Mothers can be sued by unborn children injured in car accidents

[geoffrey]

What if the mother just aborts the injured fetus?

Abortion is legal is it not?

Hence the hypocracy.

If another party were to kill a woman's fetus, there would definitely be recourse. But a women can destroy it herself. What up? Is it alive, or not? Is it self-interested, or not?

Otherwise killing someone else's fetus shouldn't really go beyond common assault.

Rather ridiculous, no?

If a woman knows about the dangerous of say, drinking while pregnant (and who doesn't these days) and the kid gets FAS... then the woman should go to jail in my opinion (she's not capable of having the responsibility to raise a child, and she's a criminal for harming a life like that). Same theory behind the car accident concept.

[Drea]

Seems everyone is entitled to an opinion except the female.

Of course.

This is part and parcel of the patriachal society we live in.

If a mother wants to drink battery acid who am I to stop her? It's her body and she (as a fully functional independent human being) can decide whether or not she should drink acid or whole milk.

"Women MUST be owned or else all of the world's chillun would be drug addicted FAS kids and at the expense of the taxpayer to boot! -- Women are incapable of taking care of themselves and therefor we must regulate their bodily intake before pregnancy, during pregnancy and during lactation."

I say sterilize all women and grow babies in tubes.

Would solve the problem IMO.

Sheesh! I smoked pot during my pregnancy and my son is an A student. You buggers would have thrown me in jail! Then my wonderful, smart, awesome son would be a drug addicted foster kid somewhere. Wonderful.

Yes, this was a rant. Too darn bad.

Until we bring back "women are chattel and are controlled" then women will continue to decide what to do while pregnant. Whether that be abort, drink booze, smoke pot, do heroin, whatever.

I cannot believe anyone would advocate the "regulation" of pregnant (or soon to be) women.

[sharkman]

Nice way to kill a thread, Drea.

"Everyone is entitled to an opinion except the female - Drea", is what you meant to say.

If a mother tries to drink battery acid she will be stopped if anyone with sense in their head is around because that would be suicide and a child needs her mother.

Shame on you for smoking anything while you were pregnant. Perhaps your son would have been even brighter except for your selfish decisions while you carried him.

[Drea]

neener neener -- I smoked cigs too. (and still do, in the house to boot!)

My body - my feus - my child - my decision.

And this thread deserves to die a quick death anyway.

[Renegade]

I smoked pot during my pregnancy

Was that before or after the welfare?

You buggers would have thrown me in jail!

Not only that, we would have taken away your son and given him to adoptive parents who would have been more responsible.

[Drea]

Renegade, why don't you come on over to my house today and take away my child?

I'll invite you in and feed you a cuppa joe. I am not a judgmental holier than thou person. I bet my son would see you as rather invasive though

Yup I smoked (gasp) marijuana (gasp) while I was pregnant (gastp) and while those gigantic welfare cheques were rolling in! I was soooooooo rolling in cash back then that I bought at least an ounce a week. And I smoked 10 packs of smokes everyday before noon!

Get over it, you cannot and will not ever be able to regulate what people do to their own bodies. Even us babymaking machines called women.

Neener, freakin neener.

I'm lightin' a smoke right now. And my son is at the other end of the house.

Cheers!

[Riverwind]

My body - my feus - my child - my decision.

I disagree. You have the right to decide if you want to terminate the pregnancy. However, once you make the decision to carry the baby to term then you are choosing to assume all of the obligations of parenthood which means you can no longer do whatever you want - if you don't like that then you terminate the pregnacy since that is your choice alone.

Society has already decided that parents who delibrately poison their children are unfit parents even if the kids subject to this abuse do not realize they are being abused. Cigarette smoke is currently a grey area but eventually people who smoke with kids in the house will be considered the same as parents who feed their kids low does of rat poison.

[Drea]

By then my boy will be all grown up and I will not have to worry about that will I?

I think we should lock all women up unless they are sterile or old. Cause you never know, she could be pregnant and we just have to make sure that baby is gonna be ok.

And have you ever fed your kid a hotdog? Shame on you -- don't you know what's in a hotdog? "Processed" meat - ewww.

And margarine -- if there is margarine in your fridge your child should be taken away.

And fruit -- if there is not 5 servings available for each member of your family your child should be taken away.

And fat -- if you are fat your child should be taken away. After all fat parents raise fat children and we all know what problems obesity causes!

And ugly -- if you are ugly you should not be allowed to breed. Period. No reason, I just don't like looking at ugly people.

[Riverwind]

I think we should lock all women up unless they are sterile or old. Cause you never know, she could be pregnant and we just have to make sure that baby is gonna be ok.

A parent that unknowingly fed their kid rat poison would not be negligent. There is no difference between that and a woman smoking before she knows she is pregnant. However, once a woman knows she is pregnant she has to make a choice: get an abortion or assume the responsibility of parenthood.

When it comes to hotdogs you would have a point as soon as the gov't starts putting labels on hotdog packages warning that hotdogs are hazardous to human health. Until then you are grasping at straws. Would you feed your kids something that had the skull and crossbones symbol on it? What would you think of a parent who did and insisted that the gov't was wrong and there is nothing wrong with feeding known poisons to kids? You have been clearly warned that cigarettes are harmful yet you choose to ignore it. What kind of parent does that make you?

[Drea]

Whata kind of parent does that make me?

Well by knowing my kid -- a good one.

I know plently of folks that would never dream of smoking in front of the kids, etc but on the same token those very same kids are in gangs or doing drugs or just plain brats.

My kid is none of those things. So who is the better parent? The proof is in the child. The success and attitude of the child.

[Riverwind]

My kid is none of those things. So who is the better parent? The proof is in the child. The success and attitude of the child.

How much can you really take credit for? Sometimes kids grow up in horrific homes and turn out just fine. Other times, kids from a really good home turn out to be monsters. That said, your other posts on different topics seem to indicate that you are a probably a responsible parent who just does not seem to understand that smoking in the home hurts kids. That is why I think taking kids away from smoking parents is likely on over reaction in most cases. At the same time, I don't think we would just ignore it as a society - many times social pressure can promote positive change without the need for heavy handed interventions.

[Renegade]

Renegade, why don't you come on over to my house today and take away my child?

I'll invite you in and feed you a cuppa joe. I am not a judgmental holier than thou person. I bet my son would see you as rather invasive though

Thanks, but no thanks. I don't care for the smell of your second-hand smoke.

Yup I smoked (gasp) marijuana (gasp) while I was pregnant (gastp) and while those gigantic welfare cheques were rolling in! I was soooooooo rolling in cash back then that I bought at least an ounce a week. And I smoked 10 packs of smokes everyday before noon!

Yep, I bet I paid for your smokes and pot too by funding your welfare. BTW, did you forget to mention that 40oz'er each week as well? I can see that welfare money is well spent. You're welcome!

I'm lightin' a smoke right now. And my son is at the other end of the house.

Let's hope the constant smoke hasn't dulled your son's good sense and he doesn't do the same thing to his kid.

[jdobbin]

Yup I smoked (gasp) marijuana (gasp) while I was pregnant (gastp) and while those gigantic welfare cheques were rolling in! I was soooooooo rolling in cash back then that I bought at least an ounce a week. And I smoked 10 packs of smokes everyday before noon!

Education is probably the only useful tool to prevent birth defects from alcohol. It is estimated that a severely affected FAS person will cost the Canadian government between $2-3 million over a lifetime.

Most mothers probably wouldn't want their baby to suffer as a FAS person will over an entire life.

I have no idea what the effect of marijuana is during pregnancy. There might not be one.

[Wilber]

neener neener -- I smoked cigs too. (and still do, in the house to boot!)

My body - my feus - my child - my decision.

And this thread deserves to die a quick death anyway.

So you are saying that a parent should only be responsible for what they do to a child after it was born and take no responsibility for anything that was done to harm it before it was born?

[guyser]

Geez Drea , talk about killing a thread or anger, not sure which is worse?

You know , I am fine with you smoking pot while pregnant and smoking too, so did my mother so how can I bitch about it.

But the thing that gets me is your singular entitlement to do what you want when you want without regard to anyone else. Considering it takes TWO to make a baby , any harm inflicted on said baby will cause the father and mother to pay through the nose for care. So go ahead and drink that battery acid , just dont go to the father asking for extra support to correct it . (although there is no way he will be able to skirt that issue thus he will pay)

The issue at hand is not to deny any mother rights , but rather to discuss the way the legal system is moving to prosecute careless parenting.

[Who's Doing What?]

My body - my feus - my child - my decision.

You are correct on all accounts. And if your decision is detrimental to the health and welfare of your child/fetus then you should be held accountable.

[sharkman]

Yup I smoked (gasp) marijuana (gasp) while I was pregnant (gastp) and while those gigantic welfare cheques were rolling in! I was soooooooo rolling in cash back then that I bought at least an ounce a week. And I smoked 10 packs of smokes everyday before noon!

I'm lightin' a smoke right now. And my son is at the other end of the house.

How many kids have to grow up with health disorders because of the selfish attitudes as expressed above?

[Drea]

My kid is none of those things. So who is the better parent? The proof is in the child. The success and attitude of the child.

How much can you really take credit for? Sometimes kids grow up in horrific homes and turn out just fine. Other times, kids from a really good home turn out to be monsters. That said, your other posts on different topics seem to indicate that you are a probably a responsible parent who just does not seem to understand that smoking in the home hurts kids. That is why I think taking kids away from smoking parents is likely on over reaction in most cases. At the same time, I don't think we would just ignore it as a society - many times social pressure can promote positive change without the need for heavy handed interventions.

If I am responsible for the outcome if I smoke while pregnant, than I am also responsible for my child's success or lack thereof.

I understand full well that smoking is not ideal. Its funny (odd actually) that the cases of childhood asthma have gone up whilst smoking in the home has gone down.

Childhood illness has increased while our "awareness" of "bad" things is higher than ever. There should be less cases of asthma because there are less smokers. But this is not the case.

Why is childhood illness on the increase? Immune systems. Children today are not exposed to anything "harmful" in small doses so that when they are finally exposed to harmful substances (ie cig smoke) their body's response is extreme. Poor kids growing up in bubbles never get to build immunities. Let them eat dirt and build immunity.

My g/friends little girls were never ever allowed to be dirty and as a result both of them are sick all the time. As babies they were never exposed to anything unsanitary and therefore were never able to build up immunities.

[Drea]

Yup I smoked (gasp) marijuana (gasp) while I was pregnant (gastp) and while those gigantic welfare cheques were rolling in! I was soooooooo rolling in cash back then that I bought at least an ounce a week. And I smoked 10 packs of smokes everyday before noon!

I'm lightin' a smoke right now. And my son is at the other end of the house.

How many kids have to grow up with health disorders because of the selfish attitudes as expressed above?

do you really think I bought an ounce of weed a week and smoked 10 packs before noon? Can you say "sarcasm"?

Once again, there are MORE health disorders in children today than 20 years ago. Why is this? As there were more smokers back then, there should have been more health issues. There should be less health issues today but no, there are more.

[jdobbin]

do you really think I bought an ounce of weed a week and smoked 10 packs before noon? Can you say "sarcasm"?

Once again, there are MORE health disorders in children today than 20 years ago. Why is this? As there were more smokers back then, there should have been more health issues. There should be less health issues today but no, there are more.

Are there more disorders now?

[Drea]

Yes, childhood asthma and childhood diabetes are both on the increase.

Yet only 15% of our population still smokes. What a conundrum!

All of life's problems cannot be blamed on that 15% that smokes.

Tough luck. People will have to find some else to blame for their problems.

[jdobbin]

Yes, childhood asthma and childhood diabetes are both on the increase.

Are they actually up or are they diagnosed better?

[Drea]

Ashtma is a breathing problem.

20+ years ago you could tell a person had asthma, just like today.

My niece and my aunt both have mild asthma. My aunt was diagnosed in the 1960's. Niece in the 90s.

Obesity -- well take a look around -- there are waaaay more fat kids than a generation ago. It's the fat kids that get diabetes.

Silly stuff like ADHD (the label) are "new" diagnosis. Bad parents need some way to explain why little Johnny won't listen. Years ago he would not have been labelled, just disciplined.

[jdobbin]

Ashtma is a breathing problem.

20+ years ago you could tell a person had asthma, just like today.

My niece and my aunt both have mild asthma. My aunt was diagnosed in the 1960's. Niece in the 90s.

Obesity -- well take a look around -- there are waaaay more fat kids than a generation ago. It's the fat kids that get diabetes.

Silly stuff like ADHD (the label) are "new" diagnosis. Bad parents need some way to explain why little Johnny won't listen. Years ago he would not have been labelled, just disciplined.

I can see that asthma might be up although I don't have any stats on it.

Diabetes has two forms. The first is an auto-immune disorder and young people get it no matter what their weight is.

The second which is adult onset (generally) is a lifestyle related diabetes. I know that is going up but have no recent stats on it.