Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 I do, but there are limits to what we accept. It seems like it would be difficult to reconcile with the right to liberty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 I do, but there are limits to what we accept. It seems like it would be difficult to reconcile with the right to liberty. What are your limits that we accept? I am curious to find out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 We have laws against certain religious and cultural practices that violate out society's most central freedoms, rights, and protections. I'm surprised that arranged marriage is not one of those, as it seems completely contrary to the Canadian idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 We have laws against certain religious and cultural practices that violate out society's most central freedoms, rights, and protections. I'm surprised that arranged marriage is not one of those, as it seems completely contrary to the Canadian idea. In case you have forgotten, Canada is a multicultural society. I think you mean 'Smallc's idea'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 Some cultural practices belong in the past. Those that violate the constitution, as arranged marriage would seem to aren't supportable within Canada's multicultural society. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 Some cultural practices belong in the past. I am truly flabbergasted by your strong demands as to what other cultures should practice according to your standards and beliefs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 They aren't just my standards and beliefs. This is what you're defending: http://m.thestar.com/#!/news/redirect/e0036000e698e41d42f644c047f25863 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 But don't take it from me: http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/#!/content/1.963175 It's an archaic and tribal way of thinking. In the poorest communities of South Asia I can understand why people cling to traditional practices no matter how damaging they may be. But what I cannot understand is why middle-class and upper-class South Asians in their native land or abroad still want to do this. If you've received a modern education, gone to school with members of the opposite sex, adopted a Westernized and progressive perspective on most aspects of life, then why should something as fundamental as marriage somehow revert back to some 14th-century ritual? It has come to the point that, when families place advertisements to find suitors for their sons and daughters, they set out a list of criteria that would make you think they were picking out an appliance or a new car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 Thank you for the article. It was very informative. However, I am not talking about 'forced marriages'. I am talking about pre-arranged marriages. There is a big difference. I work in the lower mainland of BC and so I am exposed to plenty of cultures and one of them is the East Indian culture. Now, I admit, there are huge problems with women and their culture, however, I have worked with plenty of east indian women and men who practice 'pre-arranged' marriages. We need to be mindful of the difference between 'forced marriages' and 'pre-arranged marriages'. I am certainly not advocating any situation that would bring harm to a woman in any culture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 What's the difference? Are you telling me that arranged marriages aren't forced on so many because of cultural, religious, and family pressure? How would people who aren't even able to think for themselves be able to even imagine that an arranged marriage isn't what they want? Like the author said, it's a 14th century idea that we abandoned long ago. Not all cultural practices are created equal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 What's the difference? Are you telling me that arranged marriages aren't forced on so many because of cultural, religious, and family pressure? How would people who aren't even able to think for themselves be able to even imagine that an arranged marriage isn't what they want? Like the author said, it's a 14th century idea that we abandoned long ago. Not all cultural practices are created equal. I am speaking from the voice of east indians that I have spoken with who are agreeable to this arrangement, as I have quoted above. Like I said, It is not for me, but it may be appropriate for others, just as the Indian woman who chooses to wait and find a native man to father her children. I am still wondering why you have any business in these personal matters. Maybe they should check in with you first? Is that what you are asking? I still don't understand your disguist in this matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 (edited) Do you not agree that societies, even inclusive multicultural ones, set norms based on what we consider acceptable? You see, you're defending something that seems totally at odds with a free society. In Canada people have the freedom to make their own personal decisions, as protected by the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms through the right to Liberty. Arranged marriage is counter to that, and is only barely tolerated because the Charter also protects religious freedom. Despite it's legality, it's indefensible in a free and democratic society given the principles of such a society. You can't disagree with something that is culturally required. Edited April 24, 2014 by Smallc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Macadoo Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 Do you not agree that societies, even inclusive multicultural ones, set norms based on what we consider acceptable? You see, you're defending something that seems totally at odds with a free society. In Canada people have the freedom to make their own personal decisions, as protected by the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms through the right to Liberty. Arranged marriage is counter to that, and is only barely tolerated because the Charter also protects religious freedom. Despite it's legality, it's indefensible in a free and democratic society given the principles of such a society. You can't disagree with something that is culturally required. You mean like my irish protestant parents who were forced into marriage by their parents over a pregnancy......you mean that culturally superior? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 You mean like my irish protestant parents who were forced into marriage by their parents over a pregnancy......you mean that culturally superior? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 Do you not agree that societies, even inclusive multicultural ones, set norms based on what we consider acceptable? You see, you're defending something that seems totally at odds with a free society. In Canada people have the freedom to make their own personal decisions, as protected by the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms through the right to Liberty. Arranged marriage is counter to that, and is only barely tolerated because the Charter also protects religious freedom. Despite it's legality, it's indefensible in a free and democratic society given the principles of such a society. You can't disagree with something that is culturally required. IF you want to start a thread on pre-arranged marriages, go for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 You mean like my irish protestant parents who were forced into marriage by their parents over a pregnancy......you mean that culturally superior? What about the things that I've said makes you think I'd defend that? That's equally stupid, and equally counter to personal liberty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 IF you want to start a thread on pre-arranged marriages, go for it. I don't really care either way. What I'm showing is that you're a cultural relativist, and that you're okay with a lot of things that...aren't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Macadoo Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 What about the things that I've said makes you think I'd defend that? That's equally stupid, and equally counter to personal liberty. Yet is our "superior" societal norm you're standing behind. If you don't think so, you need to seriously look around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 Yet is our "superior" societal norm you're standing behind. If you don't think so, you need to seriously look around. That isn't a Canadian societal norm, at least not one that most socially progressive people would support. If you think so, looks around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestCoastRunner Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 I don't really care either way. What I'm showing is that you're a cultural relativist, and that you're okay with a lot of things that...aren't. Is that your last word? I have no clue what you mean by this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Macadoo Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 That isn't a Canadian societal norm, at least not one that most socially progressive people would support. If you think so, looks around.You just said 2 divergent statements. You can't have your superior cake and eat it too.Kinda like railing on about family values, and then letting underage alcohol poisoning in their home. Your pollyanic view of "normal society" is admirable as well as incorrect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 What makes you think I'd support religious based culture of any kind? You seem to be ascribing a culture to Canadian society, and it isn't the Canada that most of us are building. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Macadoo Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 What makes you think I'd support religious based culture of any kind? You seem to be ascribing a culture to Canadian society, and it isn't the Canada that most of us are building. Too late, thats the foundation you're proud to build your utopian society on. Yet parents and children organizing marriages prior to sex is against all that is good and holy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted April 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 It's against freedom and liberty, as is the example you gave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted April 24, 2014 Report Share Posted April 24, 2014 If someone is in Canada, they have become part of this social fabric, and we as a society have the right to establish acceptable social norms, while respecting the rights of individuals within that society.What does this even mean? People come to Canada because of its liberty; they can practice their culture and hang onto their heritage while also being Canadian. As long as what they're doing is legal, people can be whomever they want here. That includes hanging onto their cultural identities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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