NDP Liberal Coalition

[Argus]

The hikes in costs for Ontario power has nothing to do with lower efficiencies and everything to do with paying off the massive debt incurred during years of incompetent management - not to mention increased fuel, the cost of all those meters the government wants to install, and closing down oil fired generators.

Again completely untrue.

Overhead in the private sector is virtually without exception higher then the public sector.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Drivel. The inefficiencies of the Public sector are legendary. And I see them every day.

[Argus]

Costs in the private sector in the US have been shown to be about 15% higher than in a private sector comparison. All the Canadian Commisions have said that. And 15a5 comes to billions of dollars.

The cost comes largely from the paperwork and bureaucracy. I don't remember what the amounts of time are, but in America, physicians spend far more time on office work and less on medical work than Canadians by a considerable margin.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This is true, but uniquely so with regard to the massive confusion of the US health care sector. In every other sector I can think of the private sector operates with far more efficiency than the public sector.

[theloniusfleabag]

Dear Black Dog,

non-threatening to soft Liberal supporters who vote Liberal more out of fear of the alternatives than any commitment to that party and its policies.

I think you hit the nail on the head...Canadian voters feel 'safe' casting their vote right down the middle (or the toilet, whatever the case may be). Any good chance an 'alternative' or 'reform-minded' party might have is to go after this vote, not the far right or left. That is why the Greens and the "new, Improved" Conservative parties have failed to make the big time.

What's Mel Hurtig up to nowadays?

[August1991]

You are assuming the cost is identical in both cases. It is not. In most cases, the cost in the private sector is considerably lower due to efficiencies. Thus even with the added profit they can still provide services cheaper than the public sector.

Completely untrue.

The hikes in costs for Ontario power has nothing to do with lower efficiencies and everything to do with paying off the massive debt incurred during years of incompetent management - not to mention increased fuel, the cost of all those meters the government wants to install, and closing down oil fired generators.

Again completely untrue.

Overhead in the private sector is virtually without exception higher then the public sector.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This thread is really off topic but anyway...

Yaro, by your logic, the government should run everything because it would cost less. We wouldn't have any mark-ups or profit margins.

IOW, you think the Soviet Union was a great idea - everything State-run.

[I Miss Trudeau]

Drivel. The inefficiencies of the Public sector are legendary. And I see them every day.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Nonsense. The inefficiencies of the Private sector are legendary. And I see them every day. Furthermore, my dad can beat up your dad.

[Leader Circle]

How many times will Layton play this, "making parliment work" card? People have to be seeing through it! I don't see Layton pulling the pin, there is so much more he can squeeze out of a desperate man.

The CPC has to stay back from the Bloc right now and Harper needs Layton to call this shot. I just don't see all of these things aligning themselves for the greater good. I think the CPC needs to time to build in the polls, before the trigger is pulled.

The more we hear from Chretien is going to bring the Liberals back down.

[Yodeler]

How many times will Layton play this, "making parliment work" card?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It's called "blackmail"!

That's what Rick Harrison calls it in his letter to the NP today. He says:

"Instead of bringing down this corrupt party, NDP leader Jack Layton does what any other Third World politician would do; blackmail them for his own benefit. What a country!"

[shoop]

It's called "blackmail"!

That's what Rick Harrison calls it in his letter to the NP today. He says:

"Instead of bringing down this corrupt party, NDP leader Jack Layton does what any other Third World politician would do; blackmail them for his own benefit. What a country!"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Entirely typical of many third world politician. Sells his supporters on the 'great deal' he made, then the docile sheep say nothing when the head of the country reneges on the deal. Jacko you are an all star!

[August1991]

What's this I hear that Layton needs the weekend to study a 5-page document?

I think rather that both Layton and Martin want this waiting-game to last because it makes them both look good. Martin appears to be someone who can manage a "crisis" and Layton appears to be someone who can deliver the goods. Neither of them want an election now and so we won't have one.

[August1991]

Mr. Layton described the government's proposal as "comprehensive" and "complex," even though the letter from Health Minister Ujjal Dosanjh to NDP health critic Jean Crowder is only four pages long.

Correction, four pages.

"Mr. Layton has said he wishes to review the proposal over the next few days. Out of respect for his desire to work with the NDP to achieve our shared goal of strengthening public health care further, Minister Dosanjh will not be making any public comments while his deliberations are under way."

The NDP official confirmed that Mr. Dosanjh's letter contained a pledge to stop tax dollars from going to doctors who practise "double dipping," delivering the same services in both the public and private systems.

The New Democrats have also called for changes to the Federal-Provincial Fiscal Arrangements Act that would require provinces to report the size of their private health-care systems.

There is something truly bizarre about two guys, Ujjal Dosanjh and Jack Layton, negotiating alone the broad framework of Canada's health system. Only in the Soviet Union were such decisions taken in such a way.

The House of Commons does not sit next week. When it returns, the Conservatives have an opposition day on Tuesday, Nov. 15, and the Bloc Québécois has one on the Thursday. Conservative Leader Stephen Harper has a motion of no-confidence waiting on the order paper, but he has said he will present the motion only if the NDP has declared support for it in advance.

OMG! This piece of theatre could go on for over a week!

G & M

[fellowtraveller]

Sooner or later, Canada will have to have a true debate on health care, one without girlish shrieks of "privatization" and "Save Medicare".

The vast majority of health services are delivered by the private sector right now and always have been. The only two significant areas of public sector domination are in hospital management (and there are increasing numbers of privately run, publicly financed hospitals across Canada), and the concept of public payment for private health care services.

For example, virtually all doctors, and their staffs, are private sector.

I do not understand why people are objecting to more services provided by private sector. As long as universal access is retained, what's the problem?

I hope our society somehow gains the spine to talk rationally about an issue that affects all of us.

[I Miss Trudeau]

What's this I hear that Layton needs the weekend to study a 5-page document?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm not sure if you've ever had to study a technical document, but there are a lot of things external to the document itself to consider. Issues such as jurisdiction, constitutionality, other currently existing law, etc.

I think rather that both Layton and Martin want this waiting-game to last because it makes them both look good. 

Imagine that! Trying to get something accomplished, rather than "principled" truancy from their job, makes them look good!

There is something truly bizarre about two guys, Ujjal Dosanjh and Jack Layton, negotiating alone the broad framework of Canada's health system. Only in the Soviet Union were such decisions taken in such a way.

Thats right! And whatever the two of them decide over a latte at Starbucks will be passed into law, without consultation or vote, in the commons!

[Canuck E Stan]

Thats right! And whatever the two of them decide over a latte at Starbucks will be passed into law, without consultation or vote, in the commons! rolleyes.gif

Along with the latte, maybe a little bong smoke will help Jack get to page two.

[I Miss Trudeau]

Along with the latte, maybe a little bong smoke will help Jack get to page two.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Doubtful. Bong smoke doesn't seem to be helping you get the point.

[Yodeler]

What's this I hear that Layton needs the weekend to study a 5-page document?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm not sure if you've ever had to study a technical document, but there are a lot of things external to the document itself to consider. Issues such as jurisdiction, constitutionality, other currently existing law, etc.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Layton himself admited that, and I quote ... "It's not apparent on first read how protecting public medicare is obtained here."

Which means that he is either:

1 - playing up to the huge majority of his constituents.

or

2 - he IS as dumb as they are.

[tml12]

Along with the latte, maybe a little bong smoke will help Jack get to page two.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Doubtful. Bong smoke doesn't seem to be helping you get the point.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The mental picture associated with the last few posts is unbelievable.