMF said."

[kengs333]

They have ALWAYS gone to the US. You truly are an economic illiterate, aren't you?

Can you be anymore obtuse and crude? If you think I'm worng, then prove it. But until you can do that, the general consensus is that FTA and NAFTA are responsible for significantly increasing trade between the US and Canada.

[geoffrey]

It is a lack of confidence in Harper that Dion and others have not to run into deficits because he can't control his spending, makes the wrong tax cuts and waits until an election to announce small assistance to a manufacturing sector which has been suffering for almost his entire government's time in office.

The manufacturing sector suffers from hardline unions, repressive business taxation in Ontario especially and company's addicted to the breast milk of Ottawa politicans. Ontario manufacturers have not innovated because they have never had to, and they never learned to.

Ontario manufacturing is dead. We can continue to throw money at it, but it costs more than it's worth.

Let Ontario die. It will be back, and hopefully have some innovation and business spirit, instead of an addiction to government.

--

I wanted to step in on this topic because I've been shocked by how easily Jack Layton and Stephane Dion have descended to the bottom of the pit in terms of fear mongering. Being educated in finance and economics and pursuing graduate level education in investments, I can tell you right now, Jack and Stephane are unjustified.

Canada's economy is strong. Canada's banks are strong. There is no financial crisis in Canada.

The stock market is subject to regular business cycle corrections. That's all we are seeing now. This correction is larger than most, but it's simply a correction.

If you have been prudent and lived within your means, you should have no fears.

Your investments will recover. This is, like Harper said, a great time to get into the market and buy up some bargin stocks.

The fear mongering of the opposition right now disgusts me and is contributing to the fear and aniexity amongst Canadian investors. Many people are clueluss and are ordering their financial representatives to sell their positions because Stephane and Jack are calling for a recession.

It's disgusting. When people pull out now, they are going to lose money! Dion should be on the hook for their losses!

Anyone that votes for the Liberals or the NDP in the coming election just simply ignores the realities of the economy today, prudence and retaining the current tax structure is key to our economic well being over the next few years. Markets hate uncertainty. Dion's carbon tax is huge uncertainity, and unfairly taxes the economic engine of our country. Layton wants to reverse all the pro-business measures Harper has enacted. Responsible in a time of business uncertainty? Absolutely not.

I'm going to vote Conservative on October 14th, not because I'm happy with their record (income trusts, for example), but because they are the only party with the sense to guide the economy in the correct direction.

Don't look to Dion for your economic advice, he is DEAD WRONG. Their outlooks will cost you your savings. Don't give in to the panic and ride this one out with a sensible strategy.

My disgust for the opportunism of the Liberals is growing by the hour. The harm Dion has caused this week is unmeasurable to many Canadian families, especially retirees who are very concerned about their future and are more likely to sell in a panic.

Stop it Dion. Stop lying. Your either stupid or reckless. Neither gives you the right to be a leader. Get out.

[Smallc]

The polls show that 33% of voters support Harper. His leadership numbers have been consistently higher than any of the other leaders. For you to say "people don't trust Harper" is stretching it. Why am I not surprised?

Today....CBC I think it was...had a poll that showed Harper being less popular than Dion, with both of them being seen as ore negative than positive.

[OddSox]

The manufacturing sector suffers from hardline unions, repressive business taxation in Ontario especially and company's addicted to the breast milk of Ottawa politicans. Ontario manufacturers have not innovated because they have never had to, and they never learned to.

Ontario manufacturing is dead. We can continue to throw money at it, but it costs more than it's worth.

Let Ontario die. It will be back, and hopefully have some innovation and business spirit, instead of an addiction to government.

--

I wanted to step in on this topic because I've been shocked by how easily Jack Layton and Stephane Dion have descended to the bottom of the pit in terms of fear mongering. Being educated in finance and economics and pursuing graduate level education in investments, I can tell you right now, Jack and Stephane are unjustified.

Canada's economy is strong. Canada's banks are strong. There is no financial crisis in Canada.

The stock market is subject to regular business cycle corrections. That's all we are seeing now. This correction is larger than most, but it's simply a correction.

If you have been prudent and lived within your means, you should have no fears.

Your investments will recover. This is, like Harper said, a great time to get into the market and buy up some bargin stocks.

The fear mongering of the opposition right now disgusts me and is contributing to the fear and aniexity amongst Canadian investors. Many people are clueluss and are ordering their financial representatives to sell their positions because Stephane and Jack are calling for a recession.

It's disgusting. When people pull out now, they are going to lose money! Dion should be on the hook for their losses!

Anyone that votes for the Liberals or the NDP in the coming election just simply ignores the realities of the economy today, prudence and retaining the current tax structure is key to our economic well being over the next few years. Markets hate uncertainty. Dion's carbon tax is huge uncertainity, and unfairly taxes the economic engine of our country. Layton wants to reverse all the pro-business measures Harper has enacted. Responsible in a time of business uncertainty? Absolutely not.

I'm going to vote Conservative on October 14th, not because I'm happy with their record (income trusts, for example), but because they are the only party with the sense to guide the economy in the correct direction.

Don't look to Dion for your economic advice, he is DEAD WRONG. Their outlooks will cost you your savings. Don't give in to the panic and ride this one out with a sensible strategy.

My disgust for the opportunism of the Liberals is growing by the hour. The harm Dion has caused this week is unmeasurable to many Canadian families, especially retirees who are very concerned about their future and are more likely to sell in a panic.

Stop it Dion. Stop lying. Your either stupid or reckless. Neither gives you the right to be a leader. Get out.

Well said! (I wanted to snip this quote so it would be shorter, but couldn't decide what to snip...)

[blueblood]

The manufacturing sector suffers from hardline unions, repressive business taxation in Ontario especially and company's addicted to the breast milk of Ottawa politicans. Ontario manufacturers have not innovated because they have never had to, and they never learned to.

Ontario manufacturing is dead. We can continue to throw money at it, but it costs more than it's worth.

Let Ontario die. It will be back, and hopefully have some innovation and business spirit, instead of an addiction to government.

--

I wanted to step in on this topic because I've been shocked by how easily Jack Layton and Stephane Dion have descended to the bottom of the pit in terms of fear mongering. Being educated in finance and economics and pursuing graduate level education in investments, I can tell you right now, Jack and Stephane are unjustified.

Canada's economy is strong. Canada's banks are strong. There is no financial crisis in Canada.

The stock market is subject to regular business cycle corrections. That's all we are seeing now. This correction is larger than most, but it's simply a correction.

If you have been prudent and lived within your means, you should have no fears.

Your investments will recover. This is, like Harper said, a great time to get into the market and buy up some bargin stocks.

The fear mongering of the opposition right now disgusts me and is contributing to the fear and aniexity amongst Canadian investors. Many people are clueluss and are ordering their financial representatives to sell their positions because Stephane and Jack are calling for a recession.

It's disgusting. When people pull out now, they are going to lose money! Dion should be on the hook for their losses!

Anyone that votes for the Liberals or the NDP in the coming election just simply ignores the realities of the economy today, prudence and retaining the current tax structure is key to our economic well being over the next few years. Markets hate uncertainty. Dion's carbon tax is huge uncertainity, and unfairly taxes the economic engine of our country. Layton wants to reverse all the pro-business measures Harper has enacted. Responsible in a time of business uncertainty? Absolutely not.

I'm going to vote Conservative on October 14th, not because I'm happy with their record (income trusts, for example), but because they are the only party with the sense to guide the economy in the correct direction.

Don't look to Dion for your economic advice, he is DEAD WRONG. Their outlooks will cost you your savings. Don't give in to the panic and ride this one out with a sensible strategy.

My disgust for the opportunism of the Liberals is growing by the hour. The harm Dion has caused this week is unmeasurable to many Canadian families, especially retirees who are very concerned about their future and are more likely to sell in a panic.

Stop it Dion. Stop lying. Your either stupid or reckless. Neither gives you the right to be a leader. Get out.

The only fear I have, is the Harper campaign has been asleep at the switch and Canadians by the boatfull are listening to Dion's toaster. This fear mongering is a train wreck for commodities.

The Conservatives needed a salesman, Harper is no salesman. Too bad, he might be right.

[capricorn]

Today....CBC I think it was...had a poll that showed Harper being less popular than Dion, with both of them being seen as ore negative than positive.

I'll pass on CBC polls, thank you. I looked at the Nanos' numbers on CPAC tonight. Harper lead in every category.

[capricorn]

The only fear I have, is the Harper campaign has been asleep at the switch and Canadians by the boatfull are listening to Dion's toaster. This fear mongering is a train wreck for commodities.

If you have a chance, watch Dion's interview with CBC's Mansbridge. Go to the CBC website. It has a link to the interviews with all the leaders. I hope a lot of Canadians watch this interview. Dion is evasive in his answers and did not inspire any confidence at all. Mansbridge had to bring him back to the question time and again, as all Dion was interested in was bashing Harper and Layton. He was pretty well begging Canadians to vote for him.

The Conservatives needed a salesman, Harper is no salesman.

That's an understatement.

[jdobbin]

The polls show that 33% of voters support Harper. His leadership numbers have been consistently higher than any of the other leaders. For you to say "people don't trust Harper" is stretching it. Why am I not surprised?

People don't seem to trust him with a majority. Is that a stretch? He flirted with a majority and even though his leadership numbers are up there, people still don't seem to trust him enough for a majority. Why am I not surprised that you think he is trusted enough to win a majority?

[Smallc]

I'll pass on CBC polls, thank you.

Poll isn't done by CBC, but rather Harris Decima I think. It doesn't really matter though, because when it comes to news, the CBC is one of the most respected journalistic organizations the world over. In reality though, you can pass on whatever you want, but they said this is the first time it has been this way since the start of the election. What this proves is that the tide has turned in this election. I don't know if it will stay this way and as of now, I really don't know who will win, but there is no denying what has happened over the last couple of days.

[capricorn]

Why am I not surprised that you think he is trusted enough to win a majority?

You're wrong dobbin. In the seat predictions thread I have the Conservatives at 136.

[capricorn]

Poll isn't done by CBC, but rather Harris Decima I think.

You make a claim that Dion leads Harper in some kind of poll...you think...what poll...you don't know. And you expect me to take your word on face value?

It doesn't really matter though, because when it comes to news, the CBC is one of the most respected journalistic organizations the world over.

With an annual budget of $1B it tries very hard to make it in the big leagues.

[jdobbin]

The manufacturing sector suffers from hardline unions, repressive business taxation in Ontario especially and company's addicted to the breast milk of Ottawa politicans. Ontario manufacturers have not innovated because they have never had to, and they never learned to.

Ontario manufacturing is dead. We can continue to throw money at it, but it costs more than it's worth.

Let Ontario die. It will be back, and hopefully have some innovation and business spirit, instead of an addiction to government.

I'm sure that there are a few Tory supporters who believe that Ontario should be sacrificed.

I wanted to step in on this topic because I've been shocked by how easily Jack Layton and Stephane Dion have descended to the bottom of the pit in terms of fear mongering. Being educated in finance and economics and pursuing graduate level education in investments, I can tell you right now, Jack and Stephane are unjustified.

Harper used the same fearmongering when saying a Liberal government would lead to economic ruin and disunity.

Canada's economy is strong. Canada's banks are strong. There is no financial crisis in Canada.

There is a credit crunch even in Canada.

The stock market is subject to regular business cycle corrections. That's all we are seeing now. This correction is larger than most, but it's simply a correction.

No one is denying the market was a bubble. Now, the threat is a credit crunch that is hurting people and companies around the world. Harper said the worst was over three weeks ago.

If you have been prudent and lived within your means, you should have no fears.

If you have a business and can't credit for investment, acquisitions and operations, it is a time to have real concern.

If you have a mortgage, a loan or anything else with the bank, expect more difficulty accessing credit.

Your investments will recover. This is, like Harper said, a great time to get into the market and buy up some bargin stocks.

Great for those with cash lying about.

The fear mongering of the opposition right now disgusts me and is contributing to the fear and aniexity amongst Canadian investors. Many people are clueluss and are ordering their financial representatives to sell their positions because Stephane and Jack are calling for a recession.

The top bank economists yesterday reported that Canada could be headed for a recession. Be disgusted at them

It's disgusting. When people pull out now, they are going to lose money! Dion should be on the hook for their losses!

It's disgusting that Conservatives single out Dion when the banks are saying we are headed for an "unprecedented economic struggle."

Anyone that votes for the Liberals or the NDP in the coming election just simply ignores the realities of the economy today, prudence and retaining the current tax structure is key to our economic well being over the next few years. Markets hate uncertainty. Dion's carbon tax is huge uncertainity, and unfairly taxes the economic engine of our country. Layton wants to reverse all the pro-business measures Harper has enacted. Responsible in a time of business uncertainty?

Harper's carbon tax hits Alberta even harder. There uis huge cost uncertainty.

Harper's spending is out of control. It breezes past Chretien and Martin by a country mile.

Anyone who vote for Harper ignores his broken promises on income trusts, spending and fixed election dates.

I'm going to vote Conservative on October 14th, not because I'm happy with their record (income trusts, for example), but because they are the only party with the sense to guide the economy in the correct direction.

I voted already and hopefully, Harper will not get the majority he desperately wants.

Don't look to Dion for your economic advice, he is DEAD WRONG. Their outlooks will cost you your savings. Don't give in to the panic and ride this one out with a sensible strategy.

Our savings have already taken a hit from Harper who said the worst was over three weeks ago.

My disgust for the opportunism of the Liberals is growing by the hour. The harm Dion has caused this week is unmeasurable to many Canadian families, especially retirees who are very concerned about their future and are more likely to sell in a panic.

Your disgust should extend to the banks.

Stop it Dion. Stop lying. Your either stupid or reckless. Neither gives you the right to be a leader. Get out.

The hyperpartisan will surely blame Dion for the economic crisis and overlook that Harper didn't think it was a problem weeks ago. Was that a lie, rose coloured glasses or incompetence? If Harper had been employed by one of the banks, he might have gotten fired for that.

[jdobbin]

You're wrong dobbin. In the seat predictions thread I have the Conservatives at 136.

So you think people don't trust him either, right?

Edited October 9, 2008 by jdobbin

[capricorn]

So you think people don't him either, right?

After all is said and done, Canadians will realize the snow job the Liberals and the NDP pulled on them.