maplesyrup

Ralph Nader announced today that he was entering the US 2004 race for president. Democrats will be most upset because they already blame him for their loss in 2000. I too want George Bush out of the White House but not if he is going to be replaced by same old, same old. The problem with the Democrats is that basically there is no difference them and the Republicans. Nader is running because there is too much power and wealth in too few hands. The Democrats are not adequately addressing this fundamental issue, the most important issue of the campaign. In 2000 Nader ran as a Green candidate and garnered 2.3% of the vote. This time around he is running as an Independent and I expect he will obtain 5% of the total vote. Good on you Ralph Nader. Perhaps after they lose this time the Demaocrats might take a serious look at the huge gap between the rich and the poor. Although I doubt it. Ralph gets my vote.

Please let's just stick to discussing the thread's topic and stop flaming each other. I enjoy reading the debates about the issues but not personal attacks, eh? Tks.

Good day for political junkies Sunday Debate CPAC Tv 2-4 PM (ET) Cross Cda Checkup CBC Radio One 4-6 PM (ET)

Don't know about what the West thinks about Lapierre but there is a story out today getting huge coverage about how all quebec ministers didn't want an inquiry. Have you seen it? I believe this story is planted to try and make Martin look credible. Andrew coyne www.andrewcoyne.com has a good article today in National Post

Feb 21/04 Ipsos-Reid for globe & CTV 1,059 polled Feb 17-19 Cda Bloc 11% CPC 27% Lib 36% NDP 17% green 4% Other 5% BC CPC 33% up 1 Lib 26% down 1 NDP 26 down 1 AB CPC 47 down 11 Lib 28 up 8 NDP 18 up 10 SK/MA CPC 33 up 3 Lib 29 NDP 29 down 5 ON CPC 29 up 3 Lib 46 up 5 NDP 18 down 3 QC Bloc ? CPC 10 unc Lib 30 down 1 NDP 9 up 1 AT CPC 36 up 4 Lib 39 down 8 NDP 18 up 6 Does anyone know Bloc % in Quebec?

I think: Paul Martin was born in the Windsor, ON area, and represents a Quebec riding. Jack Layton was born in Quebec and is running for an Ontario riding. ---------------------------- With latest opinion polls showing the NDP going from 8% to 21% in the polls since Layton took over as leader, I don't think Jack Layton being out of the House of Commons is hurting the NDP, do you?

Maybe this seismic shift in the polls is Canadians wanting to take back their country from big business and put the people back in power.

Those comments about the NDP are quite stale. You can label Conservatives as Mulronities which is also stale. Let's live in today's world. Jack Layton has solid conservative roots - check him out. The details of the polling does show that true to form that Quebeckers are the most astute voters in Canada.

http://www.praxicus.com/Sponsorshipscandal.htm Bloc 13% CPC 28% Lib 36% NDP 21% Oth 2% Jack Layton has said that he is going for government. He may well be on his way.

NDP and Liberals tied http://vancouver.cbc.ca/regional/servlet/V...ollnoon20040218 NDP up, Liberals down, Greens, down, Campbell down Watch for Liberals to give Gordo the boot before next election Canadians don't trust Liberals, I wonder why?

The name changing of political parties is a bit of a joke as a leopard doesn't chnages its stripes To keep track of Reform I just say: Reform 1 (Reform) Rfeorm 2 (Alliance) and now Reform 3 (Conservatives) Since some of the provincial NDP difficulties, the federal NDP has explored changing its name, however as their fortunes have increased recently that may not be such issue for them anymore. Now with this sponsorship scandal I bet some Liberals would like to change the name of their party as well.

The Bloc wins the majority of the seats in Quebec, so what? Charest is there for another 3-4 years, isn't he? And the games will continue, with fewer and fewer people voting each election..

They will try and go with maybe Frank McKenna which will be another big mistake for the Liberals. They haven't really gotten the message yet. They have been fat cats for so long feeding at the trough. Basically what has happened is that big business controls our Canadian government through Martin. Canadians may get angry enough to take it back. That's my hunch, eh?

It's huge. So big they may have to dunp Martin. He's turning out to be a nightmare for the Libs. We'll see. Internal Liberal polling today is even showing worse figures than yesterday down to 30%.

Don't worry, Big business will come in to try and rescue Martin. Their answer will probably be former Premier Frank McKenna which is another big mistake. http://www.bourque.org/ CAPITAL UPHEAVAL: WHO WILL LEAD POST-MARTIN LIBS ? SHOCKER: LIBS PONDER SUCCESSION The governing Liberal Party is nothing, if not pragmatic. Its one and only reason for existence is to govern. Period. Leaders, as a recent succession of leaders have sadly found out along the way, come second ... unless they are potential winners at the ballot box. Bourque can reveal that, as the Party continues to free-fall (internal party numbers now show the Libs at 30%), a growing number of disgruntled Liberals, already unhappy with their leader for a variety of reasons (Chretien/Copps/Rock supporters, still-on-backbench Martinites, sponsorship-shocked trench warriors, ordinary members disgusted by the $1/6 Billion CSL scandal, etc), have begun pondering the imponderable: if not Martin, then who to lead the party into the next election ? The basic issue is this: Martin is a one-trick pony, integrity. If he loses that, he loses the party. A critical mass is forming around the shocking notion that the incumbent leader is a lame duck who will have to go before the next election. Developing ...

Well MP John Bryden who quit the Liberal Party today confirms Canadians' worst fears about PM Paul Martin, doesn't he?

Is Stephen Owen distancing himself from Paul Martin? Liberals slip badly in polls http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/story/...NStory/National The Liberals, headed for an easy election win a week ago, have plummeted into minority-government territory in popular support as most Canadians want to hear the results of an inquiry into the sponsorship scandal before they vote, according to a poll. The survey, done by Ipsos-Reid for The Globe and Mail and CTV, could throw cold water on plans for a spring ballot. Findings deeply disturbing, Auditor-General says Gagliano recalled from Denmark Martin burns Chrétien Liberals plunge in polls Unfairly tarnished in Fraser's report, Montreal firm says It also shows that more Canadians blame former prime minister Jean Chrétien (29 per cent) for the scandal than the present prime minister, Paul Martin (22 per cent). In his first public comments on the week-old controversy yesterday, Mr. Chrétien refused to say whether he would appear before a newly called public inquiry, dismissing reporters' questions by stating that he is out of government. “I don't think any more,” Mr. Chrétien said when asked about his thoughts on the scandal. In the poll, 90 per cent said they would expect Mr. Chrétien to appear before the inquiry to “explain what he knows.” Mr. Martin has already offered to testify. The new survey suggests that the Liberals' 11-year grip on power is in danger despite Mr. Martin's week-long public-relations push to contain the damage. The Liberals have fallen to 35 per cent in popular support, from 39 per cent last week and 48 per cent only four weeks ago. “When you get down in the territory of 35 per cent, you don't win majorities. . . . I don't think there is anybody now who would be seriously advising [Mr. Martin] to go to the polls on this basis, unless he just wants to completely roll the dice,” Mr. Bricker said . Last week's Ipsos-Reid poll was conducted from Tuesday, the day the auditor's report was released, through Thursday. The new poll of 1,055 Canadians was conducted from Wednesday through Sunday. On any given question, it has a 95-per-cent statistical likelihood of accuracy within a margin of error of 3.1 percentage points, upward or downward. The poll also asked 737 people questions about their attitudes on the scandal. It is accurate to within 3.6 percentage points. Two-thirds of respondents, however, said Mr. Martin had to know “something” or “a lot” about the scandal, including who was responsible for the mismanagement of public funds. Sixty-five per cent indicated they want to find out “what happened in the sponsorship program” before an election is called, compared to 32 per cent who preferred an early vote. Mr. Bricker said the message from Canadians is that if Mr. Martin calls an election for early May, as has been expected, it will look as though the Liberals “are trying to hide something.” The public accounts committee of the House has started an investigation into the misuse of funds, and Mr. Martin has ordered a public inquiry to be headed by a judge. Both investigations will take months to reach any definitive conclusion. It will be up to Mr. Martin to decide on the election date, but Public Works Minister Stephen Owen said that Canadians will have to start getting a sense of what happened before the next election. “I'm sure [Mr. Martin] will take into very deep consideration the need of the public to know that these issues are being delved into as stringently as possible,” Mr. Owen said. Mr. Martin toured Quebec yesterday in an attempt to demonstrate that the problem is not specific to the province, recalling corruption charges against the Grant Devine government in the 1980s in Saskatchewan. Mr. Martin was responding to questions about Liberal MP Joe Comuzzi, the new minister of state for economic development in Northern Ontario, who has been quoted as saying the sponsorship scandal “is a Quebec issue and I guess that's how they do politics there.” NDP leader Jack Layton said he's willing to form a minority government with the Liberals if the sponsorship scandal ends up denying the ruling party a majority of parliamentary seats in a spring election. “If the poll lines keep going the way they are going — us up . . . and the Liberals down — then the probability of a minority government increases,” he said. But Mr. Layton says a non-negotiable precondition of any coalition with the Liberals will be holding a national referendum on switching to a new method of electing MPs to Parliament. With reports from Rhéal Séguin, Steven Chase and Tu Thanh Ha

Martin is making things worse Ipsos-Reid CTV/Globe and Mail Released Monday, Febuary 16, 2004 Canada Bloc 11% CPC 27% Lib 35% down 4% NDP 17% BC CPC 32 down 3% Lib 27 NDP 27 up 5% AB CPC 58 Lib 20 down 8% NDP SK/MA CPC 28 Lib 29 down 4% NDP On CPC 26 Lib 41 down 6% NDP QC Bloc 45 CPC 10 Lib 31 down 9% NDP AC CPC 32 Lib 47 up 5% NDP 12 down 7% If anyone is able and wants to fill in the blanks that would be great. Tks. http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...?hub=TopStories

My impression is that we have been well served with a minority overnment. Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely

In other words: Martin makes things worse "In an Ipsos-Reid poll completed for CTV after Prime Minister Paul Martin's weekend public relations blitz, results show the Liberals would only be able to count on 35 per cent of decided voters across the country."

I like this one: As for Mr. Harper, who in the past talked about the defeatist attitude of Atlantic Canadians, Mr. Crosbie said he does not have much support in that region, “and I don't think [he] would do as well there as some other person leading the party.”

Dean was a bit too radical for the establishment so was done in. Dont worry Democrats worst nightmare Nader is coming and he will fix things

I wonder what Scott Brison, Robert Lanctot & Keith Martin are thinking now?

Well......I think Canadians are sick of Martin's Democratic Deficit BS. I was glad to hear that last evening, at the NDP nomination meeting for Toronto Danforth, Jack Layton said if there is a minority government, he will insist on proportional representation for the NDP to prop up a government. He's going to pick up a lot of support for that issue.

If you have elected members from your province in the governing party, you have more chance to influence decisions in Ottawa. I remembrer Chretien visiting BC and someone in BC complained to him about some Liberal policy. Chretien's response was "Vote Liberal then" It's easier to effect change from the inside, I think.