Scotty Posted April 23, 2015 Report Posted April 23, 2015 I know that I am against a government keeping a promise when it is a stupid promise. All governments make stupid promises. Quote It is an inverted moral calculus that tries to persuade the world to demonize one state that tries its civilized best to abide in a difficult time and place, and rides merrily by the examples and practices of dozens of states and leaderships that drop into brutality every day without a twinge of regret or a whisper of condemnation. - Rex Murphy
WWWTT Posted April 23, 2015 Report Posted April 23, 2015 Are you seriously disputing the existence of the G7? Are you speaking metaphorically? Oh not at all. But it's not what it use to be. The top 7 economies in the world now include Brazil India Russia and of course China. And with the fast rising Indonesia, possibly within 10 years, Germany may no longer be in the top 7! Possibly only two remaining of the original 7, US and Japan will still be in the top 7! WWWTT Quote Maple Leaf Web is now worth $720.00! Down over $1,500 in less than one year! Total fail of the moderation on this site! That reminds me, never ask Greg to be a business partner! NEVER!
WWWTT Posted April 23, 2015 Report Posted April 23, 2015 Come'on buddy, just post the data. Per capita income. I dare you. Lol! Why would I? My debate is Canada isn't doing as well as the conservative propaganda machine claims it is. Unless you believe that being on par with Spain is something to brag about then I think I made my point. WWWTT Quote Maple Leaf Web is now worth $720.00! Down over $1,500 in less than one year! Total fail of the moderation on this site! That reminds me, never ask Greg to be a business partner! NEVER!
eyeball Posted April 23, 2015 Report Posted April 23, 2015 All governments make stupid promises.The problem is the stupid voters who believe them. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Scotty Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) Thats an interesting tirade but a very dishonest reply to Cybercomas post. She was not in any way advocating revolution, she merely stated - and completely accurately I might add - why such programs exist. First of all, that's crap. Second of all, TFSAs are not for the RICH. the RICH don't give a damn about piddling amounts like that. No, his or her attitude is the same as that of the NDP. Everyone who is middle class is actually RICH, and if they complain about taxes then somehow they're robbing the poor of their deserved share of national wealth. That comes from a mentality which says everyone deserves an equal share, which is communism, pure and simple. You don't DESERVE wealth or even a moderate amount. You deserve an opportunity to prosper, but if you squander that opportunity why is that everyone elses fault? How is it if I study hard and work hard and thrive, and you smoke pot and drop out of school and can't be bothered showing up for work it's MY fault you're poor!? And if I complain about the government taking my money and giving it to you I'm in line for a guillotine from those wretchedly poor people who I'm somehow robbing?? Social programs that "apparently" serve the poor are actually there to protect the property rights of the wealthy and to promote political stability. They were conceived by the wealthy and implemented by the wealthy. Not one single politician involved in crafting any of these programs has ever been poor. Then maybe we should do away with them since they only serve the property rights of the wealthy! No more social programs! Edited April 24, 2015 by Scotty Quote It is an inverted moral calculus that tries to persuade the world to demonize one state that tries its civilized best to abide in a difficult time and place, and rides merrily by the examples and practices of dozens of states and leaderships that drop into brutality every day without a twinge of regret or a whisper of condemnation. - Rex Murphy
Scotty Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) We're not talking about the "average" Canadians here. We're talking about programs that have targeted people who have a lot of money already. Those people should be spending. Instead, they're being encouraged to sit on their money. You can save and spend at the same time. It's called investing. And the only way you're going to make any money in a TFSA is to invest that money in something, and I don't mean bonds or GICs. Edited April 24, 2015 by Scotty Quote It is an inverted moral calculus that tries to persuade the world to demonize one state that tries its civilized best to abide in a difficult time and place, and rides merrily by the examples and practices of dozens of states and leaderships that drop into brutality every day without a twinge of regret or a whisper of condemnation. - Rex Murphy
Scotty Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 Thanks for responding to that, but stupid replies that make up a bunch of BS that I never said don't deserve responses. You mean you COULDN'T respond! Your attitude was exactly what I portrayed it as, that the poor are being victimized any time the government allows the middle class to keep even a little of their money! Quote It is an inverted moral calculus that tries to persuade the world to demonize one state that tries its civilized best to abide in a difficult time and place, and rides merrily by the examples and practices of dozens of states and leaderships that drop into brutality every day without a twinge of regret or a whisper of condemnation. - Rex Murphy
dre Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 First of all, that's crap. Second of all, TFSAs are not for the RICH. the RICH don't give a damn about piddling amounts like that. No, his or her attitude is the same as that of the NDP. Everyone who is middle class is actually RICH, and if they complain about taxes then somehow they're robbing the poor of their deserved share of national wealth. That comes from a mentality which says everyone deserves an equal share, which is communism, pure and simple. You don't DESERVE wealth or even a moderate amount. You deserve an opportunity to prosper, but if you squander that opportunity why is that everyone elses fault? How is it if I study hard and work hard and thrive, and you smoke pot and drop out of school and can't be bothered showing up for work it's MY fault you're poor!? And if I complain about the government taking my money and giving it to you I'm in line for a guillotine from those wretchedly poor people who I'm somehow robbing?? None of that seems to have anything to do with what I posted. And you are not robbing ANYONE by being hard working or successful... Thats not the point. The point is those programs are there as much for you as they are for the poor. They are a key component of a stable and prosperous society, and that society is part of the reason its so damn easy to be successful here if youre smart and you try. Then maybe we should do away with them since they only serve the property rights of the wealthy! No more social programs! Or you could just move to a place that doesnt have them and see what life is like there. Taxes are nice and low in Somalia I heard. Guess that means you could make more money there because the government isnt taxing you? Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
eyeball Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 TFSAs are not for the RICH. the RICH don't give a damn about piddling amounts like that.Oh yes they are/do. Concentrating the upper middle classes money into instruments like these will only make it easier for the powerfully rich to grab it all during some financial crisis or another that's been facilitated by 'our' government. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Hydraboss Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) Oh for christs sake...I'm not rich but I couldn't give a damn about 10k a year when it comes to investments. And we're actually only talking about $5000 since it was already at $5500. Got news for you....if another "financial crisis" hits, this paltry amount of money won't mean a bloody thing if I'm losing 20X that in investment fallout. $41,000 since inception. That's it. Not exactly a startling amount now is it? Do you actually think the increase is some kind of "gift" to me? Not even in the least. Now it may benefit my kids soon, but they don't make much (both students) so with any luck they will use the benefit in time. edit->sp Edited April 24, 2015 by Hydraboss Quote "racist, intolerant, small-minded bigot" - AND APPARENTLY A SOCIALIST (2010) (2015)Economic Left/Right: 8.38 3.38 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 3.13 -1.23
msj Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 Another person who doesn't understand compounding.... Try this interesting story for a start: http://www.singularitysymposium.com/exponential-growth.html Quote If a believer demands that I, as a non-believer, observe his taboos in the public domain, he is not asking for my respect but for my submission. And that is incompatible with a secular democracy. Flemming Rose (Dutch journalist) My biggest takeaway from economics is that the past wasn't as good as you remember, the present isn't as bad as you think, and the future will be better than you anticipate. Morgan Housel http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/01/14/things-im-pretty-sure-about.aspx
overthere Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 compounding mattered when savings account interest rates were 7%+. Now investing is all about risk, as in how much of your life savings are you willing to lose? Quote Science too hard for you? Try religion!
eyeball Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 Managing risk is all about trust and accountability. Good luck with those. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
cybercoma Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 By land mass. Should the people of Greenland feel shame about their economic output? The fact that a nation with only 35 million people are in the G7 shows that they are punching way above their weight because of our natural resources. I feel like you're trolling here. Why are you ignoring his point that Canada has been falling in the rankings. Our relative position is declining. It's the movement that he's criticizing, not the rank itself. Quote
cybercoma Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 No, but Mister Trudeau said that it was a known fact that Liberal governments balance the budget while Tory governments run deficits. If Trudeau said that, he's an idiot. However, in the last 25 years that has been true. The Chrétien Liberals were far more fiscally Conservative than the Harper Government™. Quote
cybercoma Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 Then maybe we should do away with them since they only serve the property rights of the wealthy! No more social programs! Maybe we should do away with them, so we can bring that violent revolution to a head a lot faster. Because that's exactly what would happen if there were no more social programs. The elderly eating cat food, the disabled dying in the streets, the poor stealing to survive. You think that would be a good thing? Quote
cybercoma Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 You can save and spend at the same time. It's called investing. And the only way you're going to make any money in a TFSA is to invest that money in something, and I don't mean bonds or GICs. "War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength." Quote
cybercoma Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 You mean you COULDN'T respond! Your attitude was exactly what I portrayed it as, that the poor are being victimized any time the government allows the middle class to keep even a little of their money! The middle class? Have another glass of that Kool-Aid, Scotty. Only 8% of Canadians were maxing out their TFSAs. Only families that are wealthy enough to have a stay at home parent and enough income to split are benefitting from the child credits. You Conservatives crack me up with your lame attempts to redefine wealthy as "middle class." Quote
WWWTT Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 Why are you ignoring his point that Canada has been falling in the rankings. Our relative position is declining. It's the movement that he's criticizing, not the rank itself. Thanks for recognizing the effort I'm trying to make here on this site first off! True that it is alarming to see Canada fall in our competitiveness among the world economies. But it's also disheartening to see Canada at #16 Obviously the yellow brick tax cut road to the promised land is actually the highway to hell! Far from the stairway to heaven that the conservative/liberal philosophy would have us believe! WWWTT Quote Maple Leaf Web is now worth $720.00! Down over $1,500 in less than one year! Total fail of the moderation on this site! That reminds me, never ask Greg to be a business partner! NEVER!
cybercoma Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 Oh for christs sake...I'm not rich but I couldn't give a damn about 10k a year Yeah, well you're sure as hell not the average Canadian if you "couldn't give a damn about $10k a year." That's a third of the median personal income in this country. Quote
Argus Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) The purpose is to create political stability and keep private property rights secure. I don't believe anyone supports social programs for that purpose. Yes and it showed that the results of those needs being completely ignored were either violent revolution, or a progression towards communism or pure socialism. In both cases the property rights of the ownership class were compromised. Not at all. For most of Canada's history, to say nothing of the UK before that, the poor were gven nothing, and were entirely responsible for taking care of their own needs. There was no revolution, no rush to Communism, and no threat to property rights of the 'ownership class'. It's only been since the sixties that we started creating these big, universal social programs, not out of fear but obligation. Edited April 24, 2015 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 Oh yes they are/do. Concentrating the upper middle classes money into instruments like these will only make it easier for the powerfully rich to grab it all during some financial crisis or another that's been facilitated by 'our' government. That's paranoid looniness. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
eyeball Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) That's paranoid looniness. That's pretty much what happened in 2007-8. “the crisis was not a natural disaster, but the result of high risk, complex financial products, undisclosed conflicts of interest; and the failure of regulators, the credit rating agencies, and the market itself to rein in the excesses of Wall Street.” Source Edited April 24, 2015 by eyeball Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
On Guard for Thee Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 The middle class? Have another glass of that Kool-Aid, Scotty. Only 8% of Canadians were maxing out their TFSAs. Only families that are wealthy enough to have a stay at home parent and enough income to split are benefitting from the child credits. You Conservatives crack me up with your lame attempts to redefine wealthy as "middle class." I would just add to that that the 8% who were maxing out the previous TFSAs were people over 55. May as well make the max. a million! Quote
Hydraboss Posted April 24, 2015 Report Posted April 24, 2015 Yeah, well you're sure as hell not the average Canadian if you "couldn't give a damn about $10k a year." That's a third of the median personal income in this country. You're correct that I don't make the "median" income in this country, but I'm also the kind of person that doesn't take vacations and concentrated on paying off my debts. Being debt-free allows people to do silly things - like invest in TFSAs and such. If I wanted the bigger $600k+ house and the ridiculous car payments and $10k vacations every year, I'd be in the same mess as everyone else. My retirement is looked after, but there are so many of you that begrudge that fact and the fact that I plan on getting my kids off to the same start. You don't need to be "rich" to be a smart money manager. You just need a little self control. (by the way, the "median income" in Alberta for 2012 was $94,460 so if you can't save a little when you're making that, it's your own damn fault) http://www.statcan.gc.ca/tables-tableaux/sum-som/l01/cst01/famil108a-eng.htm Quote "racist, intolerant, small-minded bigot" - AND APPARENTLY A SOCIALIST (2010) (2015)Economic Left/Right: 8.38 3.38 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 3.13 -1.23
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