Kaisa

If I did not speak Russian I would not understand what you meant by: "As do not name revolution". You sound just like my friend who asked someone "not to powder her mind". My english is far from being perfect but at least I dont translate every word of an idiom (in her case). As for the rest, I already told you there were elections but you ignored that.

The movie does not promote hate, it tells the real Soviet (and Russian) story. I guess youtube feels it is disturbing to watch most of the scenes, I can understand that, it was difficult to watch for me too. http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=41808601BA1647E6 The videos are removed but I understand the other links (Torrent, Rapidshare) still work. So I guess unfortunately for you if people are really interested they will watch it anyways. As I already told you or some other Russian guy The Uncle Joe was Georgianized Ossetian who always referred himself to be Russian (and changed his name to sound Russian). However this is not important anyways, he was a monster whether Georgian or Martian. But guess what, the movie is not called Stalin story, it is called The Soviet story. I met many Russians or "non-Russians" like you who told me something like this: "there was a great country, everyone loved and respected each other, there was no hatred, we had everything, no unemployment, bla bla bla". I wonder if they realize that some people value freedom more than full stomachs. I think that if they watched this movie and realized what was the base of the country they would be shocked. By the way, I also told you that I did not hate Russians however I am sure you will accuse me of being Russophobic no matter what. So, I will just ignore that.

This is not true, of course. Shevardnadze lost power after the revolution in November 2003. Saakashvili was elected in January 2004. Burjanadze was in charge between November-January.

Russian ambassador to NATO Rogozin made a political campaign video about cleaning Moscow from trash. Great, right? Wrong! WHO do you think trash is? When I provided a youtube link in Georgian to Political Citizen (although you could hear Russian and English as well) he claimed that he did not understand what the video was about because he did not speak Georgian. I promised that I would get the full movie in English and I did. When you watch this movie Rogozin and his video (see it in the last part) will seem like a child's play compared to other shocking crimes. I suspect that we will hear more about Ukrainian genocide by soviets - about how they starved 7,000,000 Ukrainians to death. The first 10 minutes of the movie is about this tragedy. Don't miss the opportunity to watch the movie. BTW It is banned in Russia. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHg60T_og4U...7E6&index=0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6mAq-EZEak...7E6&index=1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9TdtVeiBrI...7E6&index=2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-i89tmKIyI...7E6&index=3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6cA3BUTLmE...7E6&index=4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNPAjOSzchI...7E6&index=5 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nl8lGo8Z494...7E6&index=6 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MgzxIo5zjis...7E6&index=7 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adGpINMlajw...7E6&index=8

So, you know that both Russia and the West try hard to get supporters. (Their motives and methods are completely different but this is not the point). So whether Turkey and Armenia are friends with Georgia is irrelevant, isn't it? Yes, Armenia is in a very difficult situation and they cannot survive without Russia. Turkey's economy is going to be hit very hard if Russia imposes sanctions. And I am sure Turkey has all the reasons to believe that this is going to happen. Remember Georgian wine, Borjomi, recent chicken export ban, etc... So, why are you trying to make a point that Armenia and Turkey did not support Georgia because Georgia is wrong?

That's right

I am not arguing the facts, but we have different interpretation. I think that no Russian neighbour is 100% safe and it is wise to build an army when you are in a situation Georgia was. I hope that we will rebuild an even stronger army and learn from our mistakes. Wait, I said we tolerated a very difficult situation for 17 years, you said we havent been tolerating since we were provoking (militarily) constantly. I hope you realize that you cannot prove your false point with the argument above because the time horizon is different.

Yeah, right Could you please remind me how much Turkish export goes to Russia? Have you heard of an incident regarding turkish goods recently? Russia is big, powerful and shameless and it does everything to get support over recent events. However even though Russia threatens and bribes in every possible way only few half-supported their actions and most of them did that after a long time when Russia really pressed them. Georgia on the other hand is small, weak and poor and even IF we were unethical and immoral we dont have any leverages to force countries to do anything. Get real, in this situation even a "neutrality" of a Russian dependant country is already a big victory for us.

Well, Abkhazia was one of the most popular sea resorts during the soviet time, it is really beautuful. or was No, it is not how I came to Canada. I left a very succesful carier and happy life in Georgia, immigrated as a skilled worker and built everything from the scratch here (as many like me).

You are really something, you know? I even started enjoying this. You have already mentioned this pearl - it is a crime to build an army, I got it from the first time Now, let's analyze your allegation about the provocations. Georgia had nothing to gain from a military provocation which if succesful meant war with Russia. If Georgia wanted to start a war with Russia it could always start it by entering "South Ossetia" which was (and is) a Georgian territory. Russia however could not have entered Georgia without a formal excuse as it was not a Russian territory. So tell me, why would Georgia need provocations for 17 years?

I am sorry but your point is complete BS. If you dont stand up to a bully you will probably end up with fewer broken bones but you would not suggest to your son to quietly give his pocket money to a big guy, would you? Abkhazia and Samachablo together are almost 20% of Georgian territory, more than 400,000 people or aprroximately 10% of Georgian population was displaced because of these conflicts - they lost absolutely everything. My best friend is originally from Ochamchire, she was so happy that she managed to take her photo album with her, she lost her house and everything else in it. Many children grew up in hotel rooms where sometimes 10-15 people lived together. Can you imagine what impact these numbers can have on a country's well being in every possible aspect? It would not have been easy even for a much stronger and richer country. Georgia offered Ossetians and Abkhazians very broad authonomy, we wanted dialogue. They, of course, did not accept anything. Also, dont forget about constant provocations, bombing, shelling, killing and destroying. We tolerated this for 17 years!!! I know you dream of a georgian president that will be your puppet, no need to tell me over and over again. You are avoiding my question about "self-determination" but that's ok, everyone knows the answer anyways. You know, I listen to "Echo Moskvi" all the time. The discussions are very interesting, I learn so much. They dont care about what is going to happen with Georgia or Georgians. It is incredible to listen to people from country that started a war "to protect lives", "to avoid humanitarian catastrophe", etc, and see only concern about Russia's future and interests. They care about Abkhazians and Ossetians as much as they care about Georgians by the way, i.e. they dont give a **** if we all died today. I dont mind though. At least they are not pretending. Your posts revive my childhood memories - a soviet mentality, soviet propaganda. Unfortunately to all of us it is coming back to Russia.

It matters, my friend. Armenia has always been Russia's main strategic partner in Caucasus - they need each other VERY much. Can you please remind me how many neighbours of Armenia are Armenia's freinds? I wonder what Russia promissed to do or not to do if Armenia condemned Georgia. As for Azerbaijan and Turkey, are you sure they are not Georgia's friends? Turkey is in NATO remember? boo

How about you start.

How mature

I hope they are really after the truth which is not so difficult to see, honestly.

Let me try to follow your logic: 1. You said that the West was not objective because it was calling Russia occupant and aggressor. 2. I asked if YOU were objective while advocating the right of "self-determination" for Ossetians on a historically Georgian territory which had had majority of Georgian population before ethnical cleansing was conducted by Russians and Ossetians. 3. Your answer was a story about how Moldova was torn up and your conclusion that this is a fate of small countries. First of all this is wrong. There are many countries, much poorer than Georgia that survive independently and dont lose territories. Mind you, they dont border Russia. Second: How does your story prove that Georgia is wrong and Russia is right i.e. the West is feeding BS, etc? In fact it shows that Russia always has similar methods and they are dirty and ugly.

You will be able to survive if this is what you are trying to say Could you please give me a list of countries that Georgia has ever invaded. And we can compare it with the similar list for Russia. If you cannot come up with the list just give me a name of one country. Also, could you please kindly explain to me why it took Armenia 1 month to condemn Georgia's actions? You would think that the neighbour country with a serious interest in stability and big Armenian population in Georgia would be concerned enough to make a statement much earlier. Why did they have to go to Moscow to finally "figure out" that Georgia was wrong?

I would not bet on it. Russia is in a very difficult situation right now, I am not concerned about that but some Russians are and I can give you articles with their point of view, maybe the opinion of your friend will help you see better. Good night.

I think it can be and is isolated already. You can repeat million times how great and powerful you are and I think it is childish to start repeating after you how isolated you really are and what other great changes are coming. I hope we will both live long enough to see who is right. Exactly, you were not even able to force your vassal countries to recognize Abkhazia and South Ossetia. I wonder what you used to threaten them to made them condemn Georgian actions. How come it took them one month to realize

Are you trying to say that Abkhazia and Samachablo became part of Georgia in 20th century? Please explain.

wishful thinking Do you speak Ukranian or Modovian i.e. Romanian?

Sure, from chicken export ban to NATO transit route blockage, you have all the trumps, poor west.

And of course you were completely objective - talking about the right of self-determination for Ossetiand and Abkhazs and forgetting to mention that these regions were historically georgian where majority of population was georgian until Russia killed and forced most of them to leave. So, if I come to your house with the weapon and make you leave I have right to call it my house, right? Wrong! It will not be my house either legally or morally. I dont think anybody knows for 100% why it is called Georgia. I personally dont want to change it. Georgia is not the only country which is called differently in different languages. Armenia, for example, is Somkheti in Georgian and Hayastan in Armenian.

I think Russia is humilated more than it ever was since 1991 - it is isolated and condemned. Much more bad things are to follow but I guess some Russians are missing the signs while the hysteria in Russia is at the highest level. What historic ties are you talking about? Invading and occupying? Killing and torturing? Stealing our land? Trying to change a status of Georgian language in Georgia to make Russia the only official state language? I cannot talk for whole Georgia but the values of the West are much closer to me. Of course I think that the actions of Georgian government are justified - we are trying to survive as an independent country while you are trying to swallaw us. Bullies never bully alone, they always have sidekicks. I am neither surprised nor alarmed by Nicaragua's recognition. What surprises me is how come Abkazia and "South Ossetia" did not recognize each-other.

If you were joking this would mean that you dont agree with Russian propaganda for the first time. We call ourselves Qartveli, or Qartvelebi in plural. Georgia is called Saqartvelo in Georgian.