What happens to Crown Attorney’s that are found to have committed MALI

[beatenwoman2005]

I am wondering what the OPINION is regarding Crown Attorney's that are found guilty of Malicious prosecution?

Should the tax payer's pick up the TAB for their legal representation, should they pick up the tab if they are found guilty?

I can accept if a crown is found NOT GUILTY of malicious prosecution, but if they are not, what is the ramification of this? Or does the "SYSTEM" provide EXCUSES for them and ABSORB the costs provincially, or federally?

Where does it end? Should the tax payers CONTINUE to pay for deliberate acts? Are Crown Attorney's ever criminally charged for OBSTRUCTING justice?

Should they be held accountable for their actions both financially, and CRIMINALLY?

Come on people, I want to hear from SOME CROWN'S on here.

[ScottSA]

Huh?

[beatenwoman2005]

Huh?

And that is how it all starts with prosecutions....

[iamcanadian2]

Lawyers in Canada are not accountable for anything they do. Canada has no functional systems of proper control over their abuses of power they are given by silly and senseless rules created to maintain an unecessary monopoly profession.

The legal profession in Canada is less honorable than crack addicted gutter whores.

Law in Canada is strictly business. It's a money addicted profession where the objective is to rob from the poor and give to the rich.

The immoral and unethical legal system that has been created in Canada by unsupervised lawyers and non-elected judges/lawyers is the equivalent of a modern day Sodom and Gamorah. As such the system can be scrapped, its rules of Civil Proceedures properly torn up and used as toilet paper.

Corruption is rampant throughout the system. Lawyers get in bed with each other and also with the Judges to pilfer and rape ALL members of the public that enter their domain. There is no honour or integrity in the system and there are no systems or practices to create honour or accountability. In fact the opposite condition holds true, in that the system functions to WEED OUT those with honour and integrity so that the most vile, unethical and incompetent advance.

[fellowtraveller]

OP, did you know that your CAPS key is sticking sometimes?

[geoffrey]

Lawyers in Canada are not accountable for anything they do. Canada has no functional systems of proper control over their abuses of power they are given by silly and senseless rules created to maintain an unecessary monopoly profession.

The legal profession in Canada is less honorable than crack addicted gutter whores.

It seems like you destroy your crediability more and more even time you open your mouth. That's a pretty ridiculous statement to make, one that I strongly disagree with. I've worked with many lawyers in the past few years and they'll all be highly ethical people from my perspective.

Sounds like you got a legal bill you didn't like or something?

[beatenwoman2005]

OP, did you know that your CAPS key is sticking sometimes?

I do not have my caps lock on; I am raging and EXPRESSING my words in UPPER CASE.

[Slavik44]

Lawyers in Canada are not accountable for anything they do. Canada has no functional systems of proper control over their abuses of power they are given by silly and senseless rules created to maintain an unecessary monopoly profession.

The legal profession in Canada is less honorable than crack addicted gutter whores.

Law in Canada is strictly business. It's a money addicted profession where the objective is to rob from the poor and give to the rich.

The immoral and unethical legal system that has been created in Canada by unsupervised lawyers and non-elected judges/lawyers is the equivalent of a modern day Sodom and Gamorah. As such the system can be scrapped, its rules of Civil Proceedures properly torn up and used as toilet paper.

Corruption is rampant throughout the system. Lawyers get in bed with each other and also with the Judges to pilfer and rape ALL members of the public that enter their domain. There is no honour or integrity in the system and there are no systems or practices to create honour or accountability. In fact the opposite condition holds true, in that the system functions to WEED OUT those with honour and integrity so that the most vile, unethical and incompetent advance.

If the legal profession in Canada is strictly a money grab profession, then we have a serious problem, Lawyers really suck at their profession, because the average un-educated Albertan oil field worker could pull just as much cash if not more, for a starting salary, as almost any recent law school graduate.

Sure lawyers are well paid, 7 years of school and a professional degree usually gets you that and it should, But Lawyers are far from being in any sort of class of their own when it comes to salaries, I think maybe you are confusing Top U.S Law salaries with Canadian Salaries, which are decent and allow for a good living, but not spectacular in any sense of the word.

Likewise your Canada-wide universal lawyer dirtbag conspiracy theory is kind of undermined by the fact that about half of lawyers in Canada are self employed. Sure making fun of lawyers is great fun, but a representation of a new sodom and gamorah, or crack addicted gutter whore, makes your sensationalist analogies about as valuable as what is on the toilet paper after I use it.

Maybe canadian legal salaries are so, realtively, low because they are doing what you say, robbing from the poor. What kind of idiot robs from the poor? What are you going to steal? A box of macaroni? Do they still have those hockey cards on the back of the box?

See your post wouldn't be so bad, if it was to focus on arguing for an outside investigative ethics body. It reminds me of those posts about police officers who eat babies, and thats why we need independant bodies and boards of the police profession. Its tough because I might in part agree with the conclusion, but it is completely childish in the treatment of the profession and the many good people who do work in the profession.

[ScottSA]

OP, did you know that your CAPS key is sticking sometimes?

I do not have my caps lock on; I am raging and EXPRESSING my words in UPPER CASE.

If you bold and italicize every alternate word, then throw in an occasional uppercase word, your raging will roar even louder. Coloring each alternate letter in the upper case words may also accentuate the angst.

[beatenwoman2005]

If you bold and italicize every alternate word, then throw in an occasional uppercase word, your raging will roar even louder. Coloring each alternate letter in the upper case words may also accentuate the angst.

I would just like to say how funny it is that you would take the time to give me instruction in a forum that is not relevant to the thread. You can always send a message instead of hijacking the thread, perhaps this is to divert from the issue?

Now back on topic.

See your post wouldn't be so bad, if it was to focus on arguing for an outside investigative ethics body. It reminds me of those posts about police officers who eat babies, and thats why we need independant bodies and boards of the police profession. Its tough because I might in part agree with the conclusion, but it is completely childish in the treatment of the profession and the many good people who do work in the profession.

What type of outside ivestigative body should be developed to over-see these issues? The ones that are in place at this moment are not doing their jobs. It has been proven time after time. For some reason the powers that are now in place that deal with these ethic's are not doing what they were designed to do.

The government see's it, the tax payers see it, all see it; but who is taking up the torch to fix it? I am outside of this world of ethic bodies and I have dealt with them. It is very clear to me what they are designed to do; protect the existing bodies and protect those who are being complained about. They do nothing.

[iamcanadian2]

Likewise your Canada-wide universal lawyer dirtbag conspiracy theory is kind of undermined by the fact that about half of lawyers in Canada are self employed. Sure making fun of lawyers is great fun, but a representation of a new sodom and gamorah, or crack addicted gutter whore, makes your sensationalist analogies about as valuable as what is on the toilet paper after I use it.

Maybe canadian legal salaries are so, realtively, low because they are doing what you say, robbing from the poor. What kind of idiot robs from the poor?

This deserves several responses. Lawyers in Canada are lower in honour and integrity than crack addicted gutter whores. The profession is self regulated so that we have crack addicted gutter whores regulating the other crack addicted gutter whores plying their wares in the streets (i.e. dealing with the public). On top of this we have non-elected judges who are asked to be judges after being only lawyers and having the requisite 7 years of schooling. Schooling that by the way none can ever fail since you can be severely intelectually retarded and still pass all of the criteria. Lawyering is the easies of all academic studies and requires no intelect at all to master to the point of being called to the bar.

A brilliant lawyer is only a crooked and unethical one who is able to main his licence to practice while screwing everyone they can.

I now turn to your observation of my painting the entire profession with one very wide and all encompasing brush. This is because the profession has lumped all types of lawyers into one generic term "lawyer" at least in Canada and they all want to be part of that class.

It was not always this way and there where distinct legal professionals with different functions. Lawyers, Solicitors, and Barristers. Each has different traning and provided different services to the public. Today their are happy to all be lawyers so let the crap that pours out of one group inundate the whole lot untill they distinguish themselves by breaking up the profession into distinct types. Till then they should all be equally dispised and shat on whenever one gets the chance.

Finally, the Judge is not a proper person to be appointed in any legitimate society and should always be an elected possition so that what they do can also be judge by society. This GRAP about men with honour and integrity miraculously getting picked into being Judges for life and that by being above the law and above accountability this is somehow good for society is nothing but HOGWASH.

"I cannot accept .... that we are to judge Pope and King (or Judges) unlike other men, with a favorable presumption that they did no wrong. If there is any presumption it is the other way against holder of power, increasing as the power increases. Historic responsibility has to make up for the want of legal responsibility. Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely. There is no worse heresy than that the office sanctifies the holder of it. " Lord Acton

[guyser]

This deserves several responses.

Yes it does. And when one resembling something along the lines of truth comes along, be sure to read it.

Lawyers in Canada are lower in honour and integrity than crack addicted gutter whores. The profession is self regulated so that we have crack addicted gutter whores regulating the other crack addicted gutter whores plying their wares in the streets (i.e. dealing with the public).

blah

blah blah

up for the want of legal responsibility. Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely. There is no worse heresy than that the office sanctifies the holder of it. " Lord Acton

You do like crack addicted gutter whores dont you?

Id love to see you say that to a lawyer, face to face.

[iamcanadian2]

You do like crack addicted gutter whores dont you?

Id love to see you say that to a lawyer, face to face.

Why should that be so difficult?.... Most lawyers are also chikenshit cowards as well as being unethical bullies. When they can't abuse their professional powers to take advantage of others unethically they run from people that stand up to them. No honour, no integrity and cowardly bullies and thugs to boot. They deserve no respect from the rest of the population.

[FTA Lawyer]

Likewise your Canada-wide universal lawyer dirtbag conspiracy theory is kind of undermined by the fact that about half of lawyers in Canada are self employed. Sure making fun of lawyers is great fun, but a representation of a new sodom and gamorah, or crack addicted gutter whore, makes your sensationalist analogies about as valuable as what is on the toilet paper after I use it.

Maybe canadian legal salaries are so, realtively, low because they are doing what you say, robbing from the poor. What kind of idiot robs from the poor?

This deserves several responses. Lawyers in Canada are lower in honour and integrity than crack addicted gutter whores. The profession is self regulated so that we have crack addicted gutter whores regulating the other crack addicted gutter whores plying their wares in the streets (i.e. dealing with the public). On top of this we have non-elected judges who are asked to be judges after being only lawyers and having the requisite 7 years of schooling. Schooling that by the way none can ever fail since you can be severely intelectually retarded and still pass all of the criteria. Lawyering is the easies of all academic studies and requires no intelect at all to master to the point of being called to the bar.

A brilliant lawyer is only a crooked and unethical one who is able to main his licence to practice while screwing everyone they can.

I now turn to your observation of my painting the entire profession with one very wide and all encompasing brush. This is because the profession has lumped all types of lawyers into one generic term "lawyer" at least in Canada and they all want to be part of that class.

It was not always this way and there where distinct legal professionals with different functions. Lawyers, Solicitors, and Barristers. Each has different traning and provided different services to the public. Today their are happy to all be lawyers so let the crap that pours out of one group inundate the whole lot untill they distinguish themselves by breaking up the profession into distinct types. Till then they should all be equally dispised and shat on whenever one gets the chance.

Finally, the Judge is not a proper person to be appointed in any legitimate society and should always be an elected possition so that what they do can also be judge by society. This GRAP about men with honour and integrity miraculously getting picked into being Judges for life and that by being above the law and above accountability this is somehow good for society is nothing but HOGWASH.

"I cannot accept .... that we are to judge Pope and King (or Judges) unlike other men, with a favorable presumption that they did no wrong. If there is any presumption it is the other way against holder of power, increasing as the power increases. Historic responsibility has to make up for the want of legal responsibility. Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely. There is no worse heresy than that the office sanctifies the holder of it. " Lord Acton

This, on the other hand, deserves very little response. There is no logic, reason, thought, legitimacy, intelligence, or accurate evidence underlying anything you have written.

I have defended against your "crack-addicted gutter-whore" comments many times before and you just don't ever come up with anything valid.

Are some lawyers bad? You bet. Anymore than some doctors, dentists, accountants, teachers, etc. are bad? Nope.

Are there legitimate criticisms of the self-regulation model of discipline? There sure are. Have you made out a single one of them in any comprehensible fashion? Not even close. (Note...lawyers are hardly the only self-regulating profession...is this the deciding factor on whether you are a gutter-whore?)

Can we debate the merits of appointing judges versus electing them? Indeed. Can "you" be included in "we" in that debate? Apparently not...you just don't know how to participate in a civil discourse (that's legal speak for talking nicely...and don't worry, I'll eat the bill on that bit of advice)

FTA

[iamcanadian2]

This, on the other hand, deserves very little response. There is no logic, reason, thought, legitimacy, intelligence, or accurate evidence underlying anything you have written.

I have defended against your "crack-addicted gutter-whore" comments many times before and you just don't ever come up with anything valid.

Are some lawyers bad? You bet. Anymore than some doctors, dentists, accountants, teachers, etc. are bad? Nope.

Are there legitimate criticisms of the self-regulation model of discipline? There sure are. Have you made out a single one of them in any comprehensible fashion? Not even close. (Note...lawyers are hardly the only self-regulating profession...is this the deciding factor on whether you are a gutter-whore?)

Can we debate the merits of appointing judges versus electing them? Indeed. Can "you" be included in "we" in that debate? Apparently not...you just don't know how to participate in a civil discourse (that's legal speak for talking nicely...and don't worry, I'll eat the bill on that bit of advice)

FTA

Lawyers should only speak when spoken to. Know thy place at the feet of man, devil!

All I have to say to any lawyer is:

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Lawyers don't deserve the dignity of any other response from anyone.

[guyser]

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FTA...he is saying You are Number One !!! He now loves lawyers.

[beatenwoman2005]

Lawyers in Canada are not accountable for anything they do. Canada has no functional systems of proper control over their abuses of power they are given by silly and senseless rules created to maintain an unecessary monopoly profession.

The legal profession in Canada is less honorable than crack addicted gutter whores.

Law in Canada is strictly business. It's a money addicted profession where the objective is to rob from the poor and give to the rich.

The immoral and unethical legal system that has been created in Canada by unsupervised lawyers and non-elected judges/lawyers is the equivalent of a modern day Sodom and Gamorah. As such the system can be scrapped, its rules of Civil Proceedures properly torn up and used as toilet paper.

Corruption is rampant throughout the system. Lawyers get in bed with each other and also with the Judges to pilfer and rape ALL members of the public that enter their domain. There is no honour or integrity in the system and there are no systems or practices to create honour or accountability. In fact the opposite condition holds true, in that the system functions to WEED OUT those with honour and integrity so that the most vile, unethical and incompetent advance.

If the legal profession in Canada is strictly a money grab profession, then we have a serious problem, Lawyers really suck at their profession, because the average un-educated Albertan oil field worker could pull just as much cash if not more, for a starting salary, as almost any recent law school graduate.

Sure lawyers are well paid, 7 years of school and a professional degree usually gets you that and it should, But Lawyers are far from being in any sort of class of their own when it comes to salaries, I think maybe you are confusing Top U.S Law salaries with Canadian Salaries, which are decent and allow for a good living, but not spectacular in any sense of the word.

Likewise your Canada-wide universal lawyer dirtbag conspiracy theory is kind of undermined by the fact that about half of lawyers in Canada are self employed. Sure making fun of lawyers is great fun, but a representation of a new sodom and gamorah, or crack addicted gutter whore, makes your sensationalist analogies about as valuable as what is on the toilet paper after I use it.

Maybe canadian legal salaries are so, realtively, low because they are doing what you say, robbing from the poor. What kind of idiot robs from the poor? What are you going to steal? A box of macaroni? Do they still have those hockey cards on the back of the box?

See your post wouldn't be so bad, if it was to focus on arguing for an outside investigative ethics body. It reminds me of those posts about police officers who eat babies, and thats why we need independant bodies and boards of the police profession. Its tough because I might in part agree with the conclusion, but it is completely childish in the treatment of the profession and the many good people who do work in the profession.

I am single and available to these individuals (not discriminating) above that have ridden upon their trusted steed's to SMITE the little paper dragons (lawyers) with their mental PROWESS. Should they wish to take me off to a rotten tomato tossing event, please ensure that there will be targets in flowing Legal garb or I will decline, as long as I too become number

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............./´¯/'...'/´¯¯`•¸

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........('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')

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..........''...\.......... _.•´

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In the eyes of appointed Crown's.

OK, enough of the slamming.... How do you all propose that this can be corrected? How do we correct arrogance and ignorance of those who are bestowed in positions of power and judgment?

[iamcanadian2]

Very simply:

1) Make ALL judges and legal tribunal possitions elected by popular vote cast by the general population. No tricky political involvment and strictly fair and open elections. Any meddling with elected judges mandatory 10 year prison terms, no exceptions.

2) Make lawyers subjects of a public body of non-lawyers to review their competence, conduct and pushment, like in other more honest countries. Make activities of lawyers that are criminal subject to mandatory criminal sentencing.

Remove the notion that dibarment is a huge punishment for any lawyer. It is not. It simply results in their getting fired from their job and having to find another job. People get fired from jobs everyday for little or no reason of their making. It is not enough punishment to have a lawyers loose a licence to practice law. It is equivalent to being fire, that is all. When lawyers are found the be worthy of disbarment nothing short of seizing their every form of asset, tracking money to their dependants and family through the opening of the banking system going back to graduation without limitation periods. (i.e. default personal bankrupcy with all assets in whatever form taken and sold off to go to a funding pool for victims compensation).

The former lawyer starts over with nothing, gets a new education, so that nothing will remain of the gains made illigitimately abusing the public trust.

[FTA Lawyer]

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........('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')

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FTA...he is saying You are Number One !!! He now loves lawyers.

He's had an epiphany! His wit and cunning arguments are simply too much for me (I suck at keyboard-o-graphic art).

FTA

[Figleaf]

Very simply:

1) Make ALL judges and legal tribunal possitions elected by popular vote cast by the general population. No tricky political involvment and strictly fair and open elections. Any meddling with elected judges mandatory 10 year prison terms, no exceptions.

Rotten idea. Judges should make decisions based on the law, not based on the incentives of the electoral process.

2) Make lawyers subjects of a public body of non-lawyers to review their competence, conduct and pushment, like in other more honest countries.

Like where?

Make activities of lawyers that are criminal subject to mandatory criminal sentencing.

Do you think lawyers are exempt from criminal laws?

Remove the notion that dibarment is a huge punishment for any lawyer. It is not.... It is equivalent to being fire, that is all.

No, it's the equivalent of being barred from looking for work in the field you've trained in (and maybe done) for years.

[beatenwoman2005]

name='Figleaf' date='Apr 18 2007, 08:05 PM' post='209650']

Make activities of lawyers that are criminal subject to mandatory criminal sentencing.

Do you think lawyers are exempt from criminal laws?

Remove the notion that dibarment is a huge punishment for any lawyer. It is not.... It is equivalent to being fire, that is all.

No, it's the equivalent of being barred from looking for work in the field you've trained in (and maybe done) for years.

Yes Crowns are EXEMPT from what I gather from the criminal process.

Being barred is not a harsh punishment when crowns demonstrate MALICIOUS PROSECUTION. That takes away from what they were trained for and it takes away from their appointment.

[FTA Lawyer]

Crown prosecutors have absolutely no different standing in relation to criminal liability than any other citizen.

Malicious prosecution is a civil tort (i.e. something you sue for to collect damages) not a criminal act. IF the prosecutor has committed fraud or mischief or obstruction as part of a malicious prosecution, then report them to the Law Society for the issue of disbarment and to the police for the criminal issue.

Move on please from this goofy suggestion that Crown prosecutors have complete legal immunity.

FTA

[Jacko2]

Crown prosecutors have absolutely no different standing in relation to criminal liability than any other citizen.

Malicious prosecution is a civil tort (i.e. something you sue for to collect damages) not a criminal act. IF the prosecutor has committed fraud or mischief or obstruction as part of a malicious prosecution, then report them to the Law Society for the issue of disbarment and to the police for the criminal issue.

Move on please from this goofy suggestion that Crown prosecutors have complete legal immunity.

FTA

Is this some kind of joke? People have heard of the cover ups between doctors when people actually get killed to avoid malpractice suits.... just imagine how hard it will be when its between lawyers over things that only involve money!!!!

This is a big problem in Canada especially where lawyers are self-regulating AND self-insuring. Can you imagine the response from a lawyer being asked to sue another lawyer for any Civil Tort that will be defended by the Law Society and its LPIC (self-insurance arm) in that if he wins all lawyers will be paying higher premiums????

Firstly no Lawyer in his right mind will even take the case. If you find a wacko lawyer who will, it will be your lawyer that gets disbarred for taking your case on. The law society will persecute him instead till he drops the case. Alternatively he will just take your money and put up a half assed show to keep taking your evry last cent without ever trying to win anything for you. He will take a fall, like some sleezy boxer who sold the match to the other side.

Finally since all judges are lawyers and none of them are elected and are therefore above any accountability every judge your case goes through will stick poles in your wheel spokes to make sure you never make it to a trial.

You will go from being victimized by one lawyer who screwed you to the whole legal system ganging up to gangbang you untill you and all of your dependants, friends and family are killed physically, emotionally and economically.

[Charles Anthony]

Welcome, to the forum JackO2.

[FTA Lawyer]

Oh for God's sake, what is with the lunatics claiming lawyers never sue lawyers and it takes six figures to get someone charged criminally?!?!?!?!?!

Can we please use, I don't know, reality...maybe mixed with a bit of truth, and even some facts or examples.

Here's a link to my website where I've posted a judgment (yes, that's right a judgment, as in already got the order) from a case where I got my client's legal bill paid by the Crown due to the prosecutor's misconduct.

CROWN PAYS COSTS FOR NEGLIGENCE

Since I know the loons won't read the case, here's a couple of choice bits:

[32] I find the conduct of the Crown in this matter regarding its disclosure obligations to be

generally consistent with Crown counsel’s conduct throughout these proceedings, which left an

overall air of neglect pervading this prosecution. Failing to appear for pre-trial conference, failing

to follow the Court’s directions regarding setting continuation dates, and failing to respond to

telephone communications from the Court all display a pattern of neglect akin to the lack of

response received by defence counsel to numerous entreaties for proper disclosure.

I find this

conduct on the part of the Crown to be egregious and unacceptable, and in the circumstances

prejudicial to the defence in preparing their case and making full answer and defence to the

charges.

[39] The Courts must be vigilant in ensuring that the public interest in ensuring fair trials

involving all accused, guilty or innocent, is adequately protected. In cases where a fair trial has

not occurred due to “a marked and unacceptable departure from the reasonable standards

expected of the prosecution”

remedial measures in the form of costs are appropriate, even when a

stay of proceedings has been entered. This is such a case.

[42] In the case before me, the Applicant/Accused was unfairly prejudiced in his defence from

the time that the Crown failed to comply with the order of this Court regarding disclosure.

Accordingly,

I award costs in the amount of $8,409.83

Note, the bill was under $10,000.00...not even close to 6 figures, and I'm not a wacko lawyer who just happend to be sh-t ass crazy enough to do something so absurd as to hold a lawyer accountable for their actions.

Well, what say the loons?

FTA