Argus Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 (edited) Isn't capital punishment in the bible ? Are you a biblical scholar? Do you claim to understand what the bible is saying better than the Christian scholars and hierarchies? Edited March 3, 2015 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
On Guard for Thee Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 Are you a biblical scholar? Do you claim to understand what the bible is saying better than the Christian scholars and hierarchies? Isnt capital punishment in the bible. Quote
Michael Hardner Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 Isnt capital punishment in the bible. Killing gays is also in the bible. A lawyer in California wants a ballot initiative to kill the gays... http://sdgln.com/news/2015/03/02/oc-lawyer-wants-kill-all-gays-california-according-initaitive-goal#sthash.L0D8A5U4.dpbs HUNTINGTON BEACH, California – An Orange County lawyer has filed a notice with the State of California that he intends to circulate an initiative measure that would call for the death of anyone who engages in sodomy in the Golden State. Matt McLaughlin, 45, who listed his business address as 19744 Beach Blvd., No. 219 in the Newland Shopping Center in Huntington Beach, CA 92648, filed his notice in late February and it was marked as received on Feb. 26 by the Initiative Coordinator in the California Attorney General’s Office. McLaughlin proposes to kill “sodomites” to prevent God’s “utter destruction” a la Sodom and Gomorrah. - See more at: http://sdgln.com/news/2015/03/02/oc-lawyer-wants-kill-all-gays-california-according-initaitive-goal#sthash.L0D8A5U4.dpuf Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Michael Hardner Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 Are you a biblical scholar? Do you claim to understand what the bible is saying better than the Christian scholars and hierarchies? Not a biblical scholar, just simply reading what's there. Since my question wasn't answered I googled it and got the answer: "yes". Not much scholarship involved there. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
On Guard for Thee Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 Killing gays is also in the bible. A lawyer in California wants a ballot initiative to kill the gays... http://sdgln.com/news/2015/03/02/oc-lawyer-wants-kill-all-gays-california-according-initaitive-goal#sthash.L0D8A5U4.dpbs Now that is downright scary. Meanwhile in Montana, tight clothing has Republicans panting. What next, ...burqas. http://thinkprogress.org/health/2015/02/11/3622045/montana-lawmaker-yoga-pants/ Quote
Argus Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 (edited) Isnt capital punishment in the bible. As I said, a lot of stuff is in the bible. However, Christian scholars and religious figures do not interpret them literally in this day and age. Edited March 3, 2015 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 (edited) Not a biblical scholar, just simply reading what's there. Since my question wasn't answered I googled it and got the answer: "yes". Not much scholarship involved there. Do you think the heads of any of the Christian churches would agree that this is something we should practice? You are equating parables in the bible with actual codified laws from the Koran and associated texts, and it just doesn't work that way. Why is it so difficult for you to agree to the obvious? Islam has a much more sweeping set of rules, laws and procedures than you'll find from any of the Christian orders. There is no Christian version of Sharia law. There is a Jewish version of Islamic family law, but it is generally interpreted much more humanely today. Edited March 3, 2015 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
On Guard for Thee Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 As I said, a lot of stuff is in the bible. However, Christian scholars and religious figures do not interpret them literally in this day and age. So those death chambers in many US prisons are just threats then.... Quote
Argus Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 (edited) So those death chambers in many US prisons are just threats then.... Murder has pretty universally been punishable by death since time began. That's something which crosses all religious, ethnic and national boundaries. Do you think they execute murderers in China because the bible says so? They were executing murderers thousands of years before the advent of Christianity. Edited March 3, 2015 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
On Guard for Thee Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 Murder has pretty universally been punishable by death since time began. That's something which crosses all religious, ethnic and national boundaries. Do you think they execute murderers in China because the bible says so? They were executing murderers thousands of years before the advent of Christianity. And what do you think America uses for justification for maintaining the death penalty. Quote
Argus Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 And what do you think America uses for justification for maintaining the death penalty. I dunno. What do you think China uses? They're officially an atheist country. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
On Guard for Thee Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 I dunno. What do you think China uses? They're officially an atheist country. I know what the US uses. Quote
Argus Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 I know what the US uses. The US which has an official separation between church and state? Islam, by the way, does not conceive of a difference between church and state. In Islam, the state is to oversee the people under Islam, using Islam's laws and abiding by Islam's teachings. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
On Guard for Thee Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 The US which has an official separation between church and state? Islam, by the way, does not conceive of a difference between church and state. In Islam, the state is to oversee the people under Islam, using Islam's laws and abiding by Islam's teachings. You have heard of...an eye for an eye I suppose. It may be a official separation but its often quite vague. Quote
Argus Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 You have heard of...an eye for an eye I suppose. It may be a official separation but its often quite vague. An eye for an eye, if used in any serious way in American law, would require that they do an awful lot of different things to an awful lot of different kinds of criminals. So they don't seem to have used it much. Making the punishment fit the crime is not a Christian idea, by the way. It's about as old as time. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
On Guard for Thee Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 An eye for an eye, if used in any serious way in American law, would require that they do an awful lot of different things to an awful lot of different kinds of criminals. So they don't seem to have used it much. Making the punishment fit the crime is not a Christian idea, by the way. It's about as old as time. But as already pointed out, many times, it is the Christian version the US uses to continue the practice, while so many others have long since abandoned it. Why do you think Europe stopped selling the US the chemicals it was using for lethal injections......which as you may know has led to botched executions. Quote
Argus Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 But as already pointed out, many times, it is the Christian version the US uses to continue the practice, while so many others have long since abandoned it. Why do you think Europe stopped selling the US the chemicals it was using for lethal injections......which as you may know has led to botched executions. Because Europe isn't Christian? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
On Guard for Thee Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 Because Europe isn't Christian? Actual separation of church and state maybe... Quote
Argus Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 (edited) Actual separation of church and state maybe... There is no such history in Europe. You are simply construing the US being Christian as suggesting some sort of Christian law governs the death penalty, and then ignoring the fact so many other Christian countries have no death penalty, not to mention so many other countries which are of other religions or of no religions. I might point out the Catholic Church is steadfastly opposed to the death penalty. Edited March 3, 2015 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
On Guard for Thee Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 There is no such history in Europe. You are simply construing the US being Christian as suggesting some sort of Christian law governs the death penalty, and then ignoring the fact so many other Christian countries have no death penalty, not to mention so many other countries which are of other religions or of no religions. I might point out the Catholic Church is steadfastly opposed to the death penalty. Not ignoring anything, just pointing out what the US uses to justify state murder. BTW, the latest catechism of the catholic church does not oppose the death penalty. Quote
Argus Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 Not ignoring anything, just pointing out what the US uses to justify state murder. BTW, the latest catechism of the catholic church does not oppose the death penalty. You are picking nits. The position of the Church has been clear for some time. http://www.usccb.org/issues-and-action/human-life-and-dignity/death-penalty-capital-punishment/catholic-campaign-to-end-the-use-of-the-death-penalty.cfm Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
overthere Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 Let me clear my throat and work up a big ball of who cares what the Catholic Church thinks on a moral issue. They have abrogated any such right with their actions, so their words ring hollow. Actual separation of church and state maybe... In Europe? No. Several Euro states have constitutional links between a Christian church and the national govt. UK, Norway and Denmark come to mind immediately. And which country has it enshrined in their foundational documents "founded upon principles that recognize the supremacy of God" I'll only give you one guess at that one. It is not the US. Quote Science too hard for you? Try religion!
On Guard for Thee Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 Let me clear my throat and work up a big ball of who cares what the Catholic Church thinks on a moral issue. They have abrogated any such right with their actions, so their words ring hollow. In Europe? No. Several Euro states have constitutional links between a Christian church and the national govt. UK, Norway and Denmark come to mind immediately. And which country has it enshrined in their foundational documents "founded upon principles that recognize the supremacy of God" I'll only give you one guess at that one. It is not the US. Yes, my point was they no longer use it to justify state execution. Quote
nerve Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 (edited) It is genocide and racism. Officials should be ashamed for fashion policing. They should go back to hell and let a tolerant nonsectarian society form where people have the freedom of expression. Courts in Canada are a sham regardless. Thugs and liars. Get the cultural supremicists out of all officiating roles. Enforce the charter in court function! It is hypocracy. All government should be bound to the charter. There is no reason why Catholics must be genocidal. Edited March 3, 2015 by nerve Quote
Michael Hardner Posted March 3, 2015 Report Posted March 3, 2015 Do you think the heads of any of the Christian churches would agree that this is something we should practice? Some Christian churches don't have "heads" they are non-hierarchical. Such religions will have wingnut clerics who should be mostly ignored, such as the Phelps' church. You are equating parables in the bible with actual codified laws from the Koran and associated texts, Codified in law from wingnut countries you mean ? Why is it so difficult for you to agree to the obvious? Islam has a much more sweeping set of rules, laws and procedures than you'll find from any of the Christian orders. The rules don't seem to be different, but the structure of the religion and the prevalence of wingnut countries do I'll admit that. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
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