The_Squid Posted August 7, 2014 Author Report Posted August 7, 2014 It's totally appropriate for cyclists who have the most to lose in a collision with a vehicle. lol I suppose the best way to avoid needing to use any skills ever is to stay home. It just doesn't work that way. And why won't you answer my simple question about who is right/wrong in this particular circumstance? Quote
Wilber Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 So you think the cyclist was in the wrong and the car was in the right? https://maps.google.ca/?ll=49.277696,-123.1313&spn=0.00001,0.006968&t=h&z=18&layer=c&cbll=49.277772,-123.131185&panoid=dhFd9_5eMWrwTvxBncHkhw&cbp=12,278.58,,0,12.96 This is what the car looks at. A large, clear intersection with plenty of space and good visibility to check for cyclists, as the sign says to do. If you look at the video you posted, when the cyclist first comes into view, the driver's right side mirror is completely obstructed by the hedge and periodically obstructed the whole time she ia driving beside it. Quote "Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC
Black Dog Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 If you look at the video you posted, when the cyclist first comes into view, the driver's right side mirror is completely obstructed by the hedge and periodically obstructed the whole time she ia driving beside it. And if you look at the street view, you'd see the "hedge" stops about 10-15 feet from the intersection. Of course, even if we leave that aside, in circumstances where visibility might be impaired, that makes it even more important for the driver to pause and take visual stock of the situation. If you change lanes on the highway and smash into a car in your blindspot, that's on you for relying on your mirrors alone. Quote
The_Squid Posted August 7, 2014 Author Report Posted August 7, 2014 (edited) If you look at the video you posted, when the cyclist first comes into view, the driver's right side mirror is completely obstructed by the hedge and periodically obstructed the whole time she ia driving beside it. You are making excuses that you can't even begin to know are actually correct! Despite the fact that the google street view shows a perfectly good intersection with no obstructions. "the cyclist was doing 20+kph" "The hedges are in the way" "her mirrors are below the hedges" lol your argument has gone from bizarre to simply stupid... And, as BD says, if your view is obstructed (which it clearly was not) you still have to yield! Edited August 7, 2014 by The_Squid Quote
Wilber Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 lol I suppose the best way to avoid needing to use any skills ever is to stay home. It just doesn't work that way. And why won't you answer my simple question about who is right/wrong in this particular circumstance? Who said anything about not using any skills. What skills do you mean? Someone may have the best skills in the world when it comes to controling a bike but be a complete idiot and a menace when they take it on the street. Same goes for drivers. Another old pilot saying for you. There are old pilots and bold pilots, but few old bold pilots. I don't know how a court would rule on this. You are hanging your hat on a yield sign and dismissing everything else. I'm not sure a court would.. Quote "Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC
Wilber Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 You are making excuses that you can't even begin to know are actually correct! Despite the fact that the google street view shows a perfectly good intersection with no obstructions. "the cyclist was doing 20+kph" "The hedges are in the way" "her mirrors are below the hedges" lol your argument has gone from bizarre to simply stupid... And, as BD says, if your view is obstructed (which it clearly was not) you still have to yield! I don't know how fast the cyclist was going. You seem to think it doesn't matter. Her mirror is clearly obscurred in your video. Quote "Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC
Black Dog Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 (edited) Who said anything about not using any skills. What skills do you mean? Someone may have the best skills in the world when it comes to controling a bike but be a complete idiot and a menace when they take it on the street. Same goes for drivers. Another old pilot saying for you. There are old pilots and bold pilots, but few old bold pilots. I don't know how a court would rule on this. You are hanging your hat on a yield sign and dismissing everything else. I'm not sure a court would.. Yes, clearly the cyclist in the video shouldn't have been such a menace by doing something so bold as riding in a straight line in his designated lane. I don't know how fast the cyclist was going. You seem to think it doesn't matter. Her mirror is clearly obscurred in your video. The mirror thing just makes your argument look even worse. As I said above, if your mirror view is obscured, it is your responsibility to ensure it's safe to proceed, not just plow ahead and hope for the best. That goes for all road users. Edited August 7, 2014 by Black Dog Quote
The_Squid Posted August 7, 2014 Author Report Posted August 7, 2014 Yes, clearly the cyclist in the video shouldn't have been such a menace by doing something so bold as riding in a straight line in his designated lane. LOL well said! Quote
Bonam Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 Dude that hedge is way low and you can easily see pedestrians and cyclists through it. Idiots need to shoulder check before turning. What else can really be said here? Quote
Wilber Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 Yes, clearly the cyclist in the video shouldn't have been such a menace by doing something so bold as riding in a straight line in his designated lane. The mirror thing just makes your argument look even worse. As I said above, if your mirror view is obscured, it is your responsibility to ensure it's safe to proceed, not just plow ahead and hope for the best. That goes for all road users. How do you propose that should be done? Put transponders on cyclists, proximity warnings and radar screens in vehicles? Have drivers get out and physically check before they turn? You just think everyone should get out of your way no matter what the circumstances and others should have to look after your safety, without you taking basic precautions yourself. You are the one who just wants to plow ahead and hope for the vest. Anyone with more than three brain cells approaching a turning vehicle from behind, would assume they haven' t been seen. Quote "Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC
Wilber Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 Dude that hedge is way low and you can easily see pedestrians and cyclists through it. Idiots need to shoulder check before turning. What else can really be said here? Dude, watch it in stop action, you can't even see her mirror for a good distance before she starts the turn , and it is completely oscurred by the keep left sign as she starts it. Do you think drivers should spend all their time checking for cyclists in their mirrors or at spend at least some of it looking where they are going. Quote "Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC
Black Dog Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 (edited) How do you propose that should be done? Put transponders on cyclists, proximity warnings and radar screens in vehicles? Have drivers get out and physically check before they turn? Or, you know, turn your head and look out the fucking window. Have you heard of shoulder checking? You just think everyone should get out of your way no matter what the circumstances and others should have to look after your safety, without you taking basic precautions yourself. You are the one who just wants to plow ahead and hope for the vest. I'm all for defensive driving/cycling and being aware. As a cyclist, my knowledge of the generally terrible drivers out there and my own vulnerability makes me far more aware of my surroundings than someone draped in a two ton steel and glass cocoon with air bags, A/C, handsfree cellphones and tunes blasting on the stereo. I expect I'm not alone in that. I'm quite curious about your inability to acknowledge the driver's failures here and your single-minded focus on blaming the (near) victim. Anyone with more than three brain cells approaching a turning vehicle from behind, would assume they haven' t been seen. Should I point out here that if the driver couldn't see the cyclist because of the hedge, it's unlikely the cyclist could see the turn signal? Edited August 7, 2014 by Black Dog Quote
The_Squid Posted August 7, 2014 Author Report Posted August 7, 2014 Do you think drivers should spend all their time checking for cyclists in their mirrors or at spend at least some of it looking where they are going. This has to be the silliest argument I have ever heard for not yielding at a yield sign. Quote
Black Dog Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 (edited) Dude, watch it in stop action, you can't even see her mirror for a good distance before she starts the turn , and it is completely oscurred by the keep left sign as she starts it. Do you think drivers should spend all their time checking for cyclists in their mirrors or at spend at least some of it looking where they are going. If they're turning across a bike lane? Uh. Yes. It's called "being aware of your surroundings". But you'd know that if you weren't more concerned with-ahem-just wanting to plow ahead and hope for the best. Edited August 7, 2014 by Black Dog Quote
Wilber Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 If they're turning across a bike lane? Uh. Yes. It's called "being aware of your surroundings". But you'd know that if you weren't more concerned with-ahem-just wanting to plow ahead and hope for the best. Cyclists need to be aware of their surroundings as well. Plowing ahead and hoping for the best was exactly what that cyclist was doing. He could see that car signaling a turn, just assuming it had seen him and would yield was dumb, dumb, dumb. Quote "Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC
BubberMiley Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 Cyclists need to be aware of their surroundings as well. Plowing ahead and hoping for the best was exactly what that cyclist was doing. He could see that car signaling a turn, just assuming it had seen him and would yield was dumb, dumb, dumb. They cyclist was the only one in that instance that had enough skills to be on the road. He reacted to a total brain fart and avoided a collision. But there are a lot of crappy drivers who don't pay attention to what they're doing and blame hedges and other inanimate objects when they are reckless and irresponsible. Hopefully none of them ever fly airplanes. Quote "I think it's fun watching the waldick get all excited/knickers in a knot over something." -scribblet
Wilber Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 They cyclist was the only one in that instance that had enough skills to be on the road. He reacted to a total $ brain fart and avoided a collision. But there are a lot of crappy drivers who don't pay attention to what they're doing and blame hedges and other inanimate objects when they are reckless and irresponsible. Hopefully none of them ever fly airplanes. Ya, he can ride a bike but he didn't have enough situational awareness to avoid a situation that was possible if not likely. What you guys don't seem to get is that it doesn't really matter whether she had her head up her ass, was being a jerk, or she just couldn't see, the end result is the same. For you it is cyclists are good and drivers are aholes. A simplistic attitude that won't keep you alive. Quote "Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC
Wilber Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 (edited) Back to the hedges. I can see why they want to physically separate bike lanes. But only idiots would do it with shrubs that will grow and eventually obscure vision. Edited August 7, 2014 by Wilber Quote "Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC
BubberMiley Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 Ya, he can ride a bike but he didn't have enough situational awareness to avoid a situation that was possible if not likely. Uh...he avoided it. She was the one without enough situational awareness to even realize that she was breaking the law. The first rule of driving anything is to know what you're entering into. If your vision is obscured by hedges, stop and make sure it's safe to proceed before doing so. No court is going to side with you for driving like an idiot. For you, it is cyclists are aholes and drivers can't be expected to know what's going on around them. A simplistic attitude that will kill those who get in your way. Quote "I think it's fun watching the waldick get all excited/knickers in a knot over something." -scribblet
The_Squid Posted August 7, 2014 Author Report Posted August 7, 2014 Back to the hedges. I can see why they want to physically separate bike lanes. But only idiots would do it with shrubs that will grow and eventually obscure vision. https://maps.google.ca/?ll=49.278001,-123.130842&spn=0.000007,0.006968&t=m&z=18&layer=c&cbll=49.278001,-123.130842&panoid=8ThnF7vKtn9DJABGe1MGhw&cbp=12,243.05,,0,11.78 Really? You can't see over some low shrubs? If it was solid concrete the same height, that would be better? Let's deal with reality here... Quote
Wilber Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 (edited) https://maps.google.ca/?ll=49.278001,-123.130842&spn=0.000007,0.006968&t=m&z=18&layer=c&cbll=49.278001,-123.130842&panoid=8ThnF7vKtn9DJABGe1MGhw&cbp=12,243.05,,0,11.78 Really? You can't see over some low shrubs? If it was solid concrete the same height, that would be better? Let's deal with reality here...[/quote Most highway guard rails aren't more than three feet. Why do you need anything higher? Yes, let's please do deal with some reality here. The object is to make cyclists safer, not invisible to drivers. Edited August 7, 2014 by Wilber Quote "Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC
guyser Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 Wilber, if the biker can see the car...through the hedge as you said he could, then the opposite it true and the driver could see the biker....right? So now what? Quote
Bonam Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 Apparently drivers can't be expected to shoulder check. If it's not in their mirrors, it's fair game! Quote
BubberMiley Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 I think the argument was lost when he refused to say who was in the wrong. Quote "I think it's fun watching the waldick get all excited/knickers in a knot over something." -scribblet
Wilber Posted August 7, 2014 Report Posted August 7, 2014 (edited) Wilber, if the biker can see the car...through the hedge as you said he could, then the opposite it true and the driver could see the biker....right? So now what? The cars mirror was obscured by the hedge, The cyclist was waist level with it and his head was a couple of feet above it. Have you even looked at the video? Edited August 7, 2014 by Wilber Quote "Never trust a man who has not a single redeeming vice". WSC
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