Nicaragua recognizes South Ossetia, Abkhazia

[PoliticalCitizen]

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hkkDAW4...tGynBgD930NA080

Nicaragua recognizes South Ossetia, Abkhazia

re-copied article deleted by moderator

Edited September 11, 2008 by Charles Anthony
re-copied article deleted

[M.Dancer]

re-copied Opening Post deleted by moderator

Yipee Putin is getting bthe TinPots on side..Zimbabwe should be soon too....shame no importnat nations will sancition Russia's aggression.

Edited September 6, 2008 by Charles Anthony
deleted re-quoted Opening Post

[PoliticalCitizen]

Yipee Putin is getting bthe TinPots on side..Zimbabwe should be soon too....shame no importnat nations will sancition Russia's aggression.

Them fighting words...

Let's wait and see. I'm sure yesterday you and others would have told me that NO country other than Russia will EVER recognize South Ossetia and Abkhazia.

[M.Dancer]

Them fighting words...

Let's wait and see. I'm sure yesterday you and others would have told me that NO country other than Russia will EVER recognize South Ossetia and Abkhazia.

No important country....or no country with a non idiot leader (WINK CHAVEZ)

[PoliticalCitizen]

No important country....or no country with a non idiot leader (WINK CHAVEZ)

Who is to decide the "importance" of a country?

In many ways the West-European countries have given up their ability to make an independent decision as they made their countries interests subservient to USA's foreign policy.

What is important - now US can't say that Russia is the only country that recognized South Ossetia and Abkhazia and Saakashvili can't keep claiming they're being "annexed" to Russia.

Edited September 5, 2008 by PoliticalCitizen

[Kaisa]

Them fighting words...

Let's wait and see. I'm sure yesterday you and others would have told me that NO country other than Russia will EVER recognize South Ossetia and Abkhazia.

Why not, the recognition might follow from Cuba, Venezuela, Belarus and other "elite" countries.

I can tell how hurt Russians are by looking at how incredibly happy Nicaragua made them.

Please tell me, if you are not Russian, Ossetian, Abkhazian or Georgian why do you take it so personally?

[PoliticalCitizen]

Why not, the recognition might follow from Cuba, Venezuela, Belarus and other "elite" countries.

I can tell how hurt Russians are by looking at how incredibly happy Nicaragua made them.

Please tell me, if you are not Russian, Ossetian, Abkhazian or Georgian why do you take it so personally?

Well, I'll tell you, but it's a secret, OK?

I was Soviet, my parents are Ukrainian and Moldavian, my first language was Russian.

I am proud to see Russia rise after 2 decades of humiliation. I am glad that US was finally defied by the rising remnant of the former superpower, after bombing, breaking, invaiding and humiliating numerous countries, some of which are dear to me.

Now you tell me why does your people feel closer to the US than to Russia? Why did Georgia send soldiers to Iraq? Have the historic ties been forgotten so quickly and your people's loyalty bought with US and Israeli military aid? Do you feel the actions of Georgian government are justified?

[M.Dancer]

Former slaves are never loyal to their former masters.

Glad the episode made you hapey, cause the humilation of Russia will go on....there is a historical imperitive at work and the collapse of the USSR continues...

[blueblood]

Well, I'll tell you, but it's a secret, OK?

I was Soviet, my parents are Ukrainian and Moldavian, my first language was Russian.

I am proud to see Russia rise after 2 decades of humiliation. I am glad that US was finally defied by the rising remnant of the former superpower, after bombing, breaking, invaiding and humiliating numerous countries, some of which are dear to me.

Now you tell me why does your people feel closer to the US than to Russia? Why did Georgia send soldiers to Iraq? Have the historic ties been forgotten so quickly and your people's loyalty bought with US and Israeli military aid? Do you feel the actions of Georgian government are justified?

This is bloody hypocrisy of the first order. Here we have a communist, who has came over to the capitalist west. He is living the good life which is provided because of the west's policies and is crying bloody murder and how evil the west is. In the west he even has the fundamental right to question how things are run, which in commie land where he's from it's off to the gulag (however ethically and logically he has no right to bitch and complain)

The U.S. is the top of the pile because it showed that the commie way of doing things is utter nonesense.

You can ignore my posts all you want, but I have proven time and time again, your posts are utter hypocrisy and don't hold any water. Russia has been humiliating itself for the last 80 years. Like I said if Russia is so good, pack up and don't let the door hit your ass on the way out. If this person actually lived in Russia, then the posts can be taken seriously, but by immigrating to the west for the high life and saying how evil the west is, is flat out not only hypocrisy, but disrespectfull.

Canada is potentially going to deal socialism a mortal wound in the next federal election, (this according to a card carrying Liberal on this forum). Communism and socialism are a collasal failure and one by one countries are starting to realize that.

As for this poster talk about having your cake and eating it too. I sincerely hope that the U.S. pulls off Al Gore's plan, why because Russia will be up shit creek again.

[Kaisa]

Well, I'll tell you, but it's a secret, OK?

I was Soviet, my parents are Ukrainian and Moldavian, my first language was Russian.

I am proud to see Russia rise after 2 decades of humiliation. I am glad that US was finally defied by the rising remnant of the former superpower, after bombing, breaking, invaiding and humiliating numerous countries, some of which are dear to me.

Now you tell me why does your people feel closer to the US than to Russia? Why did Georgia send soldiers to Iraq? Have the historic ties been forgotten so quickly and your people's loyalty bought with US and Israeli military aid? Do you feel the actions of Georgian government are justified?

I think Russia is humilated more than it ever was since 1991 - it is isolated and condemned. Much more bad things are to follow but I guess some Russians are missing the signs while the hysteria in Russia is at the highest level.

What historic ties are you talking about? Invading and occupying? Killing and torturing? Stealing our land? Trying to change a status of Georgian language in Georgia to make Russia the only official state language? I cannot talk for whole Georgia but the values of the West are much closer to me. Of course I think that the actions of Georgian government are justified - we are trying to survive as an independent country while you are trying to swallaw us.

Bullies never bully alone, they always have sidekicks. I am neither surprised nor alarmed by Nicaragua's recognition. What surprises me is how come Abkazia and "South Ossetia" did not recognize each-other.

[PoliticalCitizen]

I think Russia is humilated more than it ever was since 1991 - it is isolated and condemned. Much more bad things are to follow but I guess some Russians are missing the signs while the hysteria in Russia is at the highest level.

What historic ties are you talking about? Invading and occupying? Killing and torturing? Stealing our land? Trying to change a status of Georgian language in Georgia to make Russia the only official state language? I cannot talk for whole Georgia but the values of the West are much closer to me. Of course I think that the actions of Georgian government are justified - we are trying to survive as an independent country while you are trying to swallaw us.

Bullies never bully alone, they always have sidekicks. I am neither surprised nor alarmed by Nicaragua's recognition. What surprises me is how come Abkazia and "South Ossetia" did not recognize each-other.

Russia can never be isolated geographically, politically or economically.

You CAN say, however, that USA or Western Europe could isolate themselves from Russia.

Your neighbors which happen to be Russian friends (real ones, not like Kikabidze ) - Armenia supported Russian military action in Georgia and condemned the actions of Georgian government, along with Belarus, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, and Tajikistan.

They stopped short of recognizing the new countries, but give them some time...

[Kaisa]

Russia can never be isolated geographically, politically or economically.

You CAN say, however, that USA or Western Europe could isolate themselves from Russia.

Your neighbors which happen to be Russian friends (real ones, not like Kikabidze ) - Armenia supported Russian military action in Georgia and condemned the actions of Georgian government, along with Belarus, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, and Tajikistan.

They stopped short of recognizing the new countries, but give them some time...

I think it can be and is isolated already. You can repeat million times how great and powerful you are and I think it is childish to start repeating after you how isolated you really are and what other great changes are coming. I hope we will both live long enough to see who is right.

Exactly, you were not even able to force your vassal countries to recognize Abkhazia and South Ossetia. I wonder what you used to threaten them to made them condemn Georgian actions. How come it took them one month to realize

[PoliticalCitizen]

I think it can be and is isolated already. You can repeat million times how great and powerful you are and I think it is childish to start repeating after you how isolated you really are and what other great changes are coming. I hope we will both live long enough to see who is right.

Exactly, you were not even able to force your vassal countries to recognize Abkhazia and South Ossetia. I wonder what you used to threaten them to made them condemn Georgian actions. How come it took them one month to realize

Russia can export natural resources to China and India - markets far bigger than Europe and US can ever be.

Why do you call Armenia Russian vassal? Are they not an independent country?

Or is Georgia planning to invade them too (to straighten some historical injustice, of course)?

[myata]

Just to avoid any confusion about semantics of "isolation", let's recall that according to referenced information posted in another thread, no country outside of Western block, or its aspiring partners has condemned (or "isolated", for that part) Russia for its actions in Georgia. If anything in this regard has changed since, please post updates.

Like Pinoccio of the story (or was it another fairy tale character?) the West is making up "facts" then falls for them in genuine (or at least ostensible - for everybody else) belief. I'm not 100% sure which of the two it is, but based on the facts below, I'm willing to accept that we still genuinly and honestly believe that only our opinion that should count (or at least, count lot more than that of the others).

1. Nukes: we have them in ,000 numbers, we broght the world to a brink of a nuclear shootout couple of times. And it's big no-no for everybody else;

2. Military invasions are a foul to our peaceful nature. We strongly condemn them - when we aren't involved in the regime change missions, and on occasion, at the same time.

3. Not only we strongly condemn military invasions by others, but we take forceful measures to defend the victim of such. Sometimes. In the other times we look the other way, and limit ourselves to wishing everybody justice and peace.

4. We respect territorial integrity of other countries and strongly condemn all attempts to change borders by force - when we aren't in the process of recognising a newborn democracy, and (see #2).

5. We respect the right of nations for democratic self determination and support such right with all our democratic spirit (see #4). We also condemn self proclaimed "entities" that pretend to laying claim to independence (who cares de jure or de facto) if they don't satisfy our democratic criteria (which are about needle eye wide and jump about like that laser in a disco). See #4, again.

6. As already stated, our nature is highly peaceful, and we loath excessive use of military force in ethnic conflicts. On some occasions, we even react strongly and forcefully to such despicable acts. On others, we write them off as restoration of constitutional order, and look the other way.

I'm sure there's more, but I'm running out of time. Please feel free to add.

[Kaisa]

Russia can export natural resources to China and India - markets far bigger than Europe and US can ever be.

Why do you call Armenia Russian vassal? Are they not an independent country?

Or is Georgia planning to invade them too (to straighten some historical injustice, of course)?

You will be able to survive if this is what you are trying to say

Could you please give me a list of countries that Georgia has ever invaded. And we can compare it with the similar list for Russia. If you cannot come up with the list just give me a name of one country.

Also, could you please kindly explain to me why it took Armenia 1 month to condemn Georgia's actions? You would think that the neighbour country with a serious interest in stability and big Armenian population in Georgia would be concerned enough to make a statement much earlier. Why did they have to go to Moscow to finally "figure out" that Georgia was wrong?

[PoliticalCitizen]

You will be able to survive if this is what you are trying to say

Could you please give me a list of countries that Georgia has ever invaded. And we can compare it with the similar list for Russia. If you cannot come up with the list just give me a name of one country.

Also, could you please kindly explain to me why it took Armenia 1 month to condemn Georgia's actions? You would think that the neighbour country with a serious interest in stability and big Armenian population in Georgia would be concerned enough to make a statement much earlier. Why did they have to go to Moscow to finally "figure out" that Georgia was wrong?

Western Europe is the side that may have trouble surviving.

It doesn't matter why and how - what matters is one of Georgia's 4 neighboring countries (that could be its REAL friends) condemned its actions.

All the VIRTUAL friends from across the ocean can do is send a few ships into the Black Sea - which they will have to withdraw within 21 days.

Oh, Bush also promised 1 Bill to Saakashivli's regime... how much of that you think will actually go to helping your people?

Russia's help to rebuild South Ossetia is almost half of that...

Turkey also regards Russia's actions as justified. That's Georgia's other neighbor that COULD be its friend...

Azerbaijan decided to send ALL of it's oil via the Russian pipeline as opposed to Georgian... That's another neighbor that COULD be Georgia's friend...

So who is isolated? Or should I say - who is the loser?

Edited September 7, 2008 by PoliticalCitizen

[Kaisa]

Western Europe is the side that may have trouble surviving.

It doesn't matter why and how - what matters is one of Georgia's 4 neighboring countries (that could be its REAL friends) condemned its actions.

It matters, my friend. Armenia has always been Russia's main strategic partner in Caucasus - they need each other VERY much. Can you please remind me how many neighbours of Armenia are Armenia's freinds? I wonder what Russia promissed to do or not to do if Armenia condemned Georgia.

As for Azerbaijan and Turkey, are you sure they are not Georgia's friends? Turkey is in NATO remember? boo

[PoliticalCitizen]

It matters, my friend. Armenia has always been Russia's main strategic partner in Caucasus - they need each other VERY much. Can you please remind me how many neighbours of Armenia are Armenia's freinds? I wonder what Russia promissed to do or not to do if Armenia condemned Georgia.

As for Azerbaijan and Turkey, are you sure they are not Georgia's friends? Turkey is in NATO remember? boo

One historical fact and political reality that I'm sure of - Armenia is as far from being friends with Turkey as could be... an internationally recognized fact of genocide happened about 100 years ago... 1 Million Armenians got butchered by the Turks...

But you cannot deny that neither Turkey nor Azerbaijan condemned Russia's actions.

You also cannot deny that all Azeri oil is being pumped via Russian pipeline right now.

Honestly, I am sorry that this happened to your motherland... It's yet another humiliation that the peoples of former Soviet Union have been made to endure by the West...

[Kaisa]

One historical fact and political reality that I'm sure of - Armenia is as far from being friends with Turkey as could be... an internationally recognized fact of genocide happened about 100 years ago... 1 Million Armenians got butchered by the Turks...

But you cannot deny that neither Turkey nor Azerbaijan condemned Russia's actions.

You also cannot deny that all Azeri oil is being pumped via Russian pipeline right now.

Honestly, I am sorry that this happened to your motherland... It's yet another humiliation that the peoples of former Soviet Union have been made to endure by the West...

Yeah, right

Could you please remind me how much Turkish export goes to Russia? Have you heard of an incident regarding turkish goods recently?

Russia is big, powerful and shameless and it does everything to get support over recent events. However even though Russia threatens and bribes in every possible way only few half-supported their actions and most of them did that after a long time when Russia really pressed them.

Georgia on the other hand is small, weak and poor and even IF we were unethical and immoral we dont have any leverages to force countries to do anything. Get real, in this situation even a "neutrality" of a Russian dependant country is already a big victory for us.

[PoliticalCitizen]

Yeah, right

Could you please remind me how much Turkish export goes to Russia? Have you heard of an incident regarding turkish goods recently?

Russia is big, powerful and shameless and it does everything to get support over recent events. However even though Russia threatens and bribes in every possible way only few half-supported their actions and most of them did that after a long time when Russia really pressed them.

Georgia on the other hand is small, weak and poor and even IF we were unethical and immoral we dont have any leverages to force countries to do anything. Get real, in this situation even a "neutrality" of a Russian dependant country is already a big victory for us.

That would be true had Georgia not had the UNCONDITIONAL support it enjoys from the country that used to be the world's only superpower until recently.

You should also know that this same country has also instructed all of NATO and EU on how to react and how to show things in the media.

And about Armenia - I forgot to mention Nagorno-Karabakh which I guess made them enemies with Azerbaijan... Poor Armenia.... Iran on the other side... Oh brother...

Edited September 9, 2008 by PoliticalCitizen

[AngusThermopyle]

the country that used to be the world's only superpower until recently.

There's a new one?

Who is it?

[Kaisa]

That would be true had Georgia not had the UNCONDITIONAL support it enjoys from the country that used to be the world's only superpower until recently.

You should also know that this same country has also instructed all of NATO and EU on how to react and how to show things in the media.

And about Armenia - I forgot to mention Nagorno-Karabakh which I guess made them enemies with Azerbaijan... Poor Armenia.... Iran on the other side... Oh brother...

So, you know that both Russia and the West try hard to get supporters. (Their motives and methods are completely different but this is not the point). So whether Turkey and Armenia are friends with Georgia is irrelevant, isn't it? Yes, Armenia is in a very difficult situation and they cannot survive without Russia. Turkey's economy is going to be hit very hard if Russia imposes sanctions. And I am sure Turkey has all the reasons to believe that this is going to happen. Remember Georgian wine, Borjomi, recent chicken export ban, etc...

So, why are you trying to make a point that Armenia and Turkey did not support Georgia because Georgia is wrong?

[PoliticalCitizen]

So, you know that both Russia and the West try hard to get supporters. (Their motives and methods are completely different but this is not the point). So whether Turkey and Armenia are friends with Georgia is irrelevant, isn't it? Yes, Armenia is in a very difficult situation and they cannot survive without Russia. Turkey's economy is going to be hit very hard if Russia imposes sanctions. And I am sure Turkey has all the reasons to believe that this is going to happen. Remember Georgian wine, Borjomi, recent chicken export ban, etc...

So, why are you trying to make a point that Armenia and Turkey did not support Georgia because Georgia is wrong?

Hey - Russia banned the export of Moldovian wine and cognac (divin) as well...