Bernier Resigns

Topaz · June 1, 2008

We know that Mulroney years were nothing but corruption and ministers resigning left and right and we know the scam that the Quebec Libs pulled off BOTH wrong. Today we have a government that made PROMISES to be accountable, honest etc. Well, what happen?? I`m not sure if voters voted out the Libs or voted against the Cons but thankfully, Harper only got a minority! How did Harper let the Bernier problem and other scams running through this government happen?? He`s the captain of this ship and he`s suppose know what is going on especially with inexperience people in his cabinet. The grass always looks greener on the other side and I think Harper knows that its not as easy to be in the PMO as he thought sitting on the other side.

Argus · June 1, 2008

We know that Mulroney years were nothing but corruption and ministers resigning left and right

We do? Can you name how many resigned over corruption and their names?

Argus · June 1, 2008

Thankfully, you won't have to face a Chretien re-election.

Your party is riddled with thieves. Chretien didn't act alone. Every major cabinet decision which robbed us of money left guilt over every member of his cabinet who voted in favour of it - such as the Iltis trucks. I highly doubt that Dion, as his trusted Quebec lieutenant, didn't know anything about Sponsorship either.

Argus · June 1, 2008

Of course, although if I went around saying, without any citation or evidence, that Bernier frequently makes use of child prostitutes, I would hope you would consider that to be as worthless as the tripe you post without backing it up.

The story of Graham and the 15 year old was a cover feature in Frank magazine, and I'm sure you can find more flavour filled information on him esp on gay forums.

BubberMiley · June 1, 2008

The story of Graham and the 15 year old was a cover feature in Frank magazine, and I'm sure you can find more flavour filled information on him esp on gay forums.

Your only source is Frank magazine? You do know that was a satirical publication, don't you?

Edited June 1, 2008 by BubberMiley

jdobbin · June 1, 2008

Your party is riddled with thieves. Chretien didn't act alone. Every major cabinet decision which robbed us of money left guilt over every member of his cabinet who voted in favour of it - such as the Iltis trucks. I highly doubt that Dion, as his trusted Quebec lieutenant, didn't know anything about Sponsorship either.

And your party is riddled with bigots and social conservatives. I doubt very much if the Conservatives have abandoned those principles of intolerance.

As for the Iltis, it was the Tories whom ordered the damn things. They first came into service in 1985. Look unto your own. Maybe Harper was part of that decision making.

Topaz · June 2, 2008

We do? Can you name how many resigned over corruption and their names?

I could but I'd have to go find the book "on the take" by Stevie Cameron and before you say its a pack of lies, as Stevie pointed out at the committee for Schrieber and Mulroney NOT ONE person has come forward and said the book were lies, that is except Mulroney and he says everyone is lying but him! I do remember reading that when the lobbyist came to deal with the minister, the minister would say ok, I'll deal but you have to pay me this much before I deal with you. This was in the first years of Mulroney cabinet and then when he was re-elcted he change d the rules on lobbying.

Topaz · June 2, 2008

Your party is riddled with thieves. Chretien didn't act alone. Every major cabinet decision which robbed us of money left guilt over every member of his cabinet who voted in favour of it - such as the Iltis trucks. I highly doubt that Dion, as his trusted Quebec lieutenant, didn't know anything about Sponsorship either.

Sorry but my view of politics has changed and I don't support any one party because the Libs and the Cons,(both conservative parties) have corruption within them, so don't say MY party meaning the Libs. This is a new world as far as politics goes and I'm not going to be that person that only votes Liberal, conservative, progressive conservative, NDP or Green, because of PARTY line, I'm going to vote for what I think is best for CANADA. Well, you could be right about Dion knowing so as the conservative say...if you have information about this, please let them know your info.

Argus · June 2, 2008

And your party is riddled with bigots and social conservatives. I doubt very much if the Conservatives have abandoned those principles of intolerance.

You have as many if not more, especially anti-semites.

As for the Iltis, it was the Tories whom ordered the damn things. They first came into service in 1985. Look unto your own. Maybe Harper was part of that decision making.

You're off by a decade. They came into service in 1995

The Iltis

The PCs bear some shame for the initial agreement to buy them. But don't blame me since I'd abandoned them as nothing more than Liberal Party Light by then. However, the purchase was conditional on the Iltis passing the military's testing. They failed miserably, and repeatedly. Whereupon the Liberal government closed the testing range and shipped the job to a private (and more amenable) American testing outfit which passed them. They were a disaster from the start. Btw, if we'd actually bought them off the shelf from the original German manufacturer we would have paid aprox $26k per unit. We wound up paying aprox $84k per unit to build them in Canada. A lesson for those who insist new Canadian warships should be designed and built here.

Argus · June 2, 2008

I could but I'd have to go find the book "on the take" by Stevie Cameron and before you say its a pack of lies, as Stevie pointed out at the committee for Schrieber and Mulroney NOT ONE person has come forward and said the book were lies, that is except Mulroney and he says everyone is lying but him! I do remember reading that when the lobbyist came to deal with the minister, the minister would say ok, I'll deal but you have to pay me this much before I deal with you. This was in the first years of Mulroney cabinet and then when he was re-elcted he change d the rules on lobbying.

Don't believe you. Don't believe her either. It's not that I don't think that sort of thing might happen, but first, that sort of thing has always been illegal. Don't give me any crap about the rules of lobbying changing. That's outright bribery. Second, while outright bribery certainly happens, there are only two people in a room when it does and neither is going to be confessing to a third rate "journalist" with an obsessive compulsive disorder like Cameron.

jdobbin · June 2, 2008

You have as many if not more, especially anti-semites.

We keep hearing that from the Tories but they never mention who those people are in Dion's caucus.

You're off by a decade. They came into service in 1995

I don't know where that figure comes from.

Everything I have seen indicates they started in 1985.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Army

1985-2004

You can still buy one if you are fond of it.

http://saintjohn.kijiji.ca/f-iltis-cars-ve...QQKeywordZiltis

1985 Bombardier Iltis Army Jeep
Kijiji: 1985 Bombardier Iltis Army Jeep

This was a First Aid/ Medical vehicle in the army. 39,000kms Stored since purchase from military in 2006. Please call Mark at 657-1866 for more information. Please let us know if you ..

So unless you can show differently than from the article which seems to have the date completely wrong, I am fairly certain that the first delivery of the Iltis started in 1985.

The PCs bear some shame for the initial agreement to buy them. But don't blame me since I'd abandoned them as nothing more than Liberal Party Light by then. However, the purchase was conditional on the Iltis passing the military's testing. They failed miserably, and repeatedly. Whereupon the Liberal government closed the testing range and shipped the job to a private (and more amenable) American testing outfit which passed them. They were a disaster from the start. Btw, if we'd actually bought them off the shelf from the original German manufacturer we would have paid aprox $26k per unit. We wound up paying aprox $84k per unit to build them in Canada. A lesson for those who insist new Canadian warships should be designed and built here.

How early did you abandon the PCs? As early as 1984?

http://www.geocities.com/spoelstra.geo/vw183/

After the completion of the Bundeswehr contracts in October 1981, Volkswagen sold the world-wide manufacturing and marketing rights of the Iltis to Bombardier Inc. of Valcourt, Quebec, Canada, as Volkswagen orientated all its products towards the civilian market.
In 1983 Bombardier advertised the vehicle in the military press as a "state-of-the-art" ½-ton utility vehicle, which could be "equipped with a gasoline or diesel engine".

In 1984 the Canadian Government ordered 1,900 Iltis' to replace the Canadian Forces' M151A2 jeeps then in Regular Canadian Army service (the Canadian Army, Militia (reserves) were equipped with the M38A1CDN jeep.) The order was valued at 68 million Canadian dollars, including spare parts, training, etc. Deliveries were to take place during 1984-1985. The Canadian Iltis was manuafactured in four distinct variants:

Edited June 2, 2008 by jdobbin

madmax · June 2, 2008

Harper is going for an "internal" probe.

I wonder what they will find?

What are the parameters of the investigation.

Will they check out her house? Her Friends? Her background?

Will they ask why she was a "Paid for Girlfriend/spouse" paid by Bernier?

A one year deal?What was in the contract? Free Travel, Documents, security information, Contracts etc.

Or

Will it simply look into his incompetent actions alone. Simple view him as a lonely guy with not up to the job.

http://canadianpress.google.com/article/AL...goZOwxh6zRlqYnQ

Edited June 2, 2008 by madmax

guyser · June 2, 2008

Harper is going for an "internal" probe.

Does Laureen know?

capricorn · June 3, 2008

Here's a different take on the Bernier-Couillard affair.

All this, no matter what secrets were in those files, is actually good news for Canada. The rest of the world may now stop thinking of us as "The Great White Waste of Time" and see us more as a country of action, where politicians not only tell their supporters what to think, but what to wear - and where the country that once had no business in the bedrooms of the nations now might be busy planting bugs in mattresses.
But the biggest beneficiary, in the long run, may be Harper's own stern party.

The talking heads don't always get it right, you know. We all remember how they were running Bill Clinton out of office after that other dress story broke, only to discover that Clinton's approval rating hit an all-time high shortly after the public first heard of those Oval Office trysts with White House intern Monica Lewinsky.

-snip-

And show the country that the Conservative Party of Canada isn't even remotely as tight-assed and uptight and hidebound and boring as we'd all come to believe over these past 2½ years of Tory rule.

Max Bernier may have paid the price for his weaknesses. But it's just possible his party may profit a bit by demonstrating it is, to no small surprise, somewhat human.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/sto...Comment/?query=

Hmmm...MacGregor may have a point. The Conservatives might just in fact be "human". :lol:

BubberMiley · June 3, 2008

The Conservatives might just in fact be "human".

It's true it wouldn't hurt them to appear more fun. The appearance of a sense of humour beyond snide comments about liberals would help too. The Hell's Angels aren't my idea of a fun time, but the cleavage was excellent.

jdobbin · June 3, 2008

Here's a different take on the Bernier-Couillard affair.
Hmmm...MacGregor may have a point. The Conservatives might just in fact be "human".

They certainly are food for thought for a humourist writer.

madmax · June 3, 2008

Does Laureen know?

Topaz · June 3, 2008

Don't believe you. Don't believe her either. It's not that I don't think that sort of thing might happen, but first, that sort of thing has always been illegal. Don't give me any crap about the rules of lobbying changing. That's outright bribery. Second, while outright bribery certainly happens, there are only two people in a room when it does and neither is going to be confessing to a third rate "journalist" with an obsessive compulsive disorder like Cameron.

So even it I got the old book out and was able to quote you examples and backups you won't believe it, so I won't bother. By your reply you are definitely a supporter of Harper and Mulroney and that your choice right or wrong.

madmax · June 3, 2008

We do? Can you name how many resigned over corruption and their names?

Well, here is just one Cabinet Minister... but I bet you get the drift from the headline.

3 Base hit coming.

7th Resignation in Ottawa
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Published: February 21, 1987

LEAD: The Minister of Public Works, Roche LaSalle, has become the seventh member of Prime Minister Brian Mulroney's Cabinet to resign under pressure from allegations of influence-peddling.

The Minister of Public Works, Roche LaSalle, has become the seventh member of Prime Minister Brian Mulroney's Cabinet to resign under pressure from allegations of influence-peddling

You must be young, or didn't pay attention when Mulroney was in Power. You should learn from Harper. Cut your ties to defending Mulroney and RUN AWAY!!!! FAST!!!

Now....

What if Bernier is tied to influence peddling of Outlaw Bikers?

BubberMiley · June 3, 2008

Don't believe you. Don't believe her either.

I believe people who still support the Iraq war have learned that they're better able to believe and not believe what they want despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary by putting their fingers in their ears and shouting "LA LA LA" as loud as they can.

Argus · June 3, 2008

Well, here is just one Cabinet Minister... but I bet you get the drift from the headline.
3 Base hit coming.

You must be young, or didn't pay attention when Mulroney was in Power. You should learn from Harper. Cut your ties to defending Mulroney and RUN AWAY!!!! FAST!!!

Shocking. Can you tell me what he was sentenced to in court after being convicted?

Your statement was : We know that Mulroney years were nothing but corruption and ministers resigning left and right

Now I remember one guy resigned after visiting a strip club, and one for drinking and driving, and one for trying to talk to a judge, but I don't recall this massive corruption during the Mulroney years. Certainly there was nothing which wasn't massively outshone by Jean Chretien and his merry men.

Edited June 3, 2008 by Argus

Topaz · June 3, 2008

Well, here is just one Cabinet Minister... but I bet you get the drift from the headline.
3 Base hit coming.

You must be young, or didn't pay attention when Mulroney was in Power. You should learn from Harper. Cut your ties to defending Mulroney and RUN AWAY!!!! FAST!!!

Now....

What if Bernier is tied to influence peddling of Outlaw Bikers?

Thanks for the help Madmax! Now, can u remind me of the 2 that were re-elected in the last PC election that brought down Mulroney?

Argus · June 3, 2008

So even it I got the old book out and was able to quote you examples and backups you won't believe it, so I won't bother. By your reply you are definitely a supporter of Harper and Mulroney and that your choice right or wrong.

If Cameron actually had any evidence or testimony that a minister asked for X amount of dollars for any reason before proceding with some matter or other the RCMP would have arrested the guy. So while I'd certainly be willing to read it I'm going to assume at this point it will be "anonymous sources".

And while I was glad to see the end of Mulroney I think Chretien was worse.

At the same time, while I'm not in love with Harper, Dion and his bunch of self-righteous whiners are definitely worse.

Wild Bill · June 3, 2008

Can anyone name a Tory scandal worse than Liberal bag men passing envelopes full of millions of dollars OF OUR TAX MONEY! under the table in Montreal restaurants?

Some people seem to have ZERO sense of perspective!