Why is inflation so high? Because cash has grown 8 times faster than the stuff cash buys.

[CdnFox]

10 minutes ago, myata said:

You aren't only talking about it; living it too probably from day one and for as long as you're here. Monopoly sure oligopoly paradise.

I swear to god it's like yoda had a love child with a scrabble board and it's trying to explain itself.

 I KNOW you know how to speak proper english, i dont' understand why you don't?

[myata]

3 hours ago, impartialobserver said:

So that we do not go off into the weeds.. are you talking about monopoly (1 firm with 100 percent market share) or oligopoly (3 to 5 firms with 60 to 80% market share)?

Maybe in precise economy studies the terminology makes difference and you're correct of course, but by "monopolistic" I generally mean a part of economy that is controlled by a small number of agents and their interests, rather than free market forces. The difference can be seen immediately in the behavior. In a genuine free market prices move up and down because agents genuinely compete; and in a pseudo-market oligopoly they move mostly one way; once reached certain level there's no incentive for the players to reduce them. I can and want to be proven wrong, if after the pandemic crisis and this new inflation one we will begin to see normal prices for groceries, gas etc. But having an idea of Canadian economy, wouldn't count on it.

[impartialobserver]

6 minutes ago, myata said:

Maybe in precise economy studies the terminology makes difference and you're correct of course, but by "monopolistic" I generally mean a part of economy that is controlled by a small number of agents and their interests, rather than free market forces. The difference can be seen immediately in the behavior. In a genuine free market prices move up and down because agents genuinely compete; and in a pseudo-market oligopoly they move mostly one way; once reached certain level there's no incentive for the players to reduce them. I can and want to be proven wrong, if after the pandemic crisis and this new inflation one we will begin to see normal prices for groceries, gas etc. But having an idea of Canadian economy, wouldn't count on it.

what would you deem normal prices? 

[CdnFox]

20 minutes ago, myata said:

Maybe in precise economy studies the terminology makes difference and you're correct of course, but by "monopolistic" I generally mean a part of economy that is controlled by a small number of agents and their interests, rather than free market forces. The difference can be seen immediately in the behavior. In a genuine free market prices move up and down because agents genuinely compete; and in a pseudo-market oligopoly they move mostly one way; once reached certain level there's no incentive for the players to reduce them. I can and want to be proven wrong, if after the pandemic crisis and this new inflation one we will begin to see normal prices for groceries, gas etc. But having an idea of Canadian economy, wouldn't count on it.

Jezuz - i actually understood that. Why can't you talk like that ALL the time?

In response - prices will never 'go back, that would require deflation and gov'ts avoid that.

Instead what would be hoped would happen is that wages would begin to rise faster than inflation and we'll see eventually that wages reletive to the current pricing are back to the same ratio they used to be.  In other words if chicken went from 1 dollar  to 2 dollars then wages will go from 10 to 20.  That sort of thing.

But unfortunately the increases in prices that come with inflation never go away - and future inflation is compounded on those prices.  So the only hope is that wages will go up correspondingly.  Sadly - due to competition issues it looks like wage growth may lag a bit for a few years, or more.

[myata]

1 hour ago, impartialobserver said:

deem normal prices?

The pre-inflation ones. You have to try real hard to prove that the production cost of potatoes grown in Canada has gone up to 50% in just a few years. Same with bread, peaches etc. You're still paying the same, the cheapest possible or very close for the labor. Maybe the fertilizer gone up some and transportation but its fraction of a cent, per unit. So why 50%? Distribution costs? Why the cost of distribution has to hike 50%? Not until I see it line by line will I believe in the "global" ghosts of inflation. Much more likely guess hurray 'inflation', yes we can.

1 hour ago, CdnFox said:

but unfortunately the increases in prices that come with inflation never go away

Right, unfortunately you've never seen what a real, free and competitive market is like. Or long forgot. Prices are different. Players compete. You can find places with good deals. Real market does that. In a pseudo-market, they never go back. Why would they, who's interested?

[CdnFox]

49 minutes ago, myata said:

 

Right, unfortunately you've never seen what a real, free and competitive market is like. Or long forgot. Prices are different. Players compete. You can find places with good deals. Real market does that. In a pseudo-market, they never go back. Why would they, who's interested?

Well,  1) - you have no idea what i have or havent' seen and 2) - you're an !diot.  And i see you've gone back to favoring gibbersh.

And while individual prices may fluctuate on specific items overall inflation always rises, unless you get into deflation which is bad. Deflation is the sign of a seriously sinking economy.

in any case - any true free market winds up being a monopoly or at best an oligopoly. That's why even a 'free' market needs regulation to keep the playing field level.

[myata]

11 hours ago, CdnFox said:

overall inflation always rises,

Yep "overall" on paper inflation sure. Bell dings you for 1% more every six months. Union comes to get their extra %% on every renewal. Monopolistic grocery, construction and gas etc suppliers like why should we be left out of the party?

Hurray we have an "overall" inflation of 2% here! Hope you getting your automatic annual rise - like us, out of your pocket. Show must go on!

My Internet provider hasn't changed rates in years. I guess they could have bumped it up a buck or two, but it wouldn't eat up terribly into their bottom line and they value the relation with the customer higher. Why would Bell do that, if and as soon as they can squeeze extra buck from millions of their customers? Monopoly economics and "overall" inflation, only an innocent coincidence.

Edited August 22, 2023 by myata

[CdnFox]

14 minutes ago, myata said:

Yep "overall" on paper inflation sure.

If by 'on paper' you mean 'actually in the real world' then yes

It's a necessary byproduct of improving markets and wealth over time.  Zero inflation would be bad.  Runaway inflation is also bad.  That's why the goal is about 2 percent.

[myata]

22 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

That's why the goal is about 2 percent.

Monopolistic inflation isn't the same as free market one. Prices fluctuate around a long term trend but very differently in different places and sectors and there's much leeway and choice for the consumers. In Russia (and Canada) it's one "overall" rate and good luck to you, comrades. A facade pseudo-market economy run by monopolies in the background.

[impartialobserver]

15 hours ago, myata said:

The pre-inflation ones. You have to try real hard to prove that the production cost of potatoes grown in Canada has gone up to 50% in just a few years. Same with bread, peaches etc. You're still paying the same, the cheapest possible or very close for the labor. Maybe the fertilizer gone up some and transportation but its fraction of a cent, per unit. So why 50%? Distribution costs? Why the cost of distribution has to hike 50%? Not until I see it line by line will I believe in the "global" ghosts of inflation. Much more likely guess hurray 'inflation', yes we can.

Right, unfortunately you've never seen what a real, free and competitive market is like. Or long forgot. Prices are different. Players compete. You can find places with good deals. Real market does that. In a pseudo-market, they never go back. Why would they, who's interested?

So in short.. you believe that inflation is a product of some Illuminati-esque conspiracy played out on a global scale? If so... you have quite the task ahead of you proving this. However, I know that proving it in the eyes of most people equates to long posts, adamant opinions, and trying to win by way of repetition. 

[myata]

37 minutes ago, impartialobserver said:

you believe that inflation is a product of some Illuminati-esque conspiracy played out on a global scale?

Not at all. Rather monopolistic, inefficient and lazy business practices in huge sectors of the economy that do not know how to compete; have no incentives to compete; loath and abhor fair competition; and will do anything including through their political buddies to never have to. Sounds right?

[CdnFox]

3 hours ago, myata said:

Monopolistic inflation isn't the same as free market one. Prices fluctuate around a long term trend but very differently in different places and sectors and there's much leeway and choice for the consumers. In Russia (and Canada) it's one "overall" rate and good luck to you, comrades. A facade pseudo-market economy run by monopolies in the background.

Virtually none of that is accurate or relevant where it is.  I don't think you understand what a market is or how it works,  'free ' or otherwise.   A true 'free' market always winds up being a monopoly given enough time.  And it's not really the players in the market that drive inflation, it's a function of the market itself.  The market encourages people to be more efficient in creating wealth, as that happens there's a lag between the wealth being created and the value of goods, the value of goods rises to fill that and the process continues.  it's complex but it's just how it works. The only thing the gov't does is use interest rates and fiscal policy to try to level out the peaks and valleys.

[impartialobserver]

41 minutes ago, myata said:

Not at all. Rather monopolistic, inefficient and lazy business practices in huge sectors of the economy that do not know how to compete; have no incentives to compete; loath and abhor fair competition; and will do anything including through their political buddies to never have to. Sounds right?

This is akin to saying that the only reason that NBA players earn such high salaries is that the owners want to crowd out fair competition. You leave a lot of context out

 

[myata]

Just now, impartialobserver said:

You leave a lot of context out

Quite possibly. But it's a large or quite likely, the main part of it. Without an incentive to compete, real and constant driver a free market cannot exist. A facade, any time.

[myata]

13 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

it's complex but it's just how it works.

Of course, haven't ever seen it you would know exactly how it works. Why a monopolistic distributor could jack up prices by 30% overnight the moment they hear the magic word just because they can that is, feed 60% of the supermarkets. And I go to a market with a hundred of independent sellers, every one in a different situation some need to get back home 100km away asap where prices can vary same 30% between sellers or more. No has to be the same thing, the picture book said so.

Edited August 22, 2023 by myata

[impartialobserver]

3 hours ago, myata said:

Quite possibly. But it's a large or quite likely, the main part of it. Without an incentive to compete, real and constant driver a free market cannot exist. A facade, any time.

I read your posts and the only reason that prices go up in any time/place/situation is that the oligopoly owners arbitrarily jack up prices knowing that there is absolutely nothing that consumers can do. 

[CdnFox]

5 hours ago, myata said:

Of course, haven't ever seen it you would know exactly how it works. Why a monopolistic distributor could jack up prices by 30% overnight the moment they hear the magic word just because they can that is, feed 60% of the supermarkets. And I go to a market with a hundred of independent sellers, every one in a different situation some need to get back home 100km away asap where prices can vary same 30% between sellers or more. No has to be the same thing, the picture book said so.

This stuff is just over your head. I appreciate you like buying discount or no name brands but maybe stop doing that with your meds.

[myata]

3 hours ago, impartialobserver said:

I read your posts and the only reason that prices go up in any time/place/situation is that the oligopoly owners arbitrarily jack up prices knowing that there is absolutely nothing that consumers can do. 

Not the only, that's an oversimplification. But just observing, Canada has a different kind of inflation than genuine free market economies. It can be observed first hand. You won't find automatic raises on the clock just because the paper printed some number.