Melanie_

You only look for one element whenever something like this occurs, Lictor. Why do you call this a black-on-white crime, rather than a male-on-female crime? This woman was raped and murdered by a man; skin tone doesn't really come into play. Your Fox news link doesn't work, and Free Republic has all the credibility of toilet paper. I didn't bother with the Youtube link, as Michael has already commented on its worth. But I checked Wikipedia, and it sounds like this crime was a random robbery, not motivated by race. So maybe you could also look for the element of poor-on-rich crime. Murder of Anne Pressly

Oh, I agree. I don't wish scarcity on my kids, who have grown up with an abundance that sometimes embarrasses me. I just want them to know that "there but for the grace of god go I", and to act on that knowledge. Is it such a bad thing to acknowledge that we have extra, and that we can give some of that extra to those who need it? And to acknowledge that the poor in Canada, because they ARE in Canada, already have advantages, so we can direct our efforts elsewhere?

It is about clean drinking water for us. Maybe our roots are more immediate, as my husband immigrated as a young adult, and still has family in Kenya. I don't really want my kids to feel guilty, but rather to have an awareness that there is more beyond their priveleged life in suburbia.

Yes, there are plenty of people who are underprivileged here in Canada, and I'm sure there are in the States as well. But we have a social safety net - if someone is really destitute, they will still recieve medical care, they can still send their kids to school, and there are still programs available to give them a hand up (not a hand out). My taxes already go to them. In other parts of the world, there are no programs available; and because my kids have roots in some of these places, I try to give them a connection to what it might be like for kids there.

Do you see affluenza where you are? I'm just trying to help my kids see that the world is bigger than Winnipeg, and that they have ties to other parts of the world where children not that different from them live in very different circumstances. My kids are visible minorities, with family in developing countries, so it's important to me that they see beyond the privilege they live in.

D'oh! Of course! How silly of me! Thanks, B_C, for such enlightening advice!

The holidays are approaching, so let's bump this thread. This is something I struggle with every year, particularly because my husband is from a developing country. We always give something at Christmas time, but I certainly recognize that I spend excessively on my children and grandchild (soon to be grandchildren - this new baby isn't even born yet and I'm busy buying stuff!). How do we reconcile our "affluenza" in the West?

I'm curious why you would name this thread the end of tolerance. The fact that they are able to stage their demonstration in public signals to me that there is an ample tolerance for diversity. And, if people express their views publicly, those of us who disagree can also do so publicly, which is what you have done here. I would argue that it is a healthy thing to have people express divergent views, whether they be Muslim or even Neo Nazi, so we have the opportunity for dialogue, discussion, and even confrontation when necessary.

Good thing it was removed - it was absolute tripe. The gist of it was that two atheists married and had a child, then the dad killed the mom in front of the child - after all, they were ATHEISTS, what could you expect? The child went to live with a "good Christian family" (cue violins), and then the Christian foster mom took the little girl to CHURCH (violins swell with righteousness). The little girl, about 5 years old, is sitting in Sunday School for the first time when the teacher holds up a picture of JESUS (or at least the current version of what Christians accept as a replication of what Jesus would have looked like 2000 years ago). When asked who this was, the rest of the regular Sunday School attendees were silent, presumably because they didn't have a hot clue, but the girl who had never heard of Jesus said he was the man who held her when her daddy killed her mommy (huge swell of violin music, with accompanying flutes and piano). Of course, this is ABSOLUTE PROOF that Jesus intervened and saved this sweet young soul. Please give me back the 4 minutes of my life I wasted watching this crap.

Man, I must be old. The font is just the right size for me.

Good point, Michael. I didn't realize the voting buttons were tied in to someone's "reputation", which becomes personal - this forum has always opposed personal attacks, so the reputation feature contradicts one of the underlying values of MLW. I see they are disabled now. Dobbin, I hope you reconsider.

Greg, I'm curious about the voting buttons on each post. It seems like a good alternative to replies that basically say "I agree", or just have some smiley faces in response to someone. I tried it out, but I got a pop up box that said I had used up my quota of positive responses for the day, even though it was my first one. Is this a glitch, or is this functionality turned off?

My granddaughter likes the Sesame Street website, and we spent a lot of time this summer watching some of those old Martian clips! We had three generations sitting around the computer screen, laughing uncontrollably, and saying "Yep, yep, yep, yep" to each other.

Well, maybe not the likes of me, personally. I just think it's pretty funny that you think the American president is so omnipotent that he should be able to prevent this kind of thing.

Wow, you have an incredible belief in the power of the American president, no matter who he is. Holding Obama responsible for everything that happens in the world is a pretty myopic viewpoint.

Great song, Gosthacked. Sometimes we can't really figure out the connection - its just enough to know it is there.

Let me try again; I don’t think I was very clear earlier in the thread. It isn’t a matter of nature or nurture; nature works through nurture, and vice versa. So, if an individual (not an entire population) has the right genetics and body type to be a good runner, they still need the conditions to develop that skill to its fullest potential. If they don’t have the right genetics and body type, it doesn’t matter what the conditions are, they aren’t going to be as skilled at that activity as someone who does. My point, though, was that you can’t say that being Kenyan makes you a good runner. There are 31 million people in Kenya, and obviously not all of them are marathoners. It would be like saying everyone in Canada is a good hockey player. Yes, we have some very good hockey players, and we have the conditions to nurture their skills, but there are many of us who could never compete on any kind of level at the sport.

Colorado, Peru, and Tibet are all colder overall then Kenya, so the conditions are different. Kenya is on the equator, and has a dry climate for much of the year. Kenya has a population of over 31 million... how many are runners? If it was genetic, you would expect the entire population to excel in running, rather than just the ones who choose to train.

Nairobi has an elevation of 5450 feet. Kenyan runners do well because they live and train at high altitudes, then compete at low altitudes. It has nothing to do with racial characteristics, its just geography.

American Woman: I don't know a whole lot about the American health care system, but I always thought that veterans and their families were a priority. Someone is deciding where all that money goes, and has decided to put it towards Juliana (although I notice, via Google, that there is a lot of fundraising that gets done as well). I certainly can't answer why the people who make these decisions have decided to fund her procedures and not others. The fact that 47 million Americans have no health care at all is scary - that's more than the entire population of Canada. I understand your point that you wouldn't choose to prolong a life that was filled with pain, and seemed hopeless. But it sounds like Juliana's family doesn't see it as hopeless, and are choosing to continue. You may disagree with their choice, but it is their choice to make.

If the concern is about passing on the genetic trait, why kill Juliana? She is unlikely to ever procreate. Perhaps Lictor's argument should be to kill her sisters, Kendra and Kaitlyn. They are much more likely to pass on the genetic code that could result in another child like Juliana. Maybe the cousins should also be put to death... you never know what they are carrying. In 40% of cases, Treacher Collins Syndrome is the result of a recessive gene on the 5th chromosome; in the other 60%, it is a random mutation. Hmmm, Lictor, what do you think? Do away with Kendra and Kaitlyn, because of what they might be carrying? Restrict their right to have children?

Which opposing argument are we neglecting, Lictor? Because this thread is getting stale - we are rehashing the same things, over and over. What is the new (or perhaps revived) argument you would like discussed?

But you don't pay into that system, and the Americans place a huge value on supporting the people in uniform. You are making a very sweeping statement in saying it is an insult to rational people everywhere - and I question your credentials in speaking on behalf of rational people...

Take it up with the system.

That's the American system. Her medical bills are covered because her father is in the Navy. You know, "Support the Troops". According to the website, her dad has just returned from deployment not long ago - there are many that will argue that his service to his country far outweighs the cost of his child's medical care.