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<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Kinsella carries (or did carry) a lot of weight, its interesting how he's changed recently - remember a couple of years ago on the Alliance website, the "Spinning Warren's Web" someone in the party did a good job of rebutting him. Kinsella was the master of liberal spin. Speaking of who might be in the liberals pay with all the liberal talking points Maybe the liberals are picking up on the Chinese methodology, that of paying party workers to take part in discussion groups such as this, and spreading the party line. In fact, I'm surprised that parties do not have someone on line with a good knowledge and background of all the issues, posting on larger discussion groups, at least during election time.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Got me on that one too, guess my comprehension isn't up to par these days LOL how sanctimonious; Harper: Liberals who blew $100 million on Adscam don’t trust parents with $100 a month for kids

I saw that bit on the news, it caught Martin by surprise. What a putz, and what a mess we are in when we cannot even say Merry Christmas publicly.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Considering that at least 7 million Canadians pay little or no income tax, it means the lowest income earners will get more out of a GST cut. The liberals prior to the election call had promised about 3 times the surplus in spending, how where they going to do it. The CPC is now promising changes and reform: www.conservative.ca Today in Vancouver, Stephen Harper released the Conservative plan of Democratic Reform which will see elected senators, fixed election dates and a cleaner nomination process. “We need sweeping reforms to show Canadians that their national government will not tolerate corruption in the future,” said Mr. Harper. “Cleaning up corruption and restoring accountability is the first step. We also need to vigorously pursue other measures to put Canada back in the forefront of democratic practice.” Elements in the Conservative plan of Democratic Reform include: * Introducing fixed election dates every four years, except when a government loses the confidence of the House; * Establishing a federal process for electing Senators; * Ending “parachute” candidates by requiring that a party’s local candidate has the approval of their constituency associations;

Just like Harper will do anything to get into power... Including trying to "out-Liberal" Paul Martin. Harper's gone directly against just about everything Brian Mulroney stood for....(except Free Trade and Manifest Destiny) like the GST, family allowance, spend, spend, spend, to get votes, rather than profess Conservative ideology.... And why, I had to ask myself is he professing Liberal values to old age pensioners, parents, etc.... Why, to get elected of course.... And then he can implement his social Conservative policies..... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Maybe you could point to the CPC 'social policies' he would implement, exactly which policy- they can be found on the conservative.ca website.

Why do you insist on punishing people who you perceive as having money? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I just got back from a beer and popcorn run... ...and to answer your question: Leftist ideology is about unrelenting class warfare. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Indeed it is, what the leftist idealogy pushes is that all people be equally poor, heaven help anyone who has enough on the ball to make a bit more. Actually this is just more of a deep seated anti-family liberal approach, not to mention double standards, imagine the uprorar if a conservative had said that. Here's a nice little article by Charles Adler http://winsun.canoe.ca/News/Columnists/Adl...14/1351739.html By now you know that Paul Martin's little communications ratter, Scott Reid, has opened up a can of boa constrictors. But if the PM is lucky, and he has been so far, these boas will swallow Reid and avoid deep-throating the big dog himself. "Popcorn and beer" is what brought us here. Reid tried to take a bite out of Stephen Harper's child-care bonus cheques and ended up biting more than he could chew. Reid said the average Canadian wouldn't spend an extra hundred dollars a month on child care. Milk money for little Scotty would more than likely be turned into beer money for those who are watchin' Scotty grow.

Could be, we have to be sensitive to cultural differences you know. Australia did say no to Sharia Law, and were firm about it. I'm surprised at this one.

With the dawn of a new election campaign coinciding with our preparations for the upcoming holiday season, I think it appropriate to give thanks to those that make me proud to be Canadian. I am thankful for Prime Minister Paul Martin, who decided against a proposal to put the campaign off to the New Year. If he had not done so, he would not have had the opportunity to remind us that Christmas is the traditional holiday that nears, not some generic pagan winter festival. May he remember this in Decembers to come. I am thankful for the $2,000,000,000 that has been spent on the gun registry. If this has saved just one life, I am sure it was well worth it. I mean, we could have wasted that kind of cash on a Virginia Class nuclear attack submarine, with enough change left over to buy 40 UH-60 Blackhawk helicopters for our military. Then again, we could have taken 4 million handguns off the streets by simply offering their owners an average of $500 for each weapon. I am thankful the Liberals have kept the Sea King helicopter in the air, or at least for trying to keep them up there. It is always nice to ride in a classic, though there can be a downside. For example, your 1963 Corvette usually does not plummet thousands of feet when it gives up the ghost, and turns you into one. I am thankful that Prime Minister Martin’s boys can still run his old Canadian Steamship Lines while waving flags of convenience overhead to avoid all those nasty regulations and taxes they would be faced with if they were registered in Canada. I am hopeful that my PM might eventually let me drive my car with a licence plate of convenience, say Germany’s, so that I may treat every Canadian highway as my own personal autobahn. I am thankful for the Liberals showing me what true democracy is. Imagine entrusting the unwashed rubes who have yet to make their first million to make the right choice. Thankfully, the millionaires who run things are able to parachute officially unchallenged "star" candidates like new lords of the manor into the constituencies to gladly accept our support, our votes, and our undying fealty. If it was good enough in the 19th century, truly it should be good enough today. I am thankful for the Liberals for showing Canadians, including our impressionable youth, how business is done in this fine nation of ours. Once one unshackles themselves from the chains of ethical behavior and public trust, it is amazing what one is able to accomplish in the name of national unity or simply to line one’s own pockets. Now, if they would only change the laws so the rest of us don’t end up in the slammer for following their enlightened examples. .....more at http://telusplanet.net/public/tmgarj/

Well I'm no gun lover, but making a campaign promise to ban something thats allready banned is a little, well,.....and this isn't the U.S. If they did implement tighter policing at the same time, then its likely that it factored into the statistics.

The NDP imposing/raising taxes eh? What a concept! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, whoda thunk it, the NDP raising taxes

I'm putting this in here because it addresses Alberta, and Adler is on a real roll here LOL http://winsun.canoe.ca/News/Columnists/Adl...07/1341732.html Charles Adler Wed, December 7, 2005 When is Martin declared scary? By CHARLES ADLER As the story goes ... a newspaper reporter from Alberta was drinking with a member of Paul Martin's communication team. Pretty soon the bar talk became trash talk and Paul Martin's pantry boy puked up the following hairball: "Alberta can fellate me." Forgive me, father, for I have sinned. I have misled readers about the language in that bar. No one said "fellate." Sorry for thinking I could blow that one past you. Is this any different than former PM Jean Chretien's musings way back when about how he didn't need Alberta? So what if the language is a little saltier this time? It's the same vulgar principle. If Alberta had half the money and double the population, the Liberals would deliver more TLC than Anna Nicole Smith offers a dying billionaire. Question: If a prime minister wants to pistol-whip a province that doesn't need Ottawa's money, does this enhance national unity. Does it make Paul Martin scary? Lest you think such insults are reserved for Alberta, think again. Jean Lapierre may not have been imbibing Johnny Walker Red, but the PM's designated enforcer in Quebec must have been drunk with perceived power when he tried to a drop a bomb on the Bloc Quebecois. Lapierre said BQ Leader Gilles Duceppe's stump speech in which he got so sauced about his party's electoral chances that he predicted the Liberals would "disappear" was "Nazi-like." Had Lapierrre, Paul Martin's transportation minister, transported himself back to the 1940s and decided that Duceppe was now designing the kind of plan for Liberals that the Designing Fuhrer was drafting for Jews? What's at the heart of Liberal darkness? ....

http://torontosun.canoe.ca/News/Columnists...04/1336349.html This election could be really scary By JOHN CROSBIE This will be Canada's most important and significant election of the 20th or 21st centuries. It will determine whether we can return to a healthy and competitive political system. Since 1935, the Liberal party has governed for 56 of the 71 years, with the Conservatives governing for 15. We have had 12 years of Liberal rule since 1993. As a result, our political system is badly skewed without the competition necessary for a properly functioning and healthy democracy. Already Paul Martin has commenced a campaign concentrating on arousing fears about Stephen Harper's Conservatives. Rather than discussing policy or what his government has done, Martin demonizes Harper. This negative strategy to paint Harper as "scary" is intended to divert public attention away from what is really scary, namely the Liberal failures and mistakes in governing. I find "scary" Martin's government and its Liberal predecessor, which not only failed to properly administer government programs, but permitted AdScam's fraudulent diversion of funds to Liberal friends and party coffers. Two-tier fear

I just had to post this one, its worth a read. http://www.canadianvalues.ca/commentary.aspx?aid=80 Author: Helen Ward Date: Dec 09, 2005 Canada's daycare hoax This week’s announcements, first by Conservative leader Stephen Harper and then by Liberal leader Paul Martin, of their respective party’s approach to daycare has for the first time focused the public’s attention on this important, and yet all too often ignored issue. It’s about time. From the outset the daycare lobby, funded not by parents but by government, unions and corporate elites, has engaged in a campaign of misinformation that has deceived politicians and public alike. Such a campaign has been needed to manufacture consent for what can only be described as an ideologically driven, unmarketable agenda on the part of its proponents. What is this agenda? One need only read the OECD paper An Integrated Approach to Early Childhood Education and Care to find the answer. According to this astonishingly frank document, the goal is to fashion a “new order… (involving) deep changes in societies in general and in the families structure in particular…a review of the family-state relationship regarding the responsibility for the care and education of children.” ( USSR anyone ... my words) To justify imposing this “new order” in Canada, it is first necessary to Canadians that there is a child care crisis in this country. The evidence, however, is otherwise. -snip- If the daycare lobby cared as much about children’s well-being as they do about the economy, they’d be advocating a set of government policies that respects parents and strengthens families. Instead they are pursuing an ideological agenda that threatens to set back equality rights for women as mothers and for children for years to come.

It sure does have an impact if Canadians can't get trained because there are not enough room for them.

G & M <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Its too soon really to know, I only believe the final polls. "The poll found that if an election were held today, 35 per cent would vote Liberal, 29 per cent Conservative, 16 per cent NDP and 13 per cent Bloc. The numbers saw the Conservatives tighten the race somewhat in Ontario, cutting the Liberal lead to seven points from 10. The Liberals, meanwhile, cut the Bloc lead in Quebec from 26 points to 21 points."

Liberals tend to do this when they no longer have anything uselful to say. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> [/quote You noticed !!!

I can attest to that one too, I was active on a riding association for some time, (more than one as we moved) and have been to a lot of meetings and a couple of conventions, met a lot of people from across the country. There are social conservatives in the party, no doubt about it, but they are a minority. Harper himself is a fiscal conservative, in fact one of the reasons he broke with Preston Manning was because of Manning being too strong on 'social issues'. 'That dog don't hunt anymore' So don't take the bait on that one. While we are on the subject (I forget what the topic is now, they all get sidetracked into this one issue, by one poster) Social conservatives, communists yeah, even those scary Christians, have a right to a voice, they have as much right as an atheist or a communist does to take part in democratic proceedings. The day we start telling people they have no right to an opinion or to take part in any political process, is the death of democracy.

Hmmm, if some of those 'old and confused' voters start to pick up on this it could be fun. This story seems to be gaining some traction. CARP has a lot of members, wonder if they are all aware of what was said.

Guess they couldn't use 'the finger' instead of the boot

This doesn't seem right, that many spots going out of country when we have a shortage at home. http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...51018/20051011/ Foreign medical trainees leaving Canadians out Kathy Tomlinson, CTV News The government of Saudi Arabia sent him here to become a top-notch trauma surgeon, all expenses paid. When Dr. Khaled Al-Ahmadi finishes his three years of Canadian hospital training, he will go home and take his badly-needed skills with him. Buying extra training in Canada is Saudi Arabia's way of trying to fix their doctor shortage. "The need for doctors is growing there (Saudi Arabia). The need is really growing I mean the number of Saudi doctors is still low," said Dr. Al-Ahmadi. Since the late 1970s, Canadian medical schools have been selling an increasing number of hospital residency positions to foreign countries, primarily Saudi Arabia. The medical schools charge about $40,000 a year for each spot, enough to cover the training expenses. Six hundred Saudi Arabian doctors are now getting their residency training in the Canadian system, along with some 300 from other countries. That represents about 10 per cent of all residency spots. "I'm grateful for Saudi Arabia and I feel grateful for Canada," said Dr. Al-Ahmadi, "Here I learn I practice and I serve the (Canadian) community at the same time." Because of the severe doctor shortage in Canada, though, some doctors are starting to object. "We have failed to provide our own system with the capacity to train our own medical graduates," says Dr. Alex Chochinov, an emergency room doctor in Winnipeg, "I look forward to the day when governments supply medical faculties with the funds and the resources necessary to provide training for a sufficient number of Canadians so we can look to other countries and say we don't need your trainees."

There's another article here on CARP, its beginning to look more serious, IMHO http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/stor...09?hub=CanadaAM CTV.ca News Staff Allegations of leaks in his department have put Finance Minister Ralph Goodale on the hot seat in the middle of an election campaign, and put the director of a seniors' organization in an uncomfortable spotlight. The Liberals were caught off guard Wednesday night, when Bill Gleberzon, the Director of Government & Media Relations for Canada's Association for the Fifty Plus (CARP), told CTV News he got a phone call on the morning of Nov. 23, alerting him to an announcement later that day from the finance minister's office. That call came several hours before Goodale announced that the federal government had decided not to change its stand on income trusts but would increase the tax credit on corporate dividends. In the hours before the official announcement, there was heavier-than-usual trading in income trusts and dividend-paying stocks. That has fuelled speculation that some investors profited from an early warning. "The day they made the announcement they phoned us and said something is going to be said," Gleberzon, told CTV News Wednesday nigh

<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Its not a bad thing, but we are talking spin here. In order to promote a national day care plan, the other view has to be manipulated and demonized. Stay at home parents should be given equal opportunity. If anyone has seen the sub standard care in state funded, inspected seniors homes, then it would sure give you pause for concern. Imagine,, young kids left in dirty diapers because there's a shortage of staff, and don't forget government centres tend generally only cover the bare mimum standards.

I think most people recognize this for what it is, a political stunt. According to their announcement, the National Handgun Ban will cost $30 million over five years..., so if we convert this using Liberal math as shown by the gun registry, the actual cost will be $15 BILLION!!..., and, oh by the way, not a single urban gangster wannabe is going to turn in his Glok or nickel plated Colt.45 pimp wand and more innocent bystanders will die. But, as long as this little stunt gets the liberal vote - thats okay.

Personally I have yet to see anyone as intolerant and self righteous as the current crop of liberals who think they have a divine right to rule. Liberal-tolerance is an oxymoron these days.

Harper was not trapped by the media on this one: he deliberately made a statement when he did not have to. Harper could have made a clear statement that he would not let his gov't get side tracked by a divisive issue like SSM because there are too many other more important issues that need to be addressed. Such a statement would not have to be a lie, would not require him to say that he agrees that SSM is ok, and (most importantly) would have put to issue to rest for the campaign. Agreed, however, in this campaign I see the vote shifting to which ever side is most likely to get a majority and a early lead for the Liberals is a not good for the CPC. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Your right, Harper was not trapped by the media, it was a planned announcement, better to get it up front in order to avoid accusations of hidden agendas, but when that doesn't work, then I guess they spin it out anyway they can. Its the polls during the last week that count, and that depends on the wording, the Liberals are known for the push polling.