RFK Jr. too goddamn crazy for even the crazy NY Post

[gatomontes99]

2 minutes ago, DUI_Offender said:

This has to do with protection of children...screw your "controlling."

If a child has not been vaccinated, they should not be allowed in public schools. 

And you are saying they have to accept risks that you approve of and not accept risks they are comfortable with. It is a very authoritarian and selfish position to take.

[Black Dog]

9 minutes ago, gatomontes99 said:

All you are doing is making emotional arguments for controlling people. You won't listen to reason.

Here's some facts:

You are willing to put other people's children at risk of diseases you won't expose your own kids to.

You lied when you said RFK Jr did not say "“there’s no vaccine that is safe and effective."

You seem ignorant of the concept of herd immunity and what it entails.

Anything else, shithead?

 

2 minutes ago, gatomontes99 said:

And you are saying they have to accept risks that you approve of and not accept risks they are comfortable with. It is a very authoritarian and selfish position to take.

Zero self awareness.

[gatomontes99]

5 minutes ago, Black Dog said:

Here's some facts:

You are willing to put other people's children at risk of diseases you won't expose your own kids to.

No. I'm willing to allow other people to make decisions for themselves. I made my decision. I won't deprive them of theirs.

6 minutes ago, Black Dog said:

You lied when you said RFK Jr did not say "“there’s no vaccine that is safe and effective."

I didn't lie. I produced the context by posting his actual statements from the official transcripts from the interview. You are using a fragment of a sentence to define a lengthy and nuanced thought. Your assertion that the totality of his opinions on vaccinations comes down to half a sentence is disingenuous.

10 minutes ago, Black Dog said:

You seem ignorant of the concept of herd immunity and what it entails.

You are projecting. 

Herd immunity applies to vaccines that aren't highly effective. If a vaccine was, as an example, 75% effective at preventing illness, the herd would act like Swiss cheese slices. The virus got travel in small areas and reach some people, but those that do get good protection would act like a barrier.

If a vaccine is highly effective, like the Polio vaccine as an example, then herd immunity isn't relative to those that are vaccinated as they are well protected.

You seem to be justifying forced immunization because people that are immunized would be at risk. At the same time, you are arguing that vaccines are so amazing you can't get sick. If the later is true then the former isn't needed.

[Black Dog]

15 hours ago, gatomontes99 said:

No. I'm willing to allow other people to make decisions for themselves. I made my decision. I won't deprive them of theirs.

That doesn't counter anything I said. You decided the risk to yiour kids was unacceptable, but you think other people should be able to place their kids at risk with the kids themselves getting no say if they end up paralyzed or dead.

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I didn't lie. I produced the context by posting his actual statements from the official transcripts from the interview.

Liar:

17 hours ago, gatomontes99 said:

Well, I posted the full quote, in context, where you guys claimed he was saying that all vaccines are unsafe and ineffective. He clearly did not say that or believe that. 

He did say that, thus you lied.

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You are using a fragment of a sentence to define a lengthy and nuanced thought. Your assertion that the totality of his opinions on vaccinations comes down to half a sentence is disingenuous.

But it does reflect his views on vaccines, it's not a complicated position.

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You are projecting. 

Herd immunity applies to vaccines that aren't highly effective. If a vaccine was, as an example, 75% effective at preventing illness, the herd would act like Swiss cheese slices. The virus got travel in small areas and reach some people, but those that do get good protection would act like a barrier.

If a vaccine is highly effective, like the Polio vaccine as an example, then herd immunity isn't relative to those that are vaccinated as they are well protected.

Nope. Polio vaccine is 99% effective at preventing polio but you still need to reach a threshold of vaccinated people to prevent the disease from circulating among those who are unable for whatever reason to get vaccinated. If you exceed that threshold you can effectively eradicate a disease entirely.

What you want to do is reduce that threshold so diseases like polio, measles etc to rip through the population.

Quote

You seem to be justifying forced immunization because people that are immunized would be at risk. At the same time, you are arguing that vaccines are so amazing you can't get sick. If the later is true then the former isn't needed.

No stupid, I recognize that there are people who can't get immunized for whatever reason and that they, as well as kids who's parents are too stupid to do the right thing, shouldn't be placed at additional risk on the say-so of loons like you and RFK Jr.

[gatomontes99]

40 minutes ago, Black Dog said:

That doesn't counter anything I said. You decided the risk to yiour kids was unacceptable, but you think other people should be able to place their kids at risk with the kids themselves getting no say if they end up paralyzed or dead.

Yes. I absolutely do think it is their right to choose what drugs or vaccines they put in their body and their children's body.

41 minutes ago, Black Dog said:

Liar:

He did say that, thus you lied.

But it does reflect his views on vaccines, it's not a complicated position.

He also said a lot more about unintended and unstudied consequences. And he has never, to my knowledge, asserted that all vaccines should be banned. He has only asserted that it should be a choice. I agree. I didn't lie. You lied.

43 minutes ago, Black Dog said:

No stupid, I recognize that there are people who can't get immunized for whatever reason and that they, as well as kids who's parents are too stupid to do the right thing, shouldn't be placed at additional risk on the say-so of loons like you and RFK Jr.

Why do they get to force other people to take risks? What makes them a protected class that can lord over the populous and demand that all others take a risk that the protected class has deemed ok?

[Black Dog]

Just now, gatomontes99 said:

Yes. I absolutely do think it is their right to choose what drugs or vaccines they put in their body and their children's body.

And you believe they have the right to infect other people with preventable communicable diseases.

Quote

He also said a lot more about unintended and unstudied consequences. And he has never, to my knowledge, asserted that all vaccines should be banned. He has only asserted that it should be a choice. I agree. I didn't lie. You lied.

I never said he wanted vaccines banned, so this is another lie from you, how many are we at now?

Quote

Why do they get to force other people to take risks? What makes them a protected class that can lord over the populous and demand that all others take a risk that the protected class has deemed ok?

Why do the scumbag antivaxxers get to put other people at risk? What makes them a protected class that can lord over the populous and demand that all others assume the sam risk they have chosen for themselves?

[gatomontes99]

12 minutes ago, Black Dog said:

And you believe they have the right to infect other people with preventable communicable diseases.

Let's not be ridiculous. What are saying here? People should be held accountable for viruses they spread? I can file a law suit against someone for a cold or flu?

I believe people have the right to make their own decisions. There is no right to intentionally infect someone. Unintentionally, because they didn't want to take a vaccine, is their decision. You don't have a right to force them to do what you wish just because you think it's a good idea.

16 minutes ago, Black Dog said:

I never said he wanted vaccines banned, so this is another lie from you, how many are we at now?

You heavily implied it.

17 minutes ago, Black Dog said:

Why do the scumbag antivaxxers get to put other people at risk? What makes them a protected class that can lord over the populous and demand that all others assume the sam risk they have chosen for themselves?

They are protected because it is their rights you are trying to violate.

[Black Dog]

1 hour ago, gatomontes99 said:

Let's not be ridiculous. What are saying here? People should be held accountable for viruses they spread? I can file a law suit against someone for a cold or flu?

lol what. I'm saying people have a moral duty to take measures to protect the community.

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I believe people have the right to make their own decisions. There is no right to intentionally infect someone. Unintentionally, because they didn't want to take a vaccine, is their decision. You don't have a right to force them to do what you wish just because you think it's a good idea.

Typical conservative, all about me me me, no interest in any greater responsibilities. Toddler ideology.

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You heavily implied it.

lmao "RFK jr didn't say the things he actually said but you clearly meant something you didn't say" f*ck off nerd.

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They are protected because it is their rights you are trying to violate.

there's no right to be a disease vector. If people don't want to vaccinate their kids because they have crackpot ideas about their safety and effectiveness, fine, but they should have to homeschool them.

Edited February 6 by Black Dog

[Black Dog]

"Let people choose, what's the worst that can happen?"

In July 2018, two nurses in Samoa prepared a measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine for two 12-month-old children. Instead of diluting the vaccine powder in water, they inadvertently diluted it with a muscle relaxant. Both infants immediately stopped breathing and died as a result. One nurse tried to cover up her error by taking the empty bottle of the muscle relaxant home after retrieving it from the garbage. Both were later sentenced to five years in prison.

RFK Jr. seized upon the story as proof that the MMR vaccine was deadly, spending months highlighting the two deaths on Facebook. After it had become clear that the MMR vaccine hadn’t caused the infant deaths, RFK Jr. visited Samoa, appearing alongside prominent local anti-vaccine activists and meeting with senior officials. Influenced in part by RFK Jr., the Samoan government suspended its measles vaccination program for 10 months. Immunization rates plummeted from 74 percent in 2017 to 31 percent in late 2018, precipitating a massive outbreak of measles. Between September and December 2019, at least 5,700 people suffered measles and 83 died, most of the deaths were in children less than four years of age.

On November 19, 2019, in the midst of the measles outbreak, RFK Jr. wrote a 4-page letter to the Samoan prime minister, stating, “To safeguard public health during the current infection and in the future, it is critical that the Samoan Health Ministry determine, scientifically, if the outbreak was caused by inadequate vaccine coverage or alternatively, by a defective vaccine.” Fortunately, no one was listening to RFK Jr. anymore. The Samoan Health Ministry launched a vaccination campaign in late November 2019 and, within five days, had immunized more than 17,000 people. The outbreak subsided.

Edited February 6 by Black Dog

[NAME REMOVED]

27 minutes ago, Black Dog said:

"Let people choose, what's the worst that can happen?"

In July 2018, two nurses in Samoa prepared a measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine for two 12-month-old children. Instead of diluting the vaccine powder in water, they inadvertently diluted it with a muscle relaxant. Both infants immediately stopped breathing and died as a result. One nurse tried to cover up her error by taking the empty bottle of the muscle relaxant home after retrieving it from the garbage. Both were later sentenced to five years in prison.

RFK Jr. seized upon the story as proof that the MMR vaccine was deadly, spending months highlighting the two deaths on Facebook. After it had become clear that the MMR vaccine hadn’t caused the infant deaths, RFK Jr. visited Samoa, appearing alongside prominent local anti-vaccine activists and meeting with senior officials. Influenced in part by RFK Jr., the Samoan government suspended its measles vaccination program for 10 months. Immunization rates plummeted from 74 percent in 2017 to 31 percent in late 2018, precipitating a massive outbreak of measles. Between September and December 2019, at least 5,700 people suffered measles and 83 died, most of the deaths were in children less than four years of age.

On November 19, 2019, in the midst of the measles outbreak, RFK Jr. wrote a 4-page letter to the Samoan prime minister, stating, “To safeguard public health during the current infection and in the future, it is critical that the Samoan Health Ministry determine, scientifically, if the outbreak was caused by inadequate vaccine coverage or alternatively, by a defective vaccine.” Fortunately, no one was listening to RFK Jr. anymore. The Samoan Health Ministry launched a vaccination campaign in late November 2019 and, within five days, had immunized more than 17,000 people. The outbreak subsided.

Doing some number crunching here,,,

 

Samoa has a population of 205,000

The United States has a population of 341,000,000

The USA has approximately 1,659 times the population of Samoa.  That would be the equivalent of 94,558,634 cases of measles in America, and 137,697 deaths. 

And that is just measles. If we factor in all diseases that can be prevented by vaccinations, it's safe to say 1,000,000 children can die if RFK Jr convinced the nation no to get children vaccinated.

[Black Dog]

1 minute ago, DUI_Offender said:

Doing some number crunching here,,,

Samoa has a population of 205,000

The United States has a population of 341,000,000

The USA has approximately 1,659 times the population of Samoa.  That would be the equivalent of 94,558,634 cases of measles in America, and 137,697 deaths. 

And that is just measles. If we factor in all diseases that can be prevented by vaccinations, it's safe to say 1,000,000 children can die if RFK Jr convinced the nation no to get children vaccinated.

well sure but look on the bright side at least they won't be questioning their genders.

[Legato]

19 hours ago, DUI_Offender said:

If a child has not been vaccinated, they should not be allowed in public schools. 

If that statement is extrapolated to it's logical conclusion then the vaccinated kids should have protection from those that are not.

[Black Dog]

1 hour ago, Legato said:

If that statement is extrapolated to it's logical conclusion then the vaccinated kids should have protection from those that are not.

It's not about protecting the vaccinated, it's about keeping the numbers of the unvaccinated low.

[Black Dog]

Good news for @gatomontes99.

Measles outbreak erupts in one of Texas’ least vaccinated counties

Quote

Gaines County has one of the lowest vaccination rates in the state of Texas and has among the highest rates of children with "conscientious exemptions" to school vaccination requirements.

According to state data for the 2023–2024 school year, only about 82 percent of kindergarteners in public schools in Gaines County were up to date on their vaccinations, including doses of Measles, Mumps, and Rubella (MMR) vaccine. The public health target for vaccination coverage is 95 percent, which is the level that can prevent community spread of vaccine-preventable diseases and shield vulnerable members, including children too young to vaccinate and people with compromised immune systems.

With 82 percent vaccinated, Gaines County ranks in the bottom ten counties with the lowest coverage among those reporting data (four counties out of over 250 did not report). Nearly 18 percent of kindergarteners in Gaines have conscientious exemptions, which is an exemption from school vaccination requirements based on reasons of conscience, including a religious belief.

Still, the county-wide number obscures pockets of yet lower vaccination rates. That includes the independent public school district in Loop, in the northeast corner of Gaines, which had a vaccination rate of 46 percent in the 2023–2024 school year.

Holbrooks noted that the county has a large religious community with private religious schools. These may have yet lower vaccination rates. Holbrooks said that, so far, the measles cases being seen and traced in the outbreak are linked to those private schools.