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The Cost of Native Land Claims


The Cost of Native Land Claims  

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I think it is a pipedream to believe that natives would better managers of land and water than non-natives. Nor do natives appreciate the "beauty of nature" any more than non-natives. This is a myth that has been perpetuated by movies such as Dances with Wolves. Entertaining but a fantasy.

Well, as a Native, I know that our traditional boundaries incorporated whole watersheds because it was common knowledge (to us, I guess) that what you do in one spot affects the whole watershed.

Now Caucasians have this habit of using water as boundaries, whether national or regional. In their infinite wisdom, this means that the filth disgorging from the American side of the Niagara River gorge goes into the Niagara river, where it makes its' way via the currents east around the south end of the lake, and then swings back west on the north side. Therefore, Toronto gets to quench its thirst on American industrial waste.

Or Ottawa gets to drink Hull's pee, and recent water events in North Battleford and here in Ontario clearly indicate that our Caucasian neighbours are having a tough time just handling water. Even the water system at Kashechewan was built by Caucasians...after the Indians said they didn't want to live there.

But we aren't done yet. Who was the fool that tried to graft the square pattern township lines in the Canadian shield? Using this system to divine regional boundaries for little things -like forest fires- means that North Bay district has to respond to fires on the west side of the Ishpatina ridge/ Sturgeon river system, instead of Sudbury district, who can drive there, and take a boat to any site west of the Sturgeon. North Bay has no choice but to respond by helicopter, which is infinitely more expense than a car and boat.

somebody was obviously thinking.

...and we haven't even started on tree management yet...

Live China, can you prove that Natives are incapable of managing the land and water they live on? i've seen the tourists pissing into the Lake from their rented houseboats, so I know they don't care. They just go back to wherever they come from with the obiligatory hangover and another story about a drunken weekend.

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Live China, can you prove that Natives are incapable of managing the land and water they live on? i've seen the tourists pissing into the Lake from their rented houseboats, so I know they don't care. They just go back to wherever they come from with the obiligatory hangover and another story about a drunken weekend.

And what enviromental friendly piss hole do natives piss in?

Can YOU prove that Natives ARE capable of managing land and water without help from outside their communities?

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Maybe the non-native people should take everything that is theirs, made by them, constructed by them, developed by them, all schools, hospitals, medical services and technology, highways, bridges, airports, utilities, such as phone service, electricity, etc etc etc EVERYTHING including Social Services and tax dollars, grocery stores, malls, etc etc - and immigrate to a country where we would be welcome. There arent that many of us after all.

Blow up the oil and gas wells, the dams, all the buildings and roads, and return Canada to a "natural" state and let the natives have it, leave it as was before Eurpopeans arrived here.

Including of course the houses and schools and recreation centres and everything built for natives, and let them have at it seeing as our presence has so handicapped and harmed the way of life they had before our arrival. No pickup trucks, no ATVs, no ski dos or guns of any kind, no manufactured clothing, no manufactured food, just the natives and the water and the land .. works for me.

Do you know how to make a bow and arrow? A flint arrow head? Have at it -- I am willing to pull out of Canada and take EVERYTHING with me ---

Here is a better idea, why don't YOU take everything YOU invented and "immigrate to a country where YOU would be welcome". YOU didn't invent "schools, hospitals, medical services and technology, highways, bridges, airports, utilities, such as phone service, electricity, etc etc etc EVERYTHING including Social Services and tax dollars, grocery stores, malls, etc etc, pickuptrucks, ATVs, skis, guns of any kind, manufactured clothing, manufactured food..." so stop taking credit for it. If YOU decide to leave the country, you don't get to claim any of those things, since YOU didn't invent them. That works for me.

The question is are you willing to go back to your "traditional" way of life? Traditional native life with ALL the land handed over to you and all the resources does not to me mean IMO that you get to live in your European style home, watch satelite TV, wear manufactured clothing, eat food bought at a grocery store and hold a hand out for "rent cheques" drive on highways paid for and built by non-natives --- Isnt that just a tad hypocritical?

Are YOU willing to go back to a "traditional" way of life, before OTHER PEOPLE invented all of these things which you speak of and take credit for? You won't get to live in your European style home, watch satellite TV, wear manufactured clothing, eat food bought at a grocery store, drive on highways....That is more than just a tad hypocritical

I hope you dont have dental work or glasses we would have to reclaim before we leave here. :P

Likewise.

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Live China, can you prove that Natives are incapable of managing the land and water they live on?

I never said they were. I just said they aren't any better at it that whites or non-natives. And they won't be. No racial group will be. Environmental protection really starts with attitude. And no group has a monopoly on that!

This isn't a race question, but rather a question of experience, lad. I can point at my experience in northern Ontario, and the traditional forestry management knowledge acquired there. That is why I have a concern with watersheds and their management. No one else ever thinks about managing water or forest on a watershed basis, even though that makes much more sense given the lay of the land, and yet many bands practise that style of management. Even the province has taken on many Native management suggestions, like shelterwoods, selective cutting and buffer zones.

For example, when timber cruisers first set foot in the Northern Ontario forests (south of the James Bay watershed), most of the cover was mature red and white pines. We know this from old forestry records. Clear cutting began immediately, with the idea that whatever is cut will grow back into the same for forest. Unfortunately, the timber people found out that what grows back is what grows the fastest, not what was most mature. Now current northern forests are a sea of poplar and birch, interspersed with the occasional pine.

The Indians living there knew this would happen, but no one listened to them because of attitudes like Canuck's, who assume that non-Natives will always know better.

Therefore, current forest and water managment practices can use traditional Aboriginal knowledge to improve the basic strategy and maintain the forest/water interrelationship.

Hence, it is experience and not "race" that matters. Just because the Indians happened to live in these areas since the ice melted has more to do with it than their skin color.

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And what enviromental friendly piss hole do natives piss in?

traditionally, a person should urinate and defecate at least seven man-lengths from a water body, like a lake or river.

Unlike the drunken non-Natives partying it up on the houseboats of Ontario, we don't piss directly into a lake that everyone else is swimming, fishing, and sometimes, drinking from.

I hope that helps Canuck. We need you to do your bit for the environment too.

Can YOU prove that Natives ARE capable of managing land and water without help from outside their communities?

Considering that the Ontario Ministry of Natural Resources came down to Toronto to ask me to advise on the forest management plan for Nipissing district, probably, but I'm not going to identify myself because I don't want people stalking my children.

What I can do is point at North Battleford and Walkerton and say "nice job, guys...way to poison and kill people that relied and trusted you for clean drinking water".

Now that I think of it, why don't you come down to southern Ontario and drink straight from Lake Ontario or Lake Erie....I dare ya....

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GC:

Hey...you read Kindred's post, eh? I had a good laugh too. I always get a kick out of white folks taking personal responsibility and credit for everything under the sun, like Kindred actually invented the phone and snowmobile.

The funny part is that they always do that because they happen to share the same skin color as the inventor.

That would be like me saying that I'm responsible for the success of actors like Adam Beach because I'm native too. HaHaHa....

I see that you picked up on that point too. However, I don't see people like Kindred claiming responsibility for the holocaust in Europe because he has more in common with Hitler vis-avis skin color than I do, but it must be that selective, tunnel-vision style of thinking that so many have here.

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And what enviromental friendly piss hole do natives piss in?

traditionally, a person should urinate and defecate at least seven man-lengths from a water body, like a lake or river.

Unlike the drunken non-Natives partying it up on the houseboats of Ontario, we don't piss directly into a lake that everyone else is swimming, fishing, and sometimes, drinking from.

I hope that helps Canuck. We need you to do your bit for the environment too.

Can YOU prove that Natives ARE capable of managing land and water without help from outside their communities?

Considering that the Ontario Ministry of Natural Resources came down to Toronto to ask me to advise on the forest management plan for Nipissing district, probably, but I'm not going to identify myself because I don't want people stalking my children.

What I can do is point at North Battleford and Walkerton and say "nice job, guys...way to poison and kill people that relied and trusted you for clean drinking water".

Now that I think of it, why don't you come down to southern Ontario and drink straight from Lake Ontario or Lake Erie....I dare ya....

Firstly I'll continue to use a toilet for my envronmental concerns.Maybe the traditional 7 man - lengths the natives use should be changed to (for environmental concerns) having to carry a defecating bag the way dog owners do.If you're a short native, 7 man-lengths is too close for me.

I'm glad to hear that "we" don't piss directly into a lake that everyone is swimming,fishing,or sometimes drinking from.

If only it was just the drunken non-natives that was the source of this "pollution" and not the drunken natives in their gas powered boats,or the black bears and beavers.

W.C.Fields once said:

"I never drink water because of the disgusting things that fish do in"

As long as you don't do it in the water I quess that's the important thing.

It's great that McGinty and his boys are coming to the great city of Toronto to seek out a non-reserve native to seek advice with forest plans in Nippissing.

I'm sure the natives on the reserve up there appreciate your concerns for their welfare and appreciate all you do for them ...from Toronto.

Must make you feel proud of all the good work you're doing so far away.

Question: Did they contact you because you're a native who knows, or because you've been educated in a Canadian school and are an expert in the field.

"one small step for mankind....."

Don't fear me stalking your kids,never going to happen.

Kids are the generation that will change the world as long as thier parents teach them that people are instincty good and mean well, and that lumping everyone into a pidgeon hole of anger towards race,colour,religion is not the teaching of a wise parent.

You speak,they listen.Make your words wise.

From what I've read that you write,your words of anger are not a good teaching tool.

The best way to destroy an enemy is to make him a friend.-- Abraham Lincoln
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and yet many bands practise that style of management.

And many don't!

Just because the Indians happened to live in these areas since the ice melted has more to do with it than their skin color.

Never said skin color was involved. And yes experience has something to do with it. But attitude (or will) does too! I worked in resource management for years, and the basic rule was educate towards changing attitudes!

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Live:

Never said skin color was involved. And yes experience has something to do with it. But attitude (or will) does too! I worked in resource management for years, and the basic rule was educate towards changing attitudes!

Good, then we agree on something! I'll admit that not every Native knows much about forest management, let alone environmental consciousness, but education is the key to overcoming this issue Canada-wide. I also feel that enforcement 9on lakes and in the bush) can be linked to a greater degree with S & R and Fire, and that conservation officers need broader and stronger powers to enforce laws. I also think that they need to work in teams of three because some of the worst situations can occur way back in the bush.

I'd also love to have a cop have the power to board a pee boat and arrest the pee'ers...slap them with a four digit fine and then see who laughs.

What kinds of resources were you into? Where you public or private sector, if you don't mind me asking.

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GC 1795 Uh I think the big difference here is that I am not demanding Canada be handed over to me? Or did you kind of miss that point in this thread?

As for smelting your own tools and building your own houses, you will have to start from scratch, no smelters, no mills, no nails, no saws ........ you complain about how non-natives have destroyed Canada and your way of life.

I would be interested in learning how you are going to change the flow or rivers into the US. Do you also plan on taking over the US as well?

Here is a better idea, why don't YOU take everything YOU invented and "immigrate to a country where YOU would be welcome". YOU didn't invent "schools, hospitals, medical services and technology, highways, bridges, airports, utilities, such as phone service, electricity, etc etc etc EVERYTHING including Social Services and tax dollars, grocery stores, malls, etc etc, pickuptrucks, ATVs, skis, guns of any kind, manufactured clothing, manufactured food..." so stop taking credit for it. If YOU decide to leave the country, you don't get to claim any of those things, since YOU didn't invent them. That works for me.

Didnt say I did and I am not complaining these things have ruined my traditional way of life, you do read dont you?

What have your contributions been to Canada? What big changes have you made? I would be interested in hearing about it, seeing as you dont know me and dont know what I have done in my life.

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GC 1795 Uh I think the big difference here is that I am not demanding Canada be handed over to me? Or did you kind of miss that point in this thread?

No, I think you missed the point in this thread. There is a contract between Natives and the Crown, in the form of treaties, that any land purchased from Natives be purchased by the Crown. The rights to those lands are not granted to Natives just because they have the same colour of skin as the people who first inhabited the land, it is because of these treaties. That is much different than claiming that only you get to use modern technology because you have the same colour of skin (I'm assuming here that you are caucasian) as those who invented those technologies. As far as I know there are no treaties stating that only caucasians may use these technologies.

As for smelting your own tools and building your own houses, you will have to start from scratch, no smelters, no mills, no nails, no saws ........ you complain about how non-natives have destroyed Canada and your way of life.

I haven't complained about anything. Show me one quote that I said to back up your claim, or did you read my posts?

I would be interested in learning how you are going to change the flow or rivers into the US. Do you also plan on taking over the US as well?

Where did this come from? I never said anything about changing flows of rivers, or taking over the U.S.

Didnt say I did and I am not complaining these things have ruined my traditional way of life, you do read dont you?

I did not complain that these things ruined my traditional way of life either, you do read don't you? Show me a quote where I said these things have ruined my traditional way of life.

What have your contributions been to Canada? What big changes have you made?

I can't claim to have made big changes. I am relatively young and have just begun my career in medical research. Have I found the cure for cancer yet? No, but I've certainly made progress. The difference between you and me, however, is that I don't claim to be the only one who gets to benefit from a particular contribution to society just because I have the same colour of skin as the person who made that contribution. I recognize that everyone makes small contributions, and that everyone is entitled to benefit from those contributions.

I would be interested in hearing about it, seeing as you dont know me and dont know what I have done in my life.

Never said I knew you, but I sure as hell know you didn't invent schools, hospitals, airports, highways, guns, trucks and all the other technologies you mentioned in your post.

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No, I think you missed the point in this thread. There is a contract between Natives and the Crown, in the form of treaties, that any land purchased from Natives be purchased by the Crown. The rights to those lands are not granted to Natives just because they have the same colour of skin as the people who first inhabited the land, it is because of these treaties.
Natives are not demanding rights to the land - they are demanding special privileges that no one else is allowed to have. Fee simple ownership of land should be more than sufficient to address old treaty obligations but many natives insist that they should be entitled to a special kind of land ownership because they are aboriginal. This is not about inheritance or contracts to be honoured - this is about one ethnic group thinking that they are superior to all others and demanding that the gov't give them privileges that no other ethnic group has.
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Some of my comments are for Temagmi not just aimed at you GC or I would have said "and further more" my error in not being clearer -
they are demanding special privileges that no one else is allowed to have
AMEN

Kindred: Don't bother aiming posts at me. GC has already responded to you on the same subject in a concise and telling manner.

The most I can do is agree wholeheartedly that you believe that you are somehow responsible for the inventions of others solely based on your skin color.

GC and I find that, well, kind of a stupid argument. In fact, I was watching the movie "Slapshot" last night, and I had a heck of a laugh during the scene where Paul Newman's character teases the goalie named Hanrahan for having a lesbian wife. Hanrahan makes the point that if his wife is a dyke, then that makes him a "fag".

I started laughing because I thought that certainly was a "Kindred" argument. In fact, I'll probably refer to those types of situations as "a kindred" from now on.

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No, I think you missed the point in this thread. There is a contract between Natives and the Crown, in the form of treaties, that any land purchased from Natives be purchased by the Crown. The rights to those lands are not granted to Natives just because they have the same colour of skin as the people who first inhabited the land, it is because of these treaties.
Natives are not demanding rights to the land - they are demanding special privileges that no one else is allowed to have. Fee simple ownership of land should be more than sufficient to address old treaty obligations but many natives insist that they should be entitled to a special kind of land ownership because they are aboriginal. This is not about inheritance or contracts to be honoured - this is about one ethnic group thinking that they are superior to all others and demanding that the gov't give them privileges that no other ethnic group has.

Actually River, I'd much rather have the land back any day. The rights exchanged for the original land purchase I can do without. I've even posted that on other threads. I'd gladly give up tax exemption, and all treaty rights in exchange for the land at anytime, on anyday and anywhere.

Although I do have one question. Could you enlighten me as to what "special priviledges" Natives have been demanding? I know I must sound like a dullard, having previously worked on land claims and court cases and stuff, but I'll admit that I'm not aware of any special priviledges.

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Although I do have one question. Could you enlighten me as to what "special privileges" Natives have been demanding? I know I must sound like a dullard, having previously worked on land claims and court cases and stuff, but I'll admit that I'm not aware of any special privileges.
From your own words:
It would mean a complete restructuring of Canadian law. All the land claims that I have worked on get stumped at the "Aboriginal title" concept because the Crown does not have a land holding category called "Aboriginal title".
Fee simple ownership is what everyone else uses. Why should aboriginals get something different?

There are two structures which Natives can use to get at least some of the land back:

1) Corporate

Pros: Not restricted to a contiguous geographical areas, no requirement to give non-shareholders rights

Cons: Subject to all municipal, provincial and federal laws.

2) Municipal

Pros: Can pass own zoning/development regulations, Can collect taxes.

Cons: Must give voting rights to all residents of the municipality

What you are asking for is to have all of the rights of both the corporate and municipal models but none of the obligations. No matter how you spin it, you are demanding "special privileges".

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Although I do have one question. Could you enlighten me as to what "special privileges" Natives have been demanding? I know I must sound like a dullard, having previously worked on land claims and court cases and stuff, but I'll admit that I'm not aware of any special privileges.
From your own words:
It would mean a complete restructuring of Canadian law. All the land claims that I have worked on get stumped at the "Aboriginal title" concept because the Crown does not have a land holding category called "Aboriginal title".
Fee simple ownership is what everyone else uses. Why should aboriginals get something different?

There are two structures which Natives can use.... No matter how you spin it, you are demanding "special privileges".

River: Neither type of land would be acceptable to a first Nations because ultimate ownership will still lie with the Crown. You might want to ensure that you control the Native's land, but the Natives certainly don't. Historically, the Crown has "reposessed" Aboriginal hunting and trapping cabins because "taxes weren't paid on the land they occupied", even though these camps had been in these families since before europenas came.

given this historical example of the crown using the law against Natives, the natives are doing their best to ensure that situation like that will never happen again, which is why it is unacceptable to take land under fee simple, reserve or municipal or corporate.

The bottom line is that Canada will have to draft up another form of legal land use to accomodate the Natives, or there won't be any settling of land claims. Natives will never accept land whose ultimate legal authority is not them. We already know the impact of having non-Native authority on our lands, so why would we go back to doing the same thing over again.

Besides, there is much in your justice system that needs restructuring.

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I just received this email:

From: Chief Terrance Nelson

Roseau River Railway Blockade

Information from Chief Terrance Nelson

Roseau River will peacefully blockade two railway lines for exactly 24 hours starting Thursday June 29th at 4:00 p.m. and ending Friday June 30th at 4:00 p.m. One of these railway line blockades will be north of Dominion City, four miles east and one and half miles north of the main Roseau River reservation, the other railway line to be blockaded is north of Letellier, which is approximately two and half miles west of Roseau River and one mile north of Letellier. Both railway lines move goods and services into and from the United States and will affect business in North Dakota, Minnesota and beyond. Both railway lines run on our traditional territory, we hold underlying title to those lands.

At noon on Thursday June 29 in front of the Roseau River Community Hall, two Roseau River drums will begin singing. People will gather to hear from the elders, the leadership and from the people themselves why First Nations are angry enough at Canada to initiate this action. Roseau River's traditional territory was over 2000 square miles in south central Manitoba prior to the signing of Treaty # 1 on August 3rd 1871.

The Crown promised that no white man would ever be allowed to set foot upon the reservation without our permission. The Crown pledged on their honor that if we agreed to the treaty giving them access to our 3 million acres of land that the reserved lands would be ours forever. Just 32 years later on January 30th 1903, the government would force the surrender of 12 sections or 70% of our reserve. Mr. Atkinson would be shot and killed for refusing to leave his home. It takes the Minister of Indian Affairs, twelve days to recommend an Order in Council and in just 26 days by February 25 1903 the white farmers have full ownership of 12 sections of our reserve with a signed Order in Council.

In 1993, we had RCMP snipers in our fields when we tried to open a casino that could have bought in 100 million dollars a year for us. Once again our jurisdiction, our right to govern ourselves was denied by force of arms.

We still have 77% unemployment. We are denied any recognition of our right to lease our 3 million acres of traditional lands and each year we receive less and less funding. It took us 125 years to get Treaty Land Entitlement recognized. Eight years we have waited to have our TLE land converted and still we have to wait, but it took the white farmers only 26 days to get an Order in Council taking our 12 sections of reservation lands away.

Roseau River is owed at least 60 million dollars from the 1903 land claim. We have been peaceful, we have been patient, we have waited 103 years for justice but meanwhile in Caledonia the white people got compensation already, millions of dollars have already been pledged by the government, yet the white people only had to wait 100 days, not a 100 years for the government to act.

Yes we believe that there are two sets of laws in Canada, one for whites and another for the Indians.

The Supreme Court of Canada decided in Haida that "Knowledge of a credible but unproven claim is enough to trigger a duty to consult." In spite of the law as decided in Mikkisew, where Justice Binney of the Supreme Court wrote that it was illegal for government officials to be indifferent, it is exactly what the Government of Canada does, Liberal or Conservative, they ignore the law if it is in favor of the Indians. Why do you think that in 1982, Premier Lyons of Manitoba would absolutely refuse having the Right of Property recognized in the Charter? They tried to stack the law in their favor but it didn't work so they ignore the law when it is convenient for them to ignore it.

Over five hundred murdered and missing First Nation women in Canada. Our people fill the jails and prisons in Canada. Over 50% of the people killed at the hands of police in Canada are First Nations people. Many land claims are in limbo because Canada refuses to put in place a process that will `deal with these matters. The Conservatives refused to deal with the Kelowna accord despite the fact ten provincial premiers, three territories and the previous federal government had agreed to it. In Six Nations/Caledonia land issue, it was the people who took action, it was the people who finally had enough and decided not to be sidetracked by a useless Canadian government process, they, the people took direct action.

So I ask the question, are the people tired? Are you tired of watching hundreds of billions of dollars of resource wealth paid to the governments of Canada, while you, the original owners are denied a share of your own wealth. Are you tired of the housing problems, the lack of education opportunities, the denial of health coverage, the injustice, the brutality, are you tired of being the poorest of the poor in Canada. Are you tired of watching immigrants to our lands taking our resource wealth, while at the same time they call you down for not paying taxes to their government?

We at Roseau River will stand up as we have always done. We will not be ignored. We will not obey any white court injunction that the railway companies might try and get imposed upon us, an injunction that will be unilaterally imposed, an injunction that would deny our right of property.

We signed a treaty with Canada. They are obligated by the terms and conditions of that treaty. The immigrant to our land gets their title from the Crown but the Crown got their rights from us, the indigenous people of these lands. We were here first, these are our lands. We hold the underlying title to all these lands including under the rail lines.

At 3:30 p.m. vehicles will pull out of the reserve headed to the blockade sites. At exactly 4:00 p.m. cars will be driven onto the rail lines and we will stay exactly 24 hours to send a message to Canada, that we will no

longer tolerate our rights being ignored. The Okiijida Society will provide security and will not tolerate any acts of violence from anyone. We will welcome all peaceful people to join us on June 29th and 30th 2006. We ask that you get there at noon in order to ensure everyone knows their responsibility.

Chief Terrance Nelson

204-782-4827

I hope that some of our Native brothers and sisters from here will be able to make it to the blockade. It sounds like the Manitoba people are fed up with the Feds dragging their feet, but that is a common complaint. I couldn't help but laugh at the 100days for white Caledonians and 100 years and still waiting for the Manitobans.

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We already know the impact of having non-Native authority on our lands, so why would we go back to doing the same thing over again.
Most first nations would not be economically viable as true soveriegn states, as a result, the first nations need to be part of a larger economic entity like Canada. Accepting non-aborignal authority over your lands is a price you have to pay for the priviledge of being part of Canada and having Canadian citizenship.

BTW: you have just admitted that you are demanding special rights because of your ethnic background.

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Talk about things being propitious.....

Here is an article off of CP from this morning:

Native land claim disputes simmering

Backlog of cases blamed for recent escalation of tensions

By SUE BAILEY and PETER ST-ARNAUD The Canadian Press

OTTAWA — More Caledonia-type conflicts are brewing as the number of native land claims nears 800 and the average wait time for settlements tops nine years.

The most complicated cases take longer. It’s not unusual for the federal justice department to take five years to draft a legal opinion on a claim’s basic merits.

Indian Affairs Minister Jim Prentice says he plans a major "retooling" of a badly flawed system that critics blame for rising tensions and stunted development.

"The backlog is not acceptable and we’re working on it," Prentice said in an interview.

"Claims vary in complexity. But by any measure, the current system is not working effectively."

A three-day conference starting Wednesday in Gatineau, Que. will gather experts on ways to push for improvements.

Prentice says he’s considering increased mediation, more skilled negotiators and other ways to simplify a notoriously cumbersome process. More funding may also be needed for a system that cost Ottawa $536 million in 2004-05 to negotiate, settle and implement land claims.

Prentice led more than 50 public inquiries into such cases as co-chairman of the federal Indian Claims Commission. He was a bared-tooth critic of the sluggish pace of settlements while in opposition.

Today, communities embroiled in often testy disputes across Canada are looking to him for answers.

Prentice says he appreciates that "there’s frustration out there."

It most recently erupted in Caledonia, near Hamilton, Ont., in a series of nasty confrontations over a subdivision on land reclaimed by Six Nations members.

In Manitoba, a half dozen bands threatened this week to block rail lines around the province as part of a 24-hour protest over delayed land claims.

On Tuesday, aboriginals in northern Quebec announced they have relaunched a lawsuit that now seeks $11 billion in damages for 13 hydroelectric dams built 50 years ago on territory they claim as their own.

The Pessamit Innu originally filed a $500-million lawsuit with Quebec Superior Court in 1998, but agreed to put it aside four years ago to pursue negotiations with the Quebec government.

Now Innu chief Raphael Picard says those negotiations are going nowhere.

"There is no more good faith," he told a news conference in Montreal. "There is no progress at the table."

The reactivated claim, which targets both the federal and provincial governments as well as Crown corporation Hydro-Quebec, argues the band’s ancestral rights were violated when 13 power dams were built on the province’s north shore during the 1950s and ’60s.

Prentice blames the former Liberal government for letting the number of unsettled specific claims soar from about 200 to more than 750 over the last 13 years.

Yep...you have to love the speed of government.

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Accepting non-aborignal authority over your lands is a price you have to pay for the priviledge of being part of Canada and having Canadian citizenship.

Accepting non-Aboriginal authority over our own land is little more than prepetuating a system that has been a proven failure, which is why I'm confused by your position on this matter. You want us to banish the reserve system and have no treaty rights, but then encourage doing things the same way anyway?

Besides, bear in mind that Natives didn't ask for Canadian citizenship. It was imposed on us in the 1950's by law as an Indian Act amendment, so it appears a tad disingenuous that we should give up our land in exchange for something imposed on us by non-Native law.

That's the same as when Goebbels called the German retreat from Russia an advance into the Balkans.

We aren't that stupid, river, so quit assuming that we are. What's next? Offers of trinkets, baubles and whiskey?

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Accepting non-Aboriginal authority over our own land is little more than perpetuating a system that has been a proven failure, which is why I'm confused by your position on this matter.
The anglo-saxon system of property rights has been the basis for economic prosperity for virtually every society that adopts it. The problem with the current reserve system is natives groups were not given basic fee simple rights to the land that they already had.
Besides, bear in mind that Natives didn't ask for Canadian citizenship. It was imposed on us in the 1950's by law as an Indian Act amendment, so it appears a tad disingenuous that we should give up our land in exchange for something imposed on us by non-Native law.
So why don't you organize a referendum on the territory that you claim and separate from Canada? That approach would give you all of the land rights you want. You should not waste time taking about how Canadian citizenship was imposed unless you are willing to give it up. As long as you want to retain the right to work in Canada you benefit from being a Canadian citizen.
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River:

The anglo-saxon system of property rights has been the basis for economic prosperity for virtually every society that adopts it.

I'll admit that the system works for Anglo-saxons, but certainly not everyone else who has been colonized. The system has been installed in Africa, and much like what happens here and in the U.S., only a very few people have most of the wealth. The only difference being the lack of a large middle class in African countries, but then again, the system wasn't designed to create a middle class, but to ensure that a country's wealth keeps to a minimum of hands.

The problem with the current reserve system is natives groups were not given basic fee simple rights to the land that they already had.

I agree. But then the fee simple means that you must pay tax to the Crown or your land is forfeit. That is why Natives shy away from fee simple as it currently stands, because the land continues to ultimately belong to the Crown...and that will never sit well with native people. Read what occurred to the Roseau River folks at the turn of the last century a few posts back and that will give you an idea on why Natives don't want fee simple lands.

Interestingly enough, some provinces have tried to overcome this issue by creating a form of land ownership called "similar to fee simple", so that taxes need not be collected from the Natives by the province, but rather that the Natives can collect those taxes from their own people.

Interesting concept.

So why don't you organize a referendum on the territory that you claim and separate from Canada? That approach would give you all of the land rights you want. You should not waste time taking about how Canadian citizenship was imposed unless you are willing to give it up. As long as you want to retain the right to work in Canada you benefit from being a Canadian citizen.

Yeah right...separate from Canada when the Crown still maintains the land is theirs. I'll separate as soon as the land is returned, and you can keep your money and treaty rights.

However, if Quebec ever decides to separate, I might just take you up on the offer if we fight les Quebecois and take the northern half of the former province.

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