Why we must prevent Harper from becoming PM

[rbacon]

The main reason to vote for Harper is he is not a thief, a common known thief.

[emailforcanada]

Perhaps I misunderstood the threads of discussion on harper's day care plan.

Look back in time. Every party has had its share of corruption and

scandal. To say that every single member of a particular party is

either corrupt or perfectly pure is just too general. IT doesn't make

sense. There are decent hard working and honest people in every

party... there are also a few who just do not cut it ...and yes - every

party has had it's share of scandal. The Copnservative is not immune to

that and what really turned many of us off is that Harper and others

have tried to make out that that they are so absolutely pure and

honest, and yet their very own actions show they are tending to lean

towards the very same politcal games they accuse others of.

Do we need to recall the prevous governments that had scandals and that

happen to be Conservative?? Does that mean that every single member of

every following Conservative party is also corrupt?.

The truth is that no one party is immune adn for any party to claim

that their own name has never been tarnished says a lot about the

leader. In this case Harper and it is why he loses credability..

Well - clearly Harper's Day care plan is not sitting well with many moms... another reason not to pick him as leader.

Have you ever noticed the way that election ads are run in

the US. Always very viscous and always attacking their opponents with

negative and exaggerated statements. With his first shot across the bow,

Harper shows yet again that he would like to see Canada to be more like the US.

I say let's be proud of what we have, stay with our Canadian values and let's have political

ads that have something constructive to say about why we should vote

for someone. Harper again loses huge amounts of credability using this

immature approach. This is the action of a bitter desperate politician

who is trying to win back a loss. It illusrates that Harper cabn act

very unprofressional and that would be reason #9 why he should never be

PM. This type of approach shows he is willing to say anything just to

try and get elected...the very same type of behaviour that he is

accusing others of, while hypicrotically claiming to be so pure and

ethical.

Well I don't know where you got your polls about your moms. My moms are all excited about Harper's plan!

I do agree, let's have the good old Canadian values back. Get rid of the corruptions...especially those who reek of it. Corruptions is not part of our values!

Wouldn't it be hyprocritical, don't you think if on one hand we talk about staying with Canadian values, then on the other hand we accept the corruptions and the lies and the mob...as part of our own?

Is corruption so intricately ingrained in our younger set that they no longer see anything wrong with it? Worse, they embrace it as one of the great values of Canada?

=Melanie_,Jan 4 2006, 08:09 PM]

There is no point in giving someone $1200 and saying "go find child care" when there is no care to be found.

This is exactly the whole point. Parents having choices...and not being dictated to by the government how to raise their children!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Some choice when one of the options isn't there. You can have any colour of Model-T as long as it's black.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

eh?

[Guest eureka]

One good reason not to vote for Harper is that he has no control of his temper or tongue. He has already lost it and degenerated to type.

His attack on Martin over CSL is about as low as any politician can get. It is understandable that some of the conned who post here cannot grasp the situation with CSL even though it is explained. After all, it is a little complocated )not very, though) and their minds must be tired out memorizing the slogans.

There is no excuse for Harper since he knows the reality and claims to understan taxation.

He has become one of the forbidden words of the forum.

[kimmy]

Harper's quip about CSL was an entirely fitting response to Martin's continued blather about trying to make his self-proclaimed Patriotism an election issue. Martin's efforts on that front should be embarrassing to any Canadian with an IQ over about 50, and he ought to be ashamed. Harper gave him exactly the kind of response he deserved.

As low as a politician can get? That's a laugh. We've seen politicians go a hell of a lot lower in recent years. Physically assaulting a handicapped guy, or joking about the RCMP pepper-spraying of peaceful protestors, for instance.

-k

[err]

Well - clearly Harper's Day care plan is not sitting well with many moms... another reason not to pick him as leader.

First, what a wonderful post (the starter), but on this account you are totally wrong.....

You give Harper way too much credit. He does not have a "day care" plan... he's offering a child tax credit. Further, he's planning to dismember what the Liberals have started with respect to implementation of a real day-care plan, so realistically, Harper's plan is and anti-daycare plan.

[geoffrey]

Well - clearly Harper's Day care plan is not sitting well with many moms... another reason not to pick him as leader.

First, what a wonderful post (the starter), but on this account you are totally wrong.....

You give Harper way too much credit. He does not have a "day care" plan... he's offering a child tax credit. Further, he's planning to dismember what the Liberals have started with respect to implementation of a real day-care plan, so realistically, Harper's plan is and anti-daycare plan.

There is no day-care system currently, so its tough to label someone as anti-daycare. As well, its not Federal jurisdiction so I have yet to figure out why any of the Premiers won't stand up and say no. I guess when Martin promises to correct the fiscal imbalance even minutely, they'll jump at that worm.

The last thing we need is more in Ottawa. Where's Ralph when you need him?

[Guest eureka]

How about finding a real defense for Harper, kimmy?

Harper raised the issue fully knowing that CSL is registered in Canada: flies the Canadian flag; and pays taxes in Canada.

Harper knows that CSL International is an entirely separate entity operating out of New York and doing what every other shipping company in the world does.

It was despicable and any politician who stoops to that kind of smear is unfitted to be even a Page in Parliament.

[err]

Well - clearly Harper's Day care plan is not sitting well with many moms... another reason not to pick him as leader.

First, what a wonderful post (the starter), but on this account you are totally wrong.....

You give Harper way too much credit. He does not have a "day care" plan... he's offering a child tax credit. Further, he's planning to dismember what the Liberals have started with respect to implementation of a real day-care plan, so realistically, Harper's plan is and anti-daycare plan.

There is no day-care system currently, so its tough to label someone as anti-daycare. As well, its not Federal jurisdiction so I have yet to figure out why any of the Premiers won't stand up and say no.

The Liberals have the framework and financing in place for a national day-care system.... Not strong enough, but they have finally started.... And Stephen Harper wants to cancel what has already started. I think that accurately constitutes an anti-daycare position.....

[shoop]

The Prime Minister of Canada should be held to a higher standard.

I like the despicable smear.

Martinites just don't get it. Such histrionics only makes them look bad. Of course CSL is fair game. Why wouldn't it be? You really don't understand why you are losing this election.

To any and all Liberals honestly answer this question. If it were Harper's company, would it be fair game for the Liberals to use it? Or would it be despicable?

How about finding a real defense for Harper, kimmy?

Harper raised the issue fully knowing that CSL is registered in Canada: flies the Canadian flag; and pays taxes in Canada.

Harper knows that CSL International is an entirely separate entity operating out of New York and doing what every other shipping company in the world does.

It was despicable and any politician who stoops to that kind of smear is unfitted to be even a Page in Parliament.

[tml12]

Check This Out:

-->Martin says Harper can't say whether he loves Canada

In reality Harper was taken aback by such a random question. Martin flies the flags of other countries on his ships not to pay Canadian taxes his Liberal Party is responsible for. I guess he doesn't trust the Liberal government with his money (right on Martin, neither do I!!!)

-->Liberal TV ads say Harper supported the Iraq war.

So did Martin!!!

-->The Liberal Party says they are responsible for social programs and health care that is universal.

Responsible for dismantling them that is. Martin and Chretien did their best to destroy universal health care and social programs in 1995.

-->Martin says only the Liberals can protect federalism.

The West is alienated, Quebec is alienated, Ontario doesn't care, etc. Why would I trust Harper on federalism???

The list goes on and on and on and on and on and on...

[kimmy]

How about finding a real defense for Harper, kimmy?

Harper raised the issue fully knowing that CSL is registered in Canada: flies the Canadian flag; and pays taxes in Canada.

Harper knows that CSL International is an entirely separate entity operating out of New York and doing what every other shipping company in the world does.

It was despicable and any politician who stoops to that kind of smear is unfitted to be even a Page in Parliament.

Well then (to borrow a page from your book) Martin has ample opportunity to articulate that and refute it. If it's as loathesome as you say, then surely it'll backfire on Harper. Canadians can be the judge of that, and of Martin's self-professed patriotism.

-k

[scribblet]

One good reason not to vote for Harper is that he has no control of his temper or tongue. He has already lost it and degenerated to type.

His attack on Martin over CSL is about as low as any politician can get. It is understandable that some of the conned who post here cannot grasp the situation with CSL even though it is explained. After all, it is a little complocated )not very, though) and their minds must be tired out memorizing the slogans.

There is no excuse for Harper since he knows the reality and claims to understan taxation.

He has become one of the forbidden words of the forum.

Let me see, when Martin gets angry and he gets apoplectic - its good. When Harper gets angry - its bad.

Its sure not as low as the liberals have sunk with their ad using a shooting gun, 'Vote Liberal or the Kids Get it' ....... http://www.katewerk.com/temp/gun_girl.gif

nor as low as they have sunk with their corruption. It is not as low as Scot Brison and his malicious and false statements (which he apologized for) , nor is it as low as Joe Volpe with his comments I won't repeat.

http://www.ndp.ca/page/2804

www.flyourflag.ca

[Guest eureka]

I suppose that you too have difficulty with comprehension, Scriblett.

Harper insinuated that Martin is evading taxes on CSL when Harper knows that he is not. I can excuse the ignorance shown by a few on these forums who seized on this earlier since they could not have been expected to know they were being lied to.

I cannot excuse this in Harper and I repeat that it is the lowest bit of sleaze that I have heard of in any political campaign that I ahve followed.

[Canuck E Stan]

Eureka,

If only you had been born in this country,you would truly understand being Canadian.

[The Honest Politician]

My family has been in this country for over 200 years. The fact you even suggest someone's ideas or perceptions are wrong based on place of birth, skin colour or sex is just kind of attitude that perverts the conservative party. It is a perfect example of the kind of reasoning Harper will be using during international affairs.

[willy]

The trust worthy Scott Brison will say anything. All the old Harper speeches got me thinking about some of the Liberal turn coats. Belinda had one of the best quotes for Martin "Either he is corrupt or incompetent."

Below is a partial record of recent lies and a memory back to what he stated to believe before he flipped.

This is why we must prevent the Liberals from getting back in. They have a hidden agenda that is still hidden.

Globe and Mail Nov 21, 2005

Public Works Minister Scott Brison stood in the House of Commons and publicly apologized for saying that Opposition Leader Stephen Harper had breached federal lobbying laws while he was head of the National Citizens' Coalition.

Mr. Brison also tabled the apology letter that he had sent to Mr. Harper.

"Mr. Speaker, today I rise on a point of order to clarify remarks I made in the House," Mr. Brison said Monday.

He apologized for statements made in a press release sent out by the Liberals on Nov. 4.

In the letter, he says that a statement he made saying that the National Citizens' Coalition (which Mr. Harper headed up before joining the Conservative Party) had been charged under the Canada Elections Act, was simply not true. He also said it is untrue that Mr. Harper and the NCC had contravened any federal lobbying law while he was president.

Tory leadership hopeful Scott Brison believes Canadians should be given some leeway to pay for their own health-care services, a move that he believes would reduce waiting lists in the public system.

We need to replace corporate welfare with dramatic corporate tax reductions and replace failed regional economic development programs, because the market can pick winners and losers better than you or I.”He also advocated the restoration of balanced funding of health care between the federal government and the provinces.Brison, the finance critic for the Tories, attacked Liberal spending policies.

[kimmy]

The trust worthy Scott Brison will say anything. All the old Harper speeches got me thinking about some of the Liberal turn coats. Belinda had one of the best quotes for Martin "Either he is corrupt or incompetent."

Below is a partial record of recent lies and a memory back to what he stated to believe before he flipped.

This is why we must prevent the Liberals from getting back in. They have a hidden agenda that is still hidden.

one of my favorite CBC moments of 2005 (not that there were many) was when Rick Mercer more or less called Brison a fag on his show.

-k

[scribblet]

I suppose that you too have difficulty with comprehension, Scriblett.

Maybe if you stopped with the personal attacks there could be discussion.

[Guest eureka]

Then stop making attacks, scriblett, and try discussion. I have not seen much of that from you. Incidentally, for length of time in Canada, my wife is said to be descended from the first white child born in North America. I think, too, your snide remark about my not understanding Canadians is somewhat misplaced and typical of the defensive parochialism of the Conservative.

[scribblet]

I havn't made any personal attacks, and asking you to stop is not a personal attack.

[cybercoma]

Then stop making attacks, scriblett, and try discussion. I have not seen much of that from you. Incidentally, for length of time in Canada, my wife is said to be descended from the first white child born in North America. I think, too, your snide remark about my not understanding Canadians is somewhat misplaced and typical of the defensive parochialism of the Conservative.

When does your autobiography come out? Your life story, as you have posted it, seems truly remarkable. You never did finish the story about the time you had tea with the royal family.

[emailforcanada]

There has been a point made on various threads that we need inexperience because the Liberals have been in too long. I believe that this needs to be addressed in the context of this topic.

A little inexperience and fresh eyes are good... Greens, NDP and yes

even some of the newer Liberal candidats can provide that if that is

all you really want.

Too much inexperience in one party in not good and couple that with the

fact that the Conservatives now are still a relatively new entity

having merged with of a previous entity (reform / Alliance) who

representated a very different set of beliefs in many ways. They are

still settling out what the party really is.

The currnet Conservatives have not had enough longevity and are made up

of a lot of inexperienced members (according to the post above). Top

that with a leader who is also inexperienced.

Whatever we believe about the current Government, running a country is

tough and takes a lot of experience. Make no mistake about that. When

it is lacking, as it clearlty is, with a leader liek Harper, there is a

huge price to pay as unnecessary mistakes are made.

Again - this point is not intended as any disrespect to those poeple in

that party who really work hard and care about Canada sa I do..It is

just that we cannot have it all based on inexperienced just to prove a

point that a change is needed. Furthermore, as per the previous points

in the thread, Harper has shown he is not inly inexperienced, but is

capable of making really bad judgement for critial issues.

[quote name='eureka' post='86600' d

[Guest eureka]

Then I guess attacks are in the eye of the beholder. Mature debate also consists of not whining about being attacked. Take a look at Cyerbercoma who attacks all the time and doesn't realise how foolish his attacks are.

What you call attacks are a normal debating tactic.

[scribblet]

The trust worthy Scott Brison will say anything. All the old Harper speeches got me thinking about some of the Liberal turn coats. Belinda had one of the best quotes for Martin "Either he is corrupt or incompetent."

Below is a partial record of recent lies and a memory back to what he stated to believe before he flipped.

This is why we must prevent the Liberals from getting back in. They have a hidden agenda that is still hidden.

Globe and Mail Nov 21, 2005

Public Works Minister Scott Brison stood in the House of Commons and publicly apologized for saying that Opposition Leader Stephen Harper had breached federal lobbying laws while he was head of the National Citizens' Coalition.

government and the provinces.Brison, the finance critic for the Tories, attacked Liberal spending policies.

Don't forget Martins old promises, excerpted from the Liberal Gov'ts speech

In 1999, Paul Martin voted for a bill preserving the TRADITIONAL definition of marriage between and man and a woman.

"Let me state again for the record that the government has no intention of changing the definition of marriage or of legislating same sex marriages.

I fundamentally do not believe that it is necessary to change the definition of marriage in order to accommodate the equality issues around same sex partners which now face us as Canadians. The courts have ruled that some recognition must be given to the realities of unmarried cohabitation in terms of both opposite sex and same sex partners. I strongly believe that the message to the government and to all Canadian governments from the Canadian public is a message of tolerance, fairness and respect for others.

Marriage has fundamental value and importance to Canadians and we do not believe on this side of the House that importance and value is in any way threatened or undermined by others seeking to have their long term relationships recognized. I support the motion for maintaining the clear legal definition of marriage in Canada as the union of one man and one woman to the exclusion of all others."

[scribblet]

Here's one where he says he would use the not withstanding clause

Martin won't force gay marriages on churches

Government to ask Supreme Court if civil union is a viable alternative Janice Tibbetts, CanWest News Service

OTTAWA - Prime Minister Paul Martin says he would use the Constitution's notwithstanding clause if the Supreme Court rules that churches must perform gay marriages.

"Oh, yes I would," Martin said Thursday on CBC Radio when asked whether he would use the clause.

"I would look at it if it was a question of affirming a (religious) right," he said, explaining that it would be used only under extreme circumstances

http://tinyurl.com/d3org