buffycat Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 Do you guys ever miss the point: Despite what one might think of Ahmedinejad, he hasn't said what he is being quoted as saying. Period. That is the whole point. Not whether he is a nutbar or fruitcake or boogeyman... simply that what is attributed to him ad nauseum is NOT what he actually said. Duh. Quote "An eye for an eye and the whole world goes blind" ~ Ghandi
M.Dancer Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 Despite what one might think of Ahmedinejad, he hasn't said what he is being quoted as saying. Period. Duh. So what the Iranian news agency says he is saying, he isn't really saying, is that what you are saying? Duh indeed....... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
White Doors Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 Do you guys ever miss the point:Despite what one might think of Ahmedinejad, he hasn't said what he is being quoted as saying. Period. That is the whole point. Not whether he is a nutbar or fruitcake or boogeyman... simply that what is attributed to him ad nauseum is NOT what he actually said. Duh. Umm.. that was an english persian paper. If that's not what he did say, then please enlighten us all. unreal. take the blinders off buffy cat. There is no jew behind that tree ready to jump out on you. Quote Those Dern Rednecks done outfoxed the left wing again.~blueblood~
buffycat Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 Follow the conversation Mr Doors. wiped off the map - NOT said annahilate Israel - not said. Does Ahmendinejad dislke the Israeli government - YOU BET. No argument there, as it's plain to see. BUT he didn't say what he is being accused of. He is talking about the REGIME - not threatening genocide against the Jews for crying out loud. You go and get your blinders removed! Quote "An eye for an eye and the whole world goes blind" ~ Ghandi
M.Dancer Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 Lets argue about which euphemisms for the destruction of Israel that best descibes Irans current position. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
M.Dancer Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 BUT he didn't say what he is being accused of. He is talking about the REGIME - not threatening genocide against the Jews for crying out loud. Holy Christ! Israel is a democratic nation whose Government is elected by the universal and free suffrage of its citizens. The only way to destroy the "zionist regime" is to destroy the zionists, which happen to be 90% of the population. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
M.Dancer Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 Old news.......still current TEHRAN 14 Dec. (IPS) One of Iran’s most influential ruling cleric called Friday on the Muslim states to use nuclear weapon against Israel, assuring them that while such an attack would annihilate Israel, it would cost them "damages only"."If a day comes when the world of Islam is duly equipped with the arms Israel has in possession, the strategy of colonialism would face a stalemate because application of an atomic bomb would not leave any thing in Israel but the same thing would just produce damages in the Muslim world", Ayatollah Ali Akbar Hashemi-Rafsanjani told the crowd at the traditional Friday prayers in Tehran. http://www.iran-press-service.com/articles...eats_141201.htm Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Rue Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 "So, which thing did Aminijihad actually say? Destruction of Israel, or destruction of the regime in Israel? " Figleaf you make an excellent point. That destruction and destroying of the Zionist regime won't kill any Israeli citizens or Jews world-wide or for that matter Israelis who are not Jewish. Yes Figleaf the nuclear bomb will srrategically only kill the Israeli politicians and their buildings and not touch the civilians who willo be free to join a Muslim theocracy in that area once the bombs are finished their strategical strikes. Thanks Figleaf. Once again you have reminded me not to get all hysterical and keep things in perspective. Quote
Rue Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 BUT he didn't say what he is being accused of. He is talking about the REGIME - not threatening genocide against the Jews for crying out loud. Holy Christ! Israel is a democratic nation whose Government is elected by the universal and free suffrage of its citizens. The only way to destroy the "zionist regime" is to destroy the zionists, which happen to be 90% of the population. Get out. You figure? You mean they don't want to kill Israeli civilians or say Jews in the rest of the world? Get out. Figleaf doesn't think so. Golly I am confused. Quote
Rue Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 "Relax. You're not anti-Semitic, since you love Arabs. You're simply a Jew-hater." Actually I personally do not think Figleaf hates Jews. I really don't. I think he is very anti-Israeli to the point of being absurd, but as much as I find Figleaf's opinions repugnant I would with due seriousness say Figleaf is not making negative disparaging comments about Jews as a people as do some of his colleagues when they post. I have never once felt Figleaf has attacked me for being Jewish when he makes his comments. I really don't. I can't stand his opinions but I have never felt for a second he has deliberately meant to be anti-semitic as are come of his Israel poo poo buddies when they make certain comments. I really do think Figleaf is a gentleman and I appreciate that although he may not know it given my absolute and utter disagreement with virtually everything he says. However JBG I do concede Fig's trying to engage in a game of semantics to defend what Iran said or suggest it is Israel's fault is absurd. But then what would a day be on these posts without an Israel poo poo message. And yes JBG it is your fault Iran is saying what it says. I mean as a Zionist why can't you just get the Israeli regime to leave and tell those silly Jews in Israel to go away. Didn't Higgly say in a previous post that New York is a Jewish state. Why can't they go there like he says. I mean really. Seriously JBG, this latest round of comments the DancingDude referred to makes me concede to you on a previous point you made to me about Iran and I took the liberal moderate approach to. I did say to you JBG that I did not think Israel should engage in a preemptive strike and that much of the rhetoric from Iran was simply a smole screen to dettract from its seerious internal economic problems or sable rattle. However JBG I am now very worrried because unlike before, the Council of Clerics in Iran backed the statements and when read in conjunction with other articles and speeches being sent through-out the Middle East, these latest comments signal a new message for Hezbollah and Shiite extremists to go full speed ahead with terror. Do I think Iran is nuts enough to use a nuclear weapon against Israel. After the last speech yes. Would I sit around and wait for them to have nuclear bombs, no. Not after the last speech. I really regret this. Because it is precisely this kinds of comments that will set the stage for a preemotive strike as Sharkdude already said. I really also think JBG it is only a matter of time until we read a post on this forum that this is all an elaborate Zionist plot to justify bombing Iran and that this nut case President is really a Zionist oeprative. Hasn't that been the constant theme of these posts. That when someone threatens to destroy Israel, they are really Zionist operatives or if they are not, they don't want to kill Israelis, just their government. Oh brother. If I was China which has the biggest financial interest in Iran and depends heavily on its natural gas, I would stop being the moral hippocrate and coward of a nation I am and step up to the plate and tell Iran to cool it or else. Then again China has enabled the genocide to continue in Sudan because of its blind and total support of Sudan so why should it say anything now. Russia and Turkey have already made a secret agreement with Israel to stay out of this if they engage in a preemptive attack. I also think for these Israel poo poo people they should understand Iran's comments are not just directed at Israel, they in fact send a message to the Sunni Muslim world that Iran wants to establish its ideology across the Middle East. This is not simply anti-Zionist, this is rhetoric challenging all of the Middle East. These kinds of comments are as worrisome for Jordan, Lebanon, Syria, Egypt, Saudi Arabia as they are Israel. The nuclear fall out will kill their people too. Quote
Figleaf Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 "Relax. You're not anti-Semitic, since you love Arabs. You're simply a Jew-hater."Actually I personally do not think Figleaf hates Jews. I really don't. I think he is very anti-Israeli to the point of being absurd, but as much as I find Figleaf's opinions repugnant I would with due seriousness say Figleaf is not making negative disparaging comments about Jews as a people as do some of his colleagues when they post. I have never once felt Figleaf has attacked me for being Jewish when he makes his comments. I really don't. I can't stand his opinions but I have never felt for a second he has deliberately meant to be anti-semitic as are come of his Israel poo poo buddies when they make certain comments. I really do think Figleaf is a gentleman and I appreciate that although he may not know it given my absolute and utter disagreement with virtually everything he says. Thank you for speaking up. It means a lot to me. However JBG I do concede Fig's trying to engage in a game of semantics to defend what Iran said or suggest it is Israel's fault is absurd. I disagree. I am pointing out that the game of semantics is being played in the media when it deliberately misinforms us about Abduljihad's statements. I don't doubt Abjectjihad hates Israel and is no friend of the western world. I just think that this fact doesn't change what is a true comment about him and what is a false comment about him. And I decidely oppose warmongering on the strength of false representations (which we already saw lead to the Iraq debacle and now are being deployed to drive an attack into Iran). Quote
Figleaf Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 BUT he didn't say what he is being accused of. He is talking about the REGIME - not threatening genocide against the Jews for crying out loud. Holy Christ! Israel is a democratic nation whose Government is elected by the universal and free suffrage of its citizens. The only way to destroy the "zionist regime" is to destroy the zionists, which happen to be 90% of the population. Get out. You figure? You mean they don't want to kill Israeli civilians or say Jews in the rest of the world? Get out. Figleaf doesn't think so. Golly I am confused. There's an interesting double standard ... You both seem to think it's possible for western powers to make war on a regime but not on the people, but the same approach is impossible for anyone else. Quote
White Doors Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 Follow the conversation Mr Doors.wiped off the map - NOT said annahilate Israel - not said. Does Ahmendinejad dislke the Israeli government - YOU BET. No argument there, as it's plain to see. BUT he didn't say what he is being accused of. He is talking about the REGIME - not threatening genocide against the Jews for crying out loud. You go and get your blinders removed! I see.. so that is perfectly ok with yuo then? What he said was cool? LOL Quote Those Dern Rednecks done outfoxed the left wing again.~blueblood~
southerncomfort Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 Follow the conversation Mr Doors. wiped off the map - NOT said annahilate Israel - not said. Does Ahmendinejad dislke the Israeli government - YOU BET. No argument there, as it's plain to see. BUT he didn't say what he is being accused of. He is talking about the REGIME - not threatening genocide against the Jews for crying out loud. You go and get your blinders removed! I see.. so that is perfectly ok with yuo then? What he said was cool? LOL Seems that way can't believe I'm reading this crap and spin on amansheens tirade. The three amigos on here must be the only ones spinning his words cos every news piece I've read says the same thing all boils down to one thing any way you cut it. Talk about fools rushing in. Ahmadinejad says clock ticking to Israel's 'destruction' http://www2.aljazeera.com/news/newsfull.ph...=937303/06/2007 :15:05 AM GMT Comments (3) Add a comment TEHRAN (AFP) - Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said on Sunday that a countdown has begun that will end with the "destruction" of Israel by the people of Lebanon and Palestine. TEHRAN (AFP) - Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said on Sunday that a countdown has begun that will end with the "destruction" of Israel by the people of Lebanon and Palestine. Quote
JerrySeinfeld Posted June 5, 2007 Report Posted June 5, 2007 According to this news source, he said Israel: Also so it on the ticker tape on CNN. http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/i...Type=RSS&rpc=22 TEHRAN (Reuters) - Iran's president said on Sunday the Lebanese and the Palestinians had pressed a "countdown button" to bring an end to Israel. President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, who triggered outrage in the West two years ago when he said Israel should be "wiped off the map", has often referred to the destruction of the Jewish state but says Iran is not a threat. "With God's help, the countdown button for the destruction of the Zionist regime has been pushed by the hands of the children of Lebanon and Palestine," Ahmadinejad said in a speech. "By God's will, we will witness the destruction of this regime in the near future," he said. He did not elaborate. Well, see, that's just the reason I had to ask. This report restates the false reports of two years ago saying that he said Israel should be wiped off the map. Thing is, HE DIDN'T SAY THAT. (He said it 'should vanish from the pages of history' or something like that.) And then, when it actually quotes his latest statement, in fact, HE DOES NOT appear to say that the destruction of Isreal is coming, he says the regime. [so, Scribby, you were wrong on that, too.] The Israel apologists are continually lying about what Ahmedjihad says. Yes - and we all know from the lessons in Iraq that regime change doesn't necessarily mean the destruction of a country and ...er.....wait a minute here Quote
Figleaf Posted June 7, 2007 Report Posted June 7, 2007 ...every news piece I've read says the same thing all boils down to one thing any way you cut it. Every news piece cited so far on this thread has a headline that says 'Israel' and then inside has a quote that says the 'regime'. The two are not the same. Amenjihad is being subjected to quite blatant distortion. Quote
White Doors Posted June 7, 2007 Report Posted June 7, 2007 ...every news piece I've read says the same thing all boils down to one thing any way you cut it. Every news piece cited so far on this thread has a headline that says 'Israel' and then inside has a quote that says the 'regime'. The two are not the same. Amenjihad is being subjected to quite blatant distortion. I see. Poor misunderstood Amenjihad then right? No one understands him? well I feel better! thanks figgie! LOL Quote Those Dern Rednecks done outfoxed the left wing again.~blueblood~
scribblet Posted June 7, 2007 Author Report Posted June 7, 2007 What about this that was posted earlier from Al Jazeera....that doesn't count or AJ got it wrong too. Quote Hey Ho - Ontario Liberals Have to Go - Fight Wynne - save our province
buffycat Posted June 7, 2007 Report Posted June 7, 2007 What about this that was posted earlier from Al Jazeera....that doesn't count or AJ got it wrong too. did you click on the link? Al Jazeerah.com is not AlJazeerah.net Nor did I find the related article from which the quotes were taken. Granted I didn't look too hard Quote "An eye for an eye and the whole world goes blind" ~ Ghandi
downtoit Posted June 7, 2007 Report Posted June 7, 2007 http://www2.aljazeera.com/news/newsfull.php?newid=9373 I found this, it is an Arabic magazine so should be okay so why would you not want to look, don't want to see the truth? I would bet that ajnet would not report on it at all. What you and others are doing is just twisting reality to pretend that there is no a significant number of radical Islamists around the world who do want to destroy civilization as we know it,and in some cases, have stated their cause. That is, Sharia law and a caliphate Hizb-ut-Tahrir is one group which wants worldwide Sharia law http://www.forum18.org/Archive.php?article_id=170&printer=Y I believe this group has been banned in Britain, there are others who are like minded. Quote
Rue Posted June 7, 2007 Report Posted June 7, 2007 For those of you playing this pathetic game that the President of Iran is only talking about destroying the Israeli regime and not Israelis so its o.k. and he's being distorted and victimized and he really is a nice man he just wants to destroy the regime nothing else, here read and in particular read the last quote. Your attempt to try spin this hatred into not being hatred by trying to argue using the word "regime" makes it acceptable is utter bull-shit. For those of us who bother to keep track of the many comments this mad man makes we do not selectively ignore certain comments and pretend the rest are only directed at the "regime". Figleaf read particularly the last quote. Enough with the semantic bull-shit attempt to spin this man's hatred and sterilize it. "A new Middle East will prevail without the existence of Israel." Bemama Makaysian News Agency, Sept, 2006 “Are they human beings?... They (Zionists) are a group of blood-thirsty savages putting all other criminals to shame." , August 2, 2006, Iranian television "The Zionists think that they are victims of Hitler, but they act like Hitler and behave worse than Genghis Khan." Iranian News Agency, July 16, 2006 "The Zionists and their protectors are the most detested people in all of humanity, and the hatred is increasing every day." "The worse their crimes, the quicker they will fall." "[israel] has blackened the pages of history". 3 above quotes from Iran television, July 13, 2006 (as quoted by Iranian state television) "I think we have sufficiently talked about this matter and these Holocaust events need to be further investigated by independent and impartial parties." "An event that has influenced so many diplomatic and political equations of the world needs to investigated and researched by impartial and independent groups." "If it is true, then the response to this question should not be solved in Palestine. The Palestinian question should be settled as soon as possible. If it is false, why should such measures be taken against the people of Palestine?" all of the above quoted at news conference July 13, 206 after meeting with China’s President "I believe the German people are prisoners of the Holocaust. More than 60 million were killed in World War II . . . The question is: Why is it that only the Jews are at the center of attention?" "We say that if the Holocaust happened, then the Europeans must accept the consequences and the price should not be paid by Palestine. If it did not happen, then the Jews must return to where they came from." interview with Germany's Der Spiegel magazine, May 28, 2006 Quote
Figleaf Posted June 8, 2007 Report Posted June 8, 2007 So what about it figleaf?Iran: Israel's Demise Imminent TEHRAN (Fars News Agency)- Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad on Sunday said that the demise of the Zionist regime (of Israel) is imminent. Iran also said Sunday it would work to settle disputes over its nuclear program if its case went back to the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA). Ahmadinejad said last summer's war between Israel and Hezbollah showed for the first time that the "hegemony of the occupier regime (Israel) had collapsed, and the Lebanese nation pushed the button to begin counting the days until the destruction of the Zionist regime." "God willing, in the near future we will witness the destruction of the corrupt occupier regime," Ahmadinejad was quoted by IRNA as saying during a speech to foreign guests mostly from African, Arab and neighboring countries who attended ceremonies marking the 18th anniversary of the departure of the Late Founder and Father of the Islamic Republic of Iran, Imam Khomeini. Would you like to make an excuse for him now or would yo like to condemn him like any sane person should? We are waiting. Waiting for what? All the quotes there confirm what I've said. Achmetjihad said 'regime', not 'Israel'. But I don't get why you have this weird need to be upset with me. You want me to 'condemn' him ... okay, do you want me to condemn him for things he really said, or things he didn't say? Either way, why do you need MY condemnation? As for making excuses for him, I really think you need to learn what words mean before you use them. I haven't stated any judgements or excuses, I've merely pointed out facts. It seems to me that if Armedjihad is the devil incarnate it should be sufficient to condemn him using what he actually says rather than making stuff up. Quote
Figleaf Posted June 8, 2007 Report Posted June 8, 2007 For those of you playing this pathetic game that the President of Iran is only talking about destroying the Israeli regime and not Israelis so its o.k. ... My goodness! I'm sure I didn't say (or suggest) the sentiment "its o.k.". Quote
White Doors Posted June 8, 2007 Report Posted June 8, 2007 Either way, why do you need MY condemnation? Because you CLAIM to be impartial and I just wanted to point out that you are not. I didn't think it would be this easy, but thank you for your cooperation in proving your agenda. tata Quote Those Dern Rednecks done outfoxed the left wing again.~blueblood~
kuzadd Posted June 8, 2007 Report Posted June 8, 2007 figleaf: Either way why do you need my condemnation? Oh, oh there, You've gone and done it Figleaf! Ask a simple question of whitedoors, and it becomes construed as "proof" of something? it's a game whitedoor likes to play. Childish really? One would have to wonder, why whitedoors feels he/she needs to "prove" something, or works so hard to "prove" something? perhaps an inadequacy elsewhere? I don't know, but I found it odd, to say the least. tata dahling! Quote Insults are the ammunition of the unintelligent - do not use them. It is okay to criticize a policy, decision, action or comment. Such criticism is part of healthy debate. It is not okay to criticize a person's character or directly insult them, regardless of their position or actions. Derogatory terms such as "loser", "idiot", etc are not permitted unless the context clearly implies that it is not serious. Rule of thumb: Play the ball, not the person (i.e. tackle the argument, not the person making it).
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